EMR Class 222’s - declining reliability

[Amos390]

Freighliner or Heavy Haul? They are two different entities.

Think it’s Heavy Haul, not 100% though

 

[Transport101]

Do we know roughly how many 222s/810s are stuck

 

[liamf656]

Do we know roughly how many 222s/810s are stuck

017/103 and 810012 currently (007/015 returned to Derby)

 

[Spartacus]

Or even just run a sole 222 operated service and try and bin the very unreliable 810s for a week- pretty much every day an 810 fails in service, give them some time to sort them out.

The 222s aren't exactly in great health at the moment either, I was beginning to wonder if there was much between the two....

 

[222001]

Seems reliability has sunk to a new low, with only 11 222s in service as I type (it should be 17). There are also only 4 810s in service at the moment too, resulting in many cancellations, especially on the Nottingham route.

 

[Russel]

Seems reliability has sunk to a new low, with only 11 222s in service as I type (it should be 17). There are also only 4 810s in service at the moment too, resulting in many cancellations, especially on the Nottingham route.

Could EMR arrange to send 222's down to Central Rivers for maintenance and repair since it's only a few miles away?

It seems like EMR have got themselves into a position that was entirely predictable yet almost totally avoidable...

 

[liamf656]

Could EMR arrange to send 222's down to Central Rivers for maintenance and repair since it's only a few miles away?

It seems like EMR have got themselves into a position that was entirely predictable yet almost totally avoidable...

They certainly used to make use of Central Rivers. Not sure when that stopped but I believe it's when Hitachi took over the maintenance, so it's definitely been a few years

 

[Russel]

They certainly used to make use of Central Rivers. Not sure when that stopped but I believe it's when Hitachi took over the maintenance, so it's definitely been a few years

I remember them using it years ago too.

Odd choice, almost self defeating.

 

[InTheEastMids]

Seems reliability has sunk to a new low, with only 11 222s in service as I type (it should be 17). There are also only 4 810s in service at the moment too, resulting in many cancellations, especially on the Nottingham route.

Looked absolutely dreadful - I sometimes have a look at STP departures to get a feel about how it's all going. The Nottingham route was carnage as you implied with 6/10 cancelled between 1pm and 6pm. Then there was a nearly-90 minute gap with no IC departures at all between the 1805 and the 1905 (which left around 30 mins late). Nothing to suggest this was anything other than train availability.

Not looking to clever today with the 1732 Sheffield already cancelled, plus 1735, 1835 and 1902 all being 5 cars rather than 10. Although I guess it will be reduced commuting/business demand on a Friday.

 

[Andy Pacer]

Plenty of 222s parked up at Etches Park this afternoon, including the infamous 222007.

Currently on 222015 with, apparently, an air conditioning fault in coach D and only one working toilet on board.

 

[rmHawk765]

Does anyone know why exactly the 810s are so unreliable? No other 80x has had this many issues - yes, the 805s continue to suffer running without all the engines on, but they don't get pulled from service every other day or whatever.

 

[222001]

Does anyone know why exactly the 810s are so unreliable? No other 80x has had this many issues - yes, the 805s continue to suffer running without all the engines on, but they don't get pulled from service every other day or whatever.

Usually problems with doors - the latest delivery (810022) has apparently had mods, and it hasn't failed yet, so hopefully things will get better. There are currently 6/6 810 diagrams covered today, and 14/17 222 diagrams, which is certainly better than yesterday.

 

[InTheEastMids]

Does anyone know why exactly the 810s are so unreliable? No other 80x has had this many issues - yes, the 805s continue to suffer running without all the engines on, but they don't get pulled from service every other day or whatever.

You might get a bit more joy if you post that in the 810 thread, there's a number of comments from people with varying degrees of information. The doors do seem to be the biggest troublespot at the moment.

Class 810 for East Midlands Railway Construction/Introduction Updates

Brilliant, that’s now 11/33 accepted. I'd say 10 just on the basis that T15 will have set everything back by a unit in the long term

www.railforums.co.uk

I would say that having EMR's reliability woes spread across two threads does risk missing the picture from the customers' perspective (they mostly want the train to run on time etc...) and whether it's an 810 or a 222 is probably a secondary consideration.

 

[londonmidland]

This afternoon's 1F50 (810222) had issues between Derby and Chesterfield and ended up terminating at Chesterfield 41 late.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C21763/2026-07-03

I’m on the train which ‘rescued’ pax from the cancelled 17:40 ex Sheffield to St Pancras service. Formed of 222101.

No surprise that this service is now overcrowded, with it carrying two train loads of people.

It has some issues with it - a blocked sink means very limited first class service and the air-con isn’t working in coach B.

 

[43074]

222007 failed at Leicester working the 11:35 Sheffield to London earlier

For balance, 810016 on the 1250 Nottingham to London had water dripping from the air con in coach B!

 

[londonmidland]

810006 has stepped up for a failed 222 at Derby, although that itself seems to be delayed at Derby, due to 'a fault on this train'.

It is working the 15:09 from Derby to London St Pancras (if it even manages to depart from Derby)

EDIT: Train now cancelled due to a problem with the brakes.

 

[222001]

Really not a great day again. 12/17 222s in service, and 5/6 810s (if 810022 comes out later). Meanwhile Lumo are using all 3 of their available 222s today, no problem at all!

 

[londonmidland]

222013 has now failed just outside of St. Pancras, working the 16:32 to Sheffield.

 

[CR165022]

222013 has now failed just outside of St. Pancras, working the 16:32 to Sheffield.

Is being rescued by 222009

 

[Trainman40083]

Could EMR arrange to send 222's down to Central Rivers for maintenance and repair since it's only a few miles away?

It seems like EMR have got themselves into a position that was entirely predictable yet almost totally avoidable...

When Bombardier operated the depot at Etches Park, they would send unit down to Central Rivers. Now Etches Park is Hitachi, they would not send them to Central Rivers.

 

[ChrisC]

It’s now looking like the next four trains from Nottingham to St. Pancras have been cancelled with only one train still running this evening at 2125.

 

[JonathanH]

It’s now looking like the next four trains from Nottingham to St. Pancras have been cancelled with only one train still running this evening at 2125.

Next six trains from Leicester southbound are cancelled, let alone the next three from Nottingham. I think the stock for the 2050 from Nottingham to St Pancras (222019) has just arrived in Nottingham, but guess the delay could be staff displacement.

The northbound working for the 2125 from Nottingham has been stopped at West Hampstead Thameslink for the last 20 minutes. A following Corby train (1Y55 1915 St Pancras International to Corby) and the following Sheffield appear to have just used the non-platform lines to go past.

 

[marshlinker]

Friday peak commuter trains are much quieter.

When I head north on football trips if your choosey there's always mml trains with dirt cheap advances even at the last minute, generally from first thing until just before 3. Unless there's been disruption it's unusual for one of these trains to be more than 25 to 50% full leaving London mon to Fri. in my experience.

 

[londonmidland]

The departure screen from Leicester shows multiple cancellations, including the next six services to London St. Pancras.

 

[JonathanH]

The EMR journey check suggests that the 1905 from St Pancras to Nottingham was cancelled at West Hampstead Thameslink with the 1935 calling additionally to pick up the stranded passengers.

However, 1D71 (1905) now showing as moving, so presumably the issue waa resolved

 

[Russel]

When Bombardier operated the depot at Etches Park, they would send unit down to Central Rivers. Now Etches Park is Hitachi, they would not send them to Central Rivers.

I know, but this is why companies subcontract work.

If you can't or don't have the capacity to do the work yourself, you pay someone else to do it.

 

[Trainman40083]

I know, but this is why companies subcontract work.

If you can't or don't have the capacity to do the work yourself, you pay someone else to do it.

I do wonder if they are on a performance related contract.. Penalties of not enough trains for service.

 

[DannyMich2018]

Really poor show. I'm so glad I don't travel to Kettering weekly now. Something needs to be done about the poor performance. Maybe even an emergency timetable?
Next week sees another heatwave so things will only potentially get worse.....

 

[222001]

Really poor show. I'm so glad I don't travel to Kettering weekly now. Something needs to be done about the poor performance. Maybe even an emergency timetable?
Next week sees another heatwave so things will only potentially get worse.....

Indeed, an emergency timetable might give a chance to catch up on maintenance. It's been another bad day today, with 222006/222013/222103 (and 810022) all failing.

 

[jfowkes]

222016 started 6L at St Pancras and has slowly lost time since then. Currently patiently waiting for it at Kettering.

Edit: I'm not a master at interpreting RTT but I don't think there is/was anything in front of it to slow it down.