Northern Short Forming Again

[HamworthyGoods]

So the Yorkshire Flyer service is immaterial if they are just doing to dump nearly 50 year old 150s as replacements for what I presume are faults affecting numerous 195s?

How do cl150s which the production units were built in 1985-87 be classed as nearly 50 years old? My maths makes that some units are around 40 years old and some are still approaching that age.

 

[stra200]

Hasn't the Nottingham Leeds line been 2 car for a long time? Unless I'm just super unlucky when I travel, I don't remember the last time seeing longer trains

 

[lowe1409]

I still feel that the leasing system disincentivises keeping enough rolling stock.

Absolutely. I see no reason why older stock can't be parked up somewhere for when newer units fail to keep a service running or even strengthening certain serviced during bank holidays or busy events.

 

[Mugby]

Hasn't the Nottingham Leeds line been 2 car for a long time? Unless I'm just super unlucky when I travel, I don't remember the last time seeing longer trains

Nottingham - Leeds is 2-car every day except Sundays when it's usually 4-car.

 

[yorksrob]

Absolutely. I see no reason why older stock can't be parked up somewhere for when newer units fail to keep a service running or even strengthening certain serviced during bank holidays or busy events.

This should be possible when you've depreciated the value of your own stock.

Of course, had the 153's been kept on Northern I'd imagine they'd be strengthening services routinely anyway !

 

[Rikki Lamb]

The 1627 Leeds Halifax service is often a two car train these days. It's ridiculous. If they are wanting extra services like the Sheffield Flyer then they should make sure they have enough stock to alleviate the short formations particularly at peak times.

 

[northernchris]

The 1627 Leeds Halifax service is often a two car train these days. It's ridiculous. If they are wanting extra services like the Sheffield Flyer then they should make sure they have enough stock to alleviate the short formations particularly at peak times.

In fairness, the Yorkshire Flyer hasn't run this week. The last few days have been awful though, and it's disappointing Northern aren't reallocating units from other areas to even out the cancellations.

 

[amahy]

Hence inserting 153s instead of binning them off. There are almost certainly more diagrams than just the ones worked by the reformed 150/0s where 2-car is too tight but 4 is over-generous.

Agreed. Rochdale to Clitheroe is a prime example of this, where a 2 car is too short, but 4 cars don’t fit many of the platforms on the route. A 153 + 150 was ideally suited!

 

[Whisky Papa]

Yesterday I was heading home to Todmorden from Manchester Victoria after a social function, unfortunately around the evening peak.

Looking at RTT, I had a choice of four short-formed trains:
2I21 1636 Leeds, a 2-car 158
1J22 1657 Leeds, a 2-car 195
2N91 1703 Blackburn, a 2-cqr 150
1E70 1721 Leeds, a 2-car 195

In fairness, the departures at 1736 and 1757 were both their booked 3-cars, but this was a bit later than I wanted to stay.

I arrived in time for 1J22 with 2N91 in reserve. As 1J22 starts from P1 I could see it wasn't as rammed as I expected and hopped on, happy to stand in the doorway at least until Rochdale.

I was then somewhat surprised when we trundled through Rochdale without stopping, but the lack of any reaction from the other passengers suggested this had been a pre-planned occurrence which I had managed to overlook. In my defence, I was more concerned with my regular gripe of having to go to the manned gate because my B1 code Cheap Day Return is rejected by the gates than looking at the PIS screens.

Assuming this was pre-arranged, is this a regular occurrence if this train is short-formed, does anyone know?

 

[pokemonsuper9]

Assuming this was pre-arranged, is this a regular occurrence if this train is short-formed, does anyone know?

I'm not sure of the frequency since it's not something I frequently check, but it's certainly not the first time I've seen it happen.

They also do the same with Deansgate stops on peak time 3 vice 6 short form Airport-Blackpool services

 

[psmith2023]

Caught a 150 just from Barnsley to Nottingham had graffiti all down the side got swopped at Sheffield for a 195 thankfully but how are northern letting trains go out with graffiti in a morning

 

[amahy]

Caught a 150 just from Barnsley to Nottingham had graffiti all down the side got swopped at Sheffield for a 195 thankfully but how are northern letting trains go out with graffiti in a morning

I would argue that graffiti is just about the least concerning defect that a train can have. I’d rather that than failed air-con, non working WiFi, dirty seats, non working toilets, etc.

 

[skyhigh]

Caught a 150 just from Barnsley to Nottingham had graffiti all down the side got swopped at Sheffield for a 195 thankfully but how are northern letting trains go out with graffiti in a morning

If someone graffitis a train overnight, the option is run the train until it can be swapped out or cancel/short form services.

Assuming this was pre-arranged, is this a regular occurrence if this train is short-formed, does anyone know?

It's marked as a "regional instruction", though I don't know the details. The Rochdale stop appears to have been cancelled at 0719. 1E70 also didn't stop there.

 

[Whisky Papa]

It's marked as a "regional instruction", though I don't know the details. The Rochdale stop appears to have been cancelled at 0719. 1E70 also didn't stop there.

Thanks for your reply, and also to @pokemonsuper9 at #40. Something to watch out for in future, especially on the rare occasion I would be boarding at Rochdale!

I presume the displaced Victoria-Rochdale passengers didn't cause an issue on the 2-car 2N91, which I would have had to use if I'd been a few minutes later. I am still unconvinced about the need for the Smithy Bridge and Littleborough calls on 1J22 given 2N91 also calls a few minutes later, but that's another matter.

And of course, I'm hugely grateful the meeting was on Wednesday, not yesterday...