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South Wales 'Metro' updates

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22 Jun 2013
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TfW have announced today the following temporary changes due to hot weather!

They are:

Pontypridd - Cardiff Bay services will not run after 1326 (no specific date given) until Saturday 27th June.

Coryton – Cardiff – Penarth: Monday 22nd June to Saturday 27th June
  • Services will run every 30 minutes between Coryton and Heath Low Level.
  • For services into Cardiff change at Heath Low Level and use services from Heath High Level.
  • Penarth – Coryton services will not run.
  • Penarth services will be reduced to two services per hour, to and from Caerphilly only.
  • Rail tickets accepted on Cardiff Bus service 92, 93, &94. No rail replacement service.
Presumably the Coryton branch changes are due to a fear that the points at Heath Junction will not be reliable in the forecasted hot weather.

The problem for passengers transferring from Heath Low Level to Heath High Level is that the platform for services into Cardiff is only accessible by a staircase. Anybody with mobility issues will not be able to access the platform.
The hottest forecast is 31 degrees on Thursday next week, doesn't seem crazy hot to me, how strange. Will the Bay shuttle be increased to 4 tph from Queen Street in the afternoons?
 
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56xx

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They’ve actually already started work on this I think - the CSL has included the stairs and lift as provision for one side of the footbridge ever since it was built, and there have been contractors furnishing the room where the stairs and the lift are with railings and interior fittings for about two months now.
Work has indeed started on the East side foundations with considerable activity in the last week.
 

snalty

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A 150 is doing the Coryton shuttle today instead of the 756 that was doing it yesterday. Glad I don’t need to get it today!
 

Coleridge

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A 150 is doing the Coryton shuttle today instead of the 756 that was doing it yesterday. Glad I don’t need to get it today!
So it looks like the points at Heath can be used when TfW needs to reposition empty stock, but not when passengers want to get anywhere. :)
 

John R

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So it looks like the points at Heath can be used when TfW needs to reposition empty stock, but not when passengers want to get anywhere. :)
Well in the evening or morning the temperatures are lower, so there is no problem.
 

edwin_m

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So it looks like the points at Heath can be used when TfW needs to reposition empty stock, but not when passengers want to get anywhere. :)
They only have to operate them twice in the morning and twice more in the evening, instead of twice for every train going to or from Coryton. With fewer operations there's less chance of them going wrong.
 

Coleridge

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Well in the evening or morning the temperatures are lower, so there is no problem.
Well, quite. Many of the services that have been pre-emptively cancelled would have run in the early morning, when the temperature is around 20 degrees, and in the late evening.

But rather than make an effort to identify the times between which the track will meet an acceptable level of reliability and run a service for passengers to use, TfW, typically, just cancels everything. That's their way.

Does anyone know whether TfW has made arrangements for passengers from the Coryton branch who are unable to walk unaided from the low level to the high level platforms? One platform has a steep ramp and the other is accessible only by climbing 40 steps.
 

AdamWW

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Well, quite. Many of the services that have been pre-emptively cancelled would have run in the early morning, when the temperature is around 20 degrees, and in the late evening.

But rather than make an effort to identify the times between which the track will meet an acceptable level of reliability and run a service for passengers to use, TfW, typically, just cancels everything. That's their way.

On the up-side, they have managed to get posters up about the revised arrangements on the Coryton line as well as having staff at both Heath stations to guide people between them and hand out water at Low Level.

And in fact the Coryton service does run through in the late evening.

Maybe they could have got away with through services for the morning peak as well though.
 

5021

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On the up-side, they have managed to get posters up about the revised arrangements on the Coryton line as well as having staff at both Heath stations to guide people between them and hand out water at Low Level.

And in fact the Coryton service does run through in the late evening.

Maybe they could have got away with through services for the morning peak as well though.
Meanwhile TfW have spotted the opportunity of reduced services to introduce the tram trains to the public on a half day diagram from yesterday 23/6/2026 and scheduled until Friday 26th. One 398 is working the Cardiff Bay departures at 07.26, 08.56, 10.26 and 11.56 to Queen St and 07.38, 09.08,10.38 and 12.08 to Pontypridd and return. All have run to time so far.
 

AdamWW

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Meanwhile TfW have spotted the opportunity of reduced services to introduce the tram trains to the public on a half day diagram from yesterday 23/6/2026 and scheduled until Friday 26th. One 398 is working the Cardiff Bay departures at 07.26, 08.56, 10.26 and 11.56 to Queen St and 07.38, 09.08,10.38 and 12.08 to Pontypridd and return. All have run to time so far.

They certainly have been running a 398 but I don't think it has anything to do with the reduced services. They've been running in a normal path and I think this was planned before the need for service reductions due to the weather was known.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

The hottest forecast is 31 degrees on Thursday next week, doesn't seem crazy hot to me, how strange.

Unfortunately it doesn't have to be "crazy hot" for the points at Heath Junction to pack in.
 
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Got the Heath LL shuttle from Rhiwbina today. There seemed to be a few TfW staff around to guide people. Unfortunately, once we got to platform 2 at Heath High Level, there were many delays. The Bridgend and Penarth trains were both shown as late, and then further delayed, on the PIS. The announcements were also updating everyone similarly. Both trains ended up running fast past the station, despite the promise of trains stopping. Zero information about this to passengers.
The platform was packed and it was one of the hottest days of the year. This is atrocious management from TfW and it makes Arriva look like professionals in comparison. Completely disgusted and there were many passengers comparing TfW unfavourably to BR.
There is zero communication, this is so, so bad.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

They certainly have been running a 398 but I don't think it has anything to do with the reduced services. They've been running in a normal path and I think this was planned before the need for service reductions due to the weather was known.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==



Unfortunately it doesn't have to be "crazy hot" for the points at Heath Junction to pack in.
So why is this not being fixed?
 

crZiller

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Poor communication during disruption is avoidable and makes the situation needlessly more stressful.

To be fair to TFW, there was general advice yesterday (and today) to avoid travel. Disruption was inevitable.

Arguably they’ve done pretty well overall with proactive timetable alterations.
 

5021

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They certainly have been running a 398 but I don't think it has anything to do with the reduced services. They've been running in a normal path and I think this was planned before the need for service reductions due to the weather was known.

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Unfortunately it doesn't have to be "crazy hot" for the points at Heath Junction to pack in.
On Monday the Cardiff Bay service was Queen Street shuttles only and shown in Realtime Trains as remaining so all week. RTT was only updated at some point on Tuesday. There have been similar short notice changes to the overnight test runs in the last couple of weeks. Granted RTT isn't always gospel by any means, but this surprisingly low key introduction to service does look like a snap decision based on favourable circumstances. Surely there would have been a fanfare from TfW if it had been preplanned well in advance?
 

AdamWW

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On Monday the Cardiff Bay service was Queen Street shuttles only and shown in Realtime Trains as remaining so all week. RTT was only updated at some point on Tuesday. There have been similar short notice changes to the overnight test runs in the last couple of weeks. Granted RTT isn't always gospel by any means, but this surprisingly low key introduction to service does look like a snap decision based on favourable circumstances. Surely there would have been a fanfare from TfW if it had been preplanned well in advance?

Have a look at the 398 thread. You'll see that the plan to run a 398 this week was mentioned the previous week, with subsequent discussion over whether given the forecast heat they would postpone it.
From that thread it looks as if there were 398 diagrams in place in advance for this week. Presumably they got overwritten by the temporary timetable.

And the lack of fanfare is, I believe, because they prefer a "soft launch" without publicity, presumably to avoid embarassment if it doesn't go according to plan. (Which seems entirely sensible to me).
If I remember correctly they did a similar thing with 231s and 756s too.
 

5021

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Have a look at the 398 thread. You'll see that the plan to run a 398 this week was mentioned the previous week, with subsequent discussion over whether given the forecast heat they would postpone it.
From that thread it looks as if there were 398 diagrams in place in advance for this week. Presumably they got overwritten by the temporary timetable.

And the lack of fanfare is, I believe, because they prefer a "soft launch" without publicity, presumably to avoid embarassment if it doesn't go according to plan. (Which seems entirely sensible to me).
If I remember correctly they did a similar thing with 231s and 756s too.
Many thanks for this, very helpful. I hadn't previously spotted that thread buried amongst the others categorised as "speculative discussion" which I'm afraid I tend to avoid on a life's too short basis! Yes I'm sure you're right about previous soft launches but I'd thought that the first public tram train working would be considered more of a landmark event. TfW often trumpet such things afterwards and maybe the current "do not undertake any non essential travel" advice has delayed that too. But the first mention of it happening this week looks to have been last Thursday (18th) when the hot weather was already being forecast. The TfW contact who first alerted me to it suggested that the likely reduction in punters may actually have encouraged them to go ahead this week and I still support that view unless anyone has first hand knowledge to the contrary.
 

positron

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Any ideas on the progress of the bay line works? Do we know if the electrification still needs more work or is there another reason trains haven't been using the bay wires last week?

On another note has anyone heard about plans for the further engineering works up the end of the rhymney line? As I understand it they still need to extend a passing loop and add a second platform at Rhymney?
 

AdamWW

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Yes I'm sure you're right about previous soft launches but I'd thought that the first public tram train working would be considered more of a landmark event.

Fascinating. I look at it the other way round - if you don't like risking public launches that might go wrong, the higher profile it is the more reason not to take that risk.

There doesn't seem to be any official announcement about it even after the event, though there was someone going down the train interviewing passengers on the first day. (I'm pretty sure they were from TfW and not a random YouTuber...)

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Does anyone know why they have quietly carried on with the reduced Cardiff Bay to Pontypridd service introduced last week allegedly due to the hot weather?

I can't find any mention of it as a service disruption or Metro service change on the TfW web site.
 
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enapace

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cardiff
Looks like Crwys Road might be moving a step closer on the Cardiff council planning website they have put a draft/provisional agreement up between TFW/Cardiff Council and the old church owner up on planning permission website still needs be signed.

Always thought they wouldn’t build the platforms until they had secured planning permission for the north bound platform stairs from bridge and the lift.

can find the document here https://www.cardiffidoxcloud.wales/...s.do?activeTab=documents&keyVal=T0IMQKECFY000 it’s the one Dated 9th of July. If you wish to review the planning permission update yourself for the Crwys Road new police station and train station access building
 
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snalty

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The 756 I just got in to Cardiff queen street on the Coryton line didn’t have its panto up. Are there any planned works that could explain this?
 

spaniel

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The 756 I just got in to Cardiff queen street on the Coryton line didn’t have its panto up. Are there any planned works that could explain this?
TFW reported OLE issues on the Coryton line this morning via social media, I don't think it's planned work.

Due to a fault with the Overhead Line Equipment (OLE) on the Coryton line, services are cancelled.

Tickets accepted on Cardiff Bus routes 21, 23, 24, 25, 27 & 86.

Accessible taxi is also available.
 
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AdamWW

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TFW reported OLE issues on the Coryton line this morning via social media, I don't think it's planned work.

Handy, then, that the trains can keep running anyway.

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Ah yes I see that everything was cancelled earlier today with "ticket acceptance" agreed on Cardiff Bus.

Unless you use PAYG.

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Does anyone know why the screens at Radyr now only show the estimated time to departure and no longer also the timetabled departure time?
 
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tfw756rider

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Does anyone know why the screens at Radyr now only show the estimated time to departure and no longer also the timetabled departure time?
I've noticed that the screens between Cardiff Queen Street and Pontypridd (possibly the valleys lines in general?) have changed to 'xx mins' in the last few weeks. I hadn't seen that on Infotec screens before.

The only reason I can think is that it's a more 'Metro' way of doing it, especially when it's even when more than 10 minutes before departure like on these Infotecs (the last two Data Display holdout stations over on the Cambrian at Tywyn and Harlech do it, but only '9 mins' and down).
 

DraigSlebog

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Does anyone know why trains on the Rhymney line have lately been holding at the signal just after Ystrad Mynach before proceeding to Llanbradach? It’s probably a simple explanation or weather related, but I'm curious
 

SWML9102

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I'm not very familiar with other metro systems in the UK, but are there others with significant lengths of single track? The idea of running an intensive service, with at least 15 min frequency to the end of each line in the South Wales valleys, on a system with single track sections and passing loops concerns me. Is it possible to do that reliably without extra timetable padding? Bearing in mind I think one of the original objectives was to get time to the heads of the valleys down to 50 mins from Cardiff, from around an hour now. Will it result in more delays, skip stopping, fast running and turning short?
 

Envoy

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Work is now starting in earnest on Callaghan Square in order to link the Bay Line with Central.

"The enabling works to transform Callaghan Square as part of the first phase of Cardiff Crossrail will continue into the next phase on 24 July to ensure a new tram-train route can be built between Cardiff Central Railway Station and Cardiff Bay.Vital works to divert utilities beneath the carriageway are ongoing, including the relocation of a high-pressure gas main, and motorists are being advised to choose alternative routes while the works take place".

 

edwin_m

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I'm not very familiar with other metro systems in the UK, but are there others with significant lengths of single track? The idea of running an intensive service, with at least 15 min frequency to the end of each line in the South Wales valleys, on a system with single track sections and passing loops concerns me. Is it possible to do that reliably without extra timetable padding? Bearing in mind I think one of the original objectives was to get time to the heads of the valleys down to 50 mins from Cardiff, from around an hour now. Will it result in more delays, skip stopping, fast running and turning short?
The northern end of the Nottingham Tram route has several single line sections.

I would expect some turning short of delayed Up services, otherwise they would delay the next Down with knock-on impacts at Queen Street, or miss their own scheduled return departures. For this sort of delay the next service would be only a few minutes behind.
 

positron

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Will be interesting to see how fast they carve up Cardiff Central southern car park as it's all closed now but still just 2 people sat with gates all day. I did notice they've started ripping up some of the carriageway (including a row of trees). So they properly getting into things now. It'll be interesting to see how carriageway works progress because the new design is quite different from the current, so staging will be interesting.

Regarding the single track sections I suspect they'll be fine, though obviously further double tracking is something that I think should money arise they'd like to do in some places. Especially I suspect on the Aberdare line where they might run some trains further up to Hirwaun.

Though I think if they have money available it'll actually be further wiring that they spend it on.
 
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TrawsCymru only ever funded the service north of Merthyr Tydfil iirc the extension to Cardiff was a stagecoach commercial decision, now it's not run by stagecoach and also there's improved train services the commercial aspect probably doesn't add up.

Regarding the 6 it is Cardiff bus but that's council owned so I don't think we have to wait till bus franchising in the south east for some logic to be applied.

I agree busses should be fillers for a sparse service or a more hub and spoke type system at some stations.

One thing TfW do seem to be doing well is getting transport hubs planned in. There's the big new one in Porth, there's obviously the one in Cardiff Central, Caerphilly is already one. Plus I think places like Waun Graun park.

Probably more and more of this integration should be worked on into the future to really make the most of the new services.

A big missing piece is the lack of train and bus integration at Pontypridd, there's at least stops outside the station but I suspect a train station integrated into the bus station would be a big increase in connections.
Re T4, when the Ebbw Valle line was opened a number of bus services from the area quickly died a death because the railway was so much faster and passengers voted with their feet. Merhyr - Ponty - Cardiff is a commercial bus route, not supported. I wouldn't be surprised if it is going soon when the rail service is speeded up. But then, the X30 survives, so maybe it will survive. But it will certainly be interesting to see what TfW plans for these (and e.g. the fast ones Penarth or Barry) when it comes to franchising. The 6 may have just seen a summer frequency increase but it will surely go when there are trams from Central to the bay.

Re the hubs, these are actually all council projects, where the council then contacted TfW to see whether they would be interested in joint project. There are plenty of other councils who want the same, so I would expect more TfW bus station (or mini bus stations) across the country

And what I'm most interested in the new tram is whether the trams will get proper priority where they cross the carriageway in Callaghan Square. Even in Manchester that is done so poorly, trams usually have to break at least vecause they don't know whether they will get green in time. Contrast that with plenty of continental trams that just keep going against a red light knowing that absolutely will be green by the time they get there...
 

Envoy

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I was in Caerphilly yesterday and note that nothing has happened regarding building the new transport interchange at the station. Anyone got any news about when they will actually get on with this?
 

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