Avanti have the same issues with the scrolling screens. No urgency to fix them, some have been like it since new.
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Class 810 for East Midlands Railway Construction/Introduction Updates
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jontyasaurus
Member
I saw the same in coach D on 810012 last weekend, hardly inspiring given how new they are...
Dave61
Member
Probably waiting for the 20 minute systems reboot , kind of like when your home computer goes all wonky when it and the screen get all confused and needs a reboot
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
Given not too many negative reports on here over 810 performance over the last week maybe an indication that things maybe at least stabilised now. Maybe with the reduced timetable they should be pushing on with getting more 810s into traffic whilst they still have enough 222s to act as standby.
Merle Haggard
Established Member
Theyse trains have all been 'accepted into service', so Hitachi have no reason or motivation to get them to work properly - they've got the money.
See also (810 ) interior sliding doors that stay open, lavatories that don't work for long, extremely noisy aircond fans, grinding vibration during acceleration.
We'll just have to accept these as situation normal ...
they have paid out of £50 million in payments for late delivery.
They will also be fined daily for failure to provide a set for a diagram, fined for a set which fails in service and fined for sending a train into service that has faults.
So yes they have been paid for the accepted trains, but to say they have no motivation is not true.
Think also of the reputational damage this is doing to Hitachi, it is showing them in a very bad light.
If they want to win future orders it is in Hitachis interest to to get a grip of the EMR fleet and get them to the level that they should have been operating at.
DaveyJones
Member
Surely as the Manufacturer / Maintainer (in some cases) there must be penalty clauses for faults not being fixed?
Is this definitely the case? I know with the IEP provided units it is, but I was under the impression that with EMR it's a standard arrangement, with EMR leasing the stock and maintaining it, albeit they've outsourced the maintenance to another company - Hitachi at the moment. So if stock isn't available or fails, it's no different to if a 222, 170 or 158 had the same problem.
The IEP way of doing things only really works if the organisation being penalised because of issues is also the lesser and gets to specify the amount of stock built, which we know isn't the case with EMR.
I just assumed what I wrote would be the case, but even still if they have out sourced maintenance to hitachi, EMR will issue them with a daily requirement of units. If that is not achieved then Hitachi have failed on there side.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
810017 Merchant Park to Long Marston this morning.
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810018 appears to have suffered a couple of days of issues culminating in failure this morning filling East Mids Parkway with smoke this morning with dragging brakes. Bit of a PR gift to the RMT who are circulating the video around social media.
810018 has disgraced itself at East Midlands Parkway this morning on 1F07, with smoke coming from one of the bogies. Links to the video from the RMT on Facebook and Twitter
www.facebook.com
x.com
2.4K views · 45 reactions | Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair. | National Union of Ra
Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair.
www.facebook.com
RMT (@RMTunion) on X
Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair.
WesternLancer
Veteran Member
- Joined
- 12 Apr 2019
- Messages
- 14,945
posted in error
810018 has disgraced itself at East Midlands Parkway this morning on 1F07, with smoke coming from one of the bogies. Links to the video from the RMT on Facebook and Twitter
2.4K views · 45 reactions | Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair. | National Union of Ra
Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair.
RMT (@RMTunion) on X
Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair.
It would be interesting to know what indications the driver would have had with this if it was dragging brakes, at GWR there have been a few brake issues but never seen one smoke like this and normally they have been picked up by a HABD
Merle Haggard
Established Member
My bold
But are the faults that count only ones that affect it moving and being safe doing so?
My experience, travelling in the CO, was anecdotal I know. The sliding intermediate door was open and when the (friendly) Hitachi fitter passed I asked him about it. After some adjustment, he made it close. The first time it opened, it stayed open again. When I asked him about the grinding heavy vibration as it pulled away from a stop he said 'that's the traction motors'. Neither suggested a solution was in sight or even regarded as required.
Hitachi, in common with other suppliers nationally, have a reputation so low that I wouldn't buy even a paper clip from them. But that's irrelevant to Hitachi as I have no say in whether they are chosen. And wasn't Hitachi's reputation bad - cracking, amongst other things - when the 810s were ordered?
222001
Member
They were ordered in July 2019, and the cracking issue was some point during Covid I believe?
Correct, the 810s would have been planned during the bidding phase and contracts signed with Hitachi upon being confirmed as Franchise winner.
The cracking issue came to light during April 2021, so there’s little way that Hitachi would have known about it until the 800s had spent a few years hammering up and down the GWML and ECML. Their choice of Aluminium and bracket design however…
Realtimes Trains says train cancelled due to problem with traction equipment, but this may not be true.
I've seen a few posts myself, the RMT are all over it.
What is surprising is how quite Aslef appear to be on the subject.
1D54
Established Member
- Joined
- 1 Jun 2019
- Messages
- 1,463
Operated today with 017.
InTheEastMids
Established Member
- Joined
- 31 Jan 2016
- Messages
- 1,382
There was something (and don't ask me to find it!) on here probably 150 pages ago that suggests Hitachi changed possibly the design but definitely the materials (grade of aluminium) to avoid the 810s having the same problems as other derivatives.
Presumably RMT would prefer that brakes failed in the "released" position rather than "applied"?
Not wishing to drag the discussion off topic, and this point has certainly been made before, but without the clarity of hindsight, a souped-up Cl800 looked a lot more deliverable in 2019 than an unproven bimode 125mph Aventra, and a Stadler option that would have needed a 60% increase in output from the power pod(s) without too much compromise on passenger capacity.
Did I miss this, or has there been any information on the nature of work that is going to be done at Long Marston?
Has it been confirmed who has been contracted to do the work?
I thought it was for testing of the units
leomartin125
Member
810018 has disgraced itself at East Midlands Parkway this morning on 1F07, with smoke coming from one of the bogies. Links to the video from the RMT on Facebook and Twitter
2.4K views · 45 reactions | Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair. | National Union of Ra
Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair.
RMT (@RMTunion) on X
Does this train look safe? RMT members working on East Midlands Railway have been taking strike action calling on the train operator to take its faulty fleet of Class 810s out of service for repair.
I thought we had a steam ban on at the moment?
fishwomp
Established Member
It strikes me as unhelpful. They are telling the public the railway is unsafe - whereas I would expect ORR, RSSB, and the HSE to be all over this if that were the case.
It'd also be a bit early to be scoring points.. not knowing the reason for this. Is maintenance and passing out stock as good to go (Etches Park, right?) something that another RMT (TUPE'd over from previous employments) member would have been responsible for.. - I've only seen this as a conductor strike so far, not a maintenance one..? If they are under pressure to cut corners, we should be told..
I’ve seen information stating that brakes were isolated on that vehicle before it proceeded ECS, doesn’t look like coolant to me, far too Smokey rather than steamy, what would be interesting to know is how far it had been driven like that as those brakes can take a lot of abuse
45076
Member
I thought this too. There was talk somewhere of Hitachi being given their marching orders from Old Dalby, not sure how true that is though
Merle Haggard
Established Member
It ran ECS Etches Park to Leicester and then ran in passenger service from there to Etches Park. Nothing noticeable at Leicester or Loughborough, presumably, so not that far
Having once travelled in a BCK with the handbrake on fully on departure, the ride of a coach with the wheels locked is noticeably different and there are other symptoms, so it's surprising to me that on-board staff would not notice.
david.stannard
Member
- Joined
- 20 Apr 2009
- Messages
- 45
From remote monitoring, 810018 seemed to be accelerating on normal full unrestricted power from all four engines when pulling away northbound from Loughborough (the station call before the incident).
Having a loop test track at Long Marston is probably far more useful for iterative fault finding that is now Hitachi's main focus (all certification work done) as it is easier to clock up mileage without the driver needing to change ends every 10 mins. The workshop facilities at Long Marston may also better suit Hitachi's current needs compared to those Old Dalby.
They may be leaving voluntarily and Porterbrook might want an early successful casestudy for their new facility.
jfowkes
Established Member
- Joined
- 20 Jul 2017
- Messages
- 1,265
Can they really gun the engines and get a decent speed up at Long Marston? I wonder if the issue is one that running at 50mph round the Long Marston loop just won't find and that you need to drive it like you would on the mainline. Especially since one known issue with the 810s is heat management.
EDIT: This is all idle speculation on my part, I have no knowledge or any axe to grind,