Does the UK have a "premier" main line?

[Sorcerer]

Something else I think should be noted is that despite the historical prestige we saw with some East Coast Main Line rolling stock, I believe some of Beeching's recommendations for development of major trunk routes would mean that all London-Scotland traffic would be funneled along the West Coast Main Line while the east would stop short at Newcastle. This never happened of course, but it is somewhat reflected by the original HS2 service plans before the Y-shape was butchered into what it is today where all Scotland trains ran up the west coast.

Given that “premier” means “first in rank” what about the Elizabeth Line (also nicely named after a Head of State)?

It might even have more journeys than any of the other candidates.

The Elizabeth Line might be premier by the standards of a London commuter line, but it's not exactly a backbone of the nation's railway compared to something like the WCML which connects the most major metropolitan areas and population centres along with carrying almost half the UK's rail freight traffic.

Thank you - that’s saved me a hour or two tonight!

You're very welcome! Always a pleasure to get people caught up on Railway Series lore!

 

[Uncle Buck]

The scenery (particularly in the Lakes) you get on a Pendo is significantly better as well.

I would say that the ECML has a 'glamour' aura, WCML has a 'workhorse' aura. Which one you pick as the "premier" probably depends on how you view those auras.

London to Edinburgh via Durham has very annoying tickets, but some wonderful views. London to Glasgow via Shap also has annoying tickets, and trains with horrible windows. London to Channel Tunnel has distressing tickets, no views, and much misery at a hideous shopping mall falsely trading as a railway station. London to Penzance via Bristol was and is God's Wonderful Railway.

The WCML has impressive scenery in the Lake District, but otherwise lacks charm, which both the ECML and GWML have in abundance, running through picturesque towns and cities and attractive countryside.

 

[styles]

Waterloo to Bank.

 

[OscarH]

On board service is in my experience pitched at a slightly higher level

I think I've got to disagree with this, at least for 1st class, there's very few "Dine" trains these days, whereas Avanti offers hot food on most services still

 

[Adam Williams]

ECML and GWML have in abundance, running through picturesque towns and cities

✅ Peterborough

I jest, but e.g. Coventry on the WCML isn't much better. For some reason they forgot to knock down the old part when they were building the new station building & car park.

 

[norbitonflyer]

The London and North Western Railway styled itself as ‘The Premier Line’, partly out of arrogance and partly because one of its constituents was the London and Birmingham Railway which was arguably the first long distance railway in the world.

The LNWR heritage made "Premier" Line one of the (rejected) sugggstions for what became the Lioness Line.

I still rather like the Regency Line for the H&C (as it shadows the canal, and passes Regents Park)

 

[The exile]

You're very welcome! Always a pleasure to get people caught up on Railway Series lore!

Where would we be without it. Apparently the first proof that I could read came when I managed “Duncan was stuck at the far end of the tunnel” from whichever volume it was I had been given that day as a birthday present! (3rd - just to show off!!!)

 

[MichaelTrains]

ECML takes this one for me.

 

[brad465]

Maybe not "premier", but the Great Western mainline seems to have tried to be just by way of having "Great" in its name, which neither the ECML or WCML have done. It does boast a very high flow between Reading and London of 2.2m passengers, and Oxford-Paddington of 1.4m, and perhaps crucially for trying to be "premier", the Pullman dining service.

 

[Uncle Buck]

✅ Peterborough

I jest, but e.g. Coventry on the WCML isn't much better. For some reason they forgot to knock down the old part when they were building the new station building & car park.

Even Peterborough has a Gothic cathedral. Then there is York, Durham, Newcastle and Edinburgh. Meanwhile on the Great Western you pass Windsor Castle and pass through Bath.

 

[pokemonsuper9]

Maybe not "premier", but the Great Western mainline seems to have tried to be just by way of having "Great" in its name, which neither the ECML or WCML have done. It does boast a very high flow between Reading and London of 2.2m passengers, and Oxford-Paddington of 1.4m, and perhaps crucially for trying to be "premier", the Pullman dining service.

However 'Greater' Anglia clearly aim for higher

 

[quantinghome]

As for CrossCountry, I'd argue it's not really a main line because a good chunk of the network uses the existing main lines and rarely if ever has a dedicated trunk route.

Technically the NE-SW cross country route is the original Midland main line. Derby to London is a mere branch line.

I'd argue TransPennine qualifies more because it's at least got a proper trunk route from Liverpool/Manchester to Leeds/York.

Although it was originally developed by a single company (mostly) I get the sense the route was kind of cobbled together rather than feeling like a proper trunk route. It doesn't have a consistency to it - perhaps due to the widely varying geography which constrains it.

 

[Sorcerer]

Technically the NE-SW cross country route is the original Midland main line. Derby to London is a mere branch line.

Fair enough then, today I learned.

Although it was originally developed by a single company (mostly) I get the sense the route was kind of cobbled together rather than feeling like a proper trunk route. It doesn't have a consistency to it - perhaps due to the widely varying geography which constrains it.

To be fair part of the route would be the original Liverpool to Manchester line which, which though technically conceived as intercity may not have been envisioned as part of a wider network to Leeds and York.

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Where would we be without it. Apparently the first proof that I could read came when I managed “Duncan was stuck at the far end of the tunnel” from whichever volume it was I had been given that day as a birthday present! (3rd - just to show off!!!)

I can think of no better place to start learning to read!

 

[318266]

It depends on how you define prestige I suppose. From a "someone who has to occasionally book transport for wealthy American family from Glasgow to London" perspective, I would certainly refer to them to LNER and the East Coast Main Line, which has a decent modern 1st class interior (from a non-enthusiast POV), over the West Coast Main Line and whatever Avanti is trying to be this week.

 

[DarloRich]

East Coast. Close thread. No further discussion required

 

[Purple Train]

In answer to the question, no it doesn't - there are too many runners and riders to pick one and good reasons for each to make a claim.

 

[AlterEgo]

The East Coast is the premier line because it directly connects London and Edinburgh.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Even Peterborough has a Gothic cathedral. Then there is York, Durham, Newcastle and Edinburgh. Meanwhile on the Great Western you pass Windsor Castle and pass through Bath.

And Wakefield

Not to mention Lincoln, which is visible on the skyline from the ECML in the Retford/Tuxford area

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Maybe not "premier", but the Great Western mainline seems to have tried to be just by way of having "Great" in its name, which neither the ECML or WCML have done.

So does Great Northern

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(Also it was Gordon who was about to get a run into London in the book. He argued it was King's Cross, Duck argued it was Paddington, while an Other Railway engine argued it was Euston. In the end Gordon ended up at St. Pancras).

in "The Eight famous Engines". Gordon's express goes to London, normally with a change of loco at the junction with the Other Railway, but on this occasion an engine from the Other Railway is derailed at the depot, trapping everything stabled there, so Gordon has to take the train all the way to London

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

The East Coast is the premier line because it directly connects London and Edinburgh.

The WCML route to Edinburgh could match the ECML with direct trains in similar times if DfT/GBR chose to do that.
In fact they almost did that twice: once in the 1970s with the "Euston only for the north" plan.
And again with the wider HS2 plans with the main Scotland services transferred to the WCML.
In fact HS2b would have downgraded all three current main lines north from London.

At one time (1840s) the WCML route (LNWR to Carlisle and Caledonian beyond) was planned as the sole route to Scotland.

St Pancras-Paris/Brussels (HS1/Channel Tunnel/LGV Nord) counts as a pretty good premier line, if you are considering speed and "aura".

Personally, going at 125mph full-tilt through Rugby (and many other places on the WCML) in a Pendolino beats anything the ECML can offer.

 

[AndrewE]

The WCML has impressive scenery in the Lake District, but otherwise lacks charm, which both the ECML and GWML have in abundance, running through picturesque towns and cities and attractive countryside.

What??? Apart from a few nice views like Durham cathedral and the sea N of Berwick - if you are sat on the right side and know when to look out for it - I find the ECML almost unremittingly dreary.

The WCML on the other hand has lots of views of canals almost all the way from London to Carlisle Oxenholme, Berkhamstead Castle (joke - if you know when and where to look for it,) the Trent valley with nice agricultural views and Cannock Chase, then Crewe yards and the Weaver viaducts, the mixed towns and countryside of Lancashire, Morecambe Bay and then distant views of the Lake district and the Lune Gorge right by the railway. Over the Solway, on up Beattock through the Lowther Hills and then views across to Leadmills and the rest Upper Clydesdale before a beautiful run down the river to Carstairs.
For us it is usually then a nice rural ride to Edinburgh, with the 3 Forth Bridges (and the canal aqueduct) to look out for before getting in to Auld Reekie. A journey to enjoy throughout, even without the pleasure of what we are travelling for...

And for the operating railway interest, it is undoubtedly the premier line: 4-track most of the way to Preston carrying dense suburban services near London as well as all the rest, then a heavily-used mixed-traffic railway north of Rugby all the way to Carstairs and Motherwell...

 

[Parallel]

I’d probably go with East Coast, then West Coast and then Great Western, for the same reasons others have suggested.

 

[Russel]

The East Coast is the premier line because it directly connects London and Edinburgh.

As long as you don't try to use it on the not infrequent days when the service collapses.

 

[Magrar]

It's the East Coast. It's not even debatable.

It's the fastest, it connects the two capitals of the "Union", and it has the most famous trains.

In addition to the two terminii, it has York and Durham as mere stops. That makes it the UK's premier mainline on tourism and higher education grounds alone.

It has Doncaster, Darlington and Newcastle, whose places in railway history needs no explanation.

Even if that wasn't enough (it is), the scenery on the part that actually runs along the east coast is the match of any other UK main line. And no other line in the UK has anything to rival running alongside the sheer granite base of a volcano with a world famous castle atop it.

 

[godfreycomplex]

I am very much team West Coast on this. It connects five major cities and has the most passengers, the most traffic, the most social relevance, a the most history. The East Coast has had very good PR over its history (which the West Coast has largely eschewed in favour of getting on with the job in hand), but the hard fact is it’s the country’s fifth busiest main line connecting (mostly) a series of medium sized provincial towns

The Western is busier but limited in scope. The South Western and Brighton mainlines are busier and more impressive operations but they’re quite short.

 

[Magrar]

The logical extension of this thread....

Does the UK have a "premier" main line?

In light of a discussion emerging in a previous thread, I thought it would be worth it's own discussion. Do you think the British railway network has a "premier" main line, as in one that's the most prestigious or the flagship trunk route in the UK? I think just because of the amount of trunk...

www.railforums.co.uk

If aliens landed tomorrow, and asked to ride on our premier railway line, where are you directing them to park their spaceship?

Which line is the flagship, the most prestigious?

Obviously the aliens have already made it clear they intend the scope of the question to only refer to the proper railway, and only those parts of it with regular passenger trains for ordinary folk and ordinary alien tourists. Ergo, none of the heritage, industrial or light/small stuff. They're surprisingly knowledgeable of such things, for aliens.

I think there's only a handful of contenders, and I think you'll spot the common trait....

The Fife Circle Line
The Settle-Carlisle Line
The Cornish Main Line

 

[marshlinker]

1. HS1
2. GWML including Elizabethan branches
3. Brighton (Thameslink) ML including branches to Peterborough, Cambridge & Bedford.
4.WCML

 

[Magrar]

I am very much team West Coast on this. It connects five major cities and has the most passengers, the most traffic, the most social relevance, a the most history. The East Coast has had very good PR over its history (which the West Coast has largely eschewed in favour of getting on with the job in hand), but the hard fact is it’s the country’s fifth busiest main line connecting (mostly) a series of medium sized provincial towns

The Western is busier but limited in scope. The South Western and Brighton mainlines are busier and more impressive operations but they’re quite short.

I'm loving the idea that the WCML is eshewing the limelight in favour of just getting on with the job.

Sort of like how Preston North End have been eschewing the Premier League in favour of just getting on with football...

 

[Nym]

Thameslink or Crossrail…

 

[Class83]

I think I've got to disagree with this, at least for 1st class, there's very few "Dine" trains these days, whereas Avanti offers hot food on most services still

Avanti provision of food and drink, hot or otherwise is poor north of Preston in my experience, it's as much waiting forever for service as what is provided, though they also often declare working day's weekends/bank holidays as they're vaguely near Christmas or new year.

LNER are just much more attentive with service.

 

[Trainguy34]

My head immediately went to XR, but I feel like Cornwall, Ribblehead or perhaps the West Highland Line would be suitable aswell.