TfGM Bee Network - fleet discussion

[Class 466]

Does anybody know how old the ex First E300s are and how long they've got left in service before they need replacing?

Are there any plans to have next stop displays fitted to these as I know it can be done as I had a ride on a First Worcester one yesterday which had a proper next stop information screen fitted attached to the bulkhead behind the doors.

The 16 GB Kites ordered for Oldham are like for like replacements for E300s there

 

[mattyharding]

The 16 GB Kites ordered for Oldham are like for like replacements for E300s there

Looks like Oldham are gonna be the first depot in Manchester to get GB Kites, I got on them once when I was in York a couple of years ago and I said that I would like to see them in Manchester and fast forward 2 years they're coming

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 May 2026 ==

Looks like Oldham are gonna be the first depot in Manchester to get GB Kites, I got on them once when I was in York a couple of years ago and I said that I would like to see them in Manchester and fast forward 2 years they're coming

I wonder how many seats the GB Kites will have in Bee Network spec

 

[Citibus]

If ADL are able to score a order then it'll likely be the Enviro200EV because the weight restriction of 18tons 'somewhere' in Swinton on 21/22 then sure Enviro200EV has a mgw of 17tons or under 18tons so :/.

The weak bridge - signed at 18 tonnes MGW - is the bridge on Station Road, Swinton. https://maps.app.goo.gl/5ebPoi6cjSZwkZLY9

 

[M60lad]

I was walking down Church Street in Manchester towards High Street and Shudehill Bus Station earlier this week and one of Heywood's EvoSeti's went past me on 163 and I was quite surprised to hear that it had next stop announcements fitted and working, does anybody know how many have actually been done?

Also with half-term this week it does seem to be another case of running School Buses in normal service as at least 2 of Heywood's ex First/Go North West's E400s have been out in service on 163 this past week.

Also some of Denton's fleet has been on holidays to Bolton again covering services at Weston Street.

One question though is that if Go Northwest can use a standard non Bee Network liveried double decker on Bee Network services why is it rare to see one of their standard liveried E200s or one of Denton's Citaro's when their short of vehicles?

 

[MCRTransitYT]

Also with half-term this week it does seem to be another case of running School Buses in normal service as at least 2 of Heywood's ex First/Go North West's E400s have been out in service on 163 this past week.

Also some of Denton's fleet has been on holidays to Bolton again covering services at Weston Street.

One question though is that if Go Northwest can use a standard non Bee Network liveried double decker on Bee Network services why is it rare to see one of their standard liveried E200s or one of Denton's Citaro's when their short of vehicles?

It's the BYDs that cause the problem as far as I'm aware, hence why the deckers have been on loan. However, the single decks aren't too bad, and from my experience, haven't broken down unless its one of the 2014 citaro O295s, so it's less likely for a single deck to move over.

 

[mayneway]

I was walking down Church Street in Manchester towards High Street and Shudehill Bus Station earlier this week and one of Heywood's EvoSeti's went past me on 163 and I was quite surprised to hear that it had next stop announcements fitted and working, does anybody know how many have actually been done?

Also with half-term this week it does seem to be another case of running School Buses in normal service as at least 2 of Heywood's ex First/Go North West's E400s have been out in service on 163 this past week.

Also some of Denton's fleet has been on holidays to Bolton again covering services at Weston Street.

One question though is that if Go Northwest can use a standard non Bee Network liveried double decker on Bee Network services why is it rare to see one of their standard liveried E200s or one of Denton's Citaro's when their short of vehicles?

One of the longer E200’s that’s normally used on schools is often used on regular work in Denton - think it’s 4025?
Don’t think anything bigger like a citaro could be used.

While I think on what happened to the additional Solo SR that was shipped down from the north east to help out at Denton? It was in GNW livery as it had previously been a queens road bus. Not seen it for ages in use.

 

[MCRTransitYT]

While I think on what happened to the additional Solo SR that was shipped down from the north east to help out at Denton? It was in GNW livery as it had previously been a queens road bus. Not seen it for ages in use.

5052 only appeared to run 10 days at Denton, and that was in early February! It was covering for a damaged Mellor which has been fixed so wasn't needed anymore.

 

[mattyharding]

I wonder how they'll electrify the smaller depots like Eccles, Denton, Wythenshawe etc

 

[mattyharding]

So if Oldham is getting 9 Streetdeck Electroliners and 16 GB Kites what else are they getting because aren't they due to be fully electric by the end of this year

 

[Redmike]

So if Oldham is getting 9 Streetdeck Electroliners and 16 GB Kites what else are they getting because aren't they due to be fully electric by the end of this year

There is a batch of 55 Electroliners which are already being delivered before this recent order which was announced.

 

[mattyharding]

There is a batch of 55 Electroliners which are already being delivered before this recent order which was announced.

They could be for Metroline we don't know that yet

 

[mayneway]

I wonder how they'll electrify the smaller depots like Eccles, Denton, Wythenshawe etc

Eccles and Denton won’t be electrified.

 

[mattyharding]

Eccles and Denton won’t be electrified.

Oh so what will happen to them as GNW only has Bolton and Wigan and as for Diamond I'm not sure especially as the 343 and 356 go from there which is strange especially as they go absolutely nowhere near Eccles

 

[Redmike]

They could be for Metroline we don't know that yet

one has been pictured with stagecoach fleet number 82451 so I presume that’s for Oldham depot.

 

[mangad]

Oh so what will happen to them as GNW only has Bolton and Wigan and as for Diamond I'm not sure especially as the 343 and 356 go from there which is strange especially as they go absolutely nowhere near Eccles

Denton and Eccles are depots of "small franchises" so are operator owned (or leased) and not TfGM owned. Their future is beholden to the future of those small franchises. Similarly the buses themselves are not TfGM owned.

As for the services, Eccles has long been a base for services in Tameside and Stockport as part of the Eccles depot was once Go Goodwins/Little Gem. It is not far from the M60 so whilst far away, it's also not that far in time. Notably Go Ahead also picked a site in Denton that's incredibly close to the M60.

Will they be electrified in the future? Depends very much what happens with franchising. Small franchises haven't worked out the way that was intended. And it very much remains to be seen if they will in other areas of England. But at some point diesel buses will end. A solution will be found.

 

[mayneway]

Denton and Eccles are depots of "small franchises" so are operator owned (or leased) and not TfGM owned. Their future is beholden to the future of those small franchises. Similarly the buses themselves are not TfGM owned.

As for the services, Eccles has long been a base for services in Tameside and Stockport as part of the Eccles depot was once Go Goodwins/Little Gem. It is not far from the M60 so whilst far away, it's also not that far in time. Notably Go Ahead also picked a site in Denton that's incredibly close to the M60.

Will they be electrified in the future? Depends very much what happens with franchising. Small franchises haven't worked out the way that was intended. And it very much remains to be seen if they will in other areas of England. But at some point diesel buses will end. A solution will be found.

Took the words out of my mouth haha.

 

[Class 323 Fan]

There’s a couple of uplifts planned for Metroline in September. I know the 219 is getting a big PVR increase, along with a Hyde road service I can’t quite remember so that needs to be factored in.

Any news on the 219 PVR increase? Like what the new frequency would be.

It's definitely needed

And where will these extra buses coming from? Will the extra services run out of Hyde Road

 

[Bungle965]

It's definitely needed

I have often wondered whether tri-axles would be beneficial for these sort of routes, 192, 219, 135 etc to help increase patronage but without clogging up more road space!

 

[MCRTransitYT]

I have often wondered whether tri-axles would be beneficial for these sort of routes, 192, 219, 135 etc to help increase patronage but without clogging up more road space!

It depends if a manufacturer offers electric tri axles to the UK market. I know Wrightbus have made a Tri axle streetdeck electroliner and ADL making the Enviro500EV but im unsure if they are available here

 

[darylyates17]

Are a number of the ex Plymouth B7RLEs no longer in use at Bolton? they dont appear to have been in service for a few weeks.

 

[Class 323 Fan]

hmmI have often wondered whether tri-axles would be beneficial for these sort of routes, 192, 219, 135 etc to help increase patronage but without clogging up more road space!

They probably would, and somihing like an Enviro400XLB for the uk market would be good for routes like it. But really the infrastructure and tight turns these routes have to take. It would require dime routes t be rerouted it the turn is too tight I'm guessing

 

[Renown 3B3RA]

I don’t think routing would be too much of an issue, there‘ve been plenty of tri-axles in Manchester in the past, watching those former HK Olympians turning from Whitworth St into Oxford St was interesting. Some 98 seaters were used on rail replacements last summer during the Stockport blockade. Wonder what the weight of an electric one would be though?

 

[mattyharding]

Once upon a time there was a tri-axle on the 348 somehow

Back in 2001 I believe first used to have a few ex Hong Kong Olympian's that were tri-axle

 

[mayneway]

Any news on the 219 PVR increase? Like what the new frequency would be.

It's definitely needed

And where will these extra buses coming from? Will the extra services run out of Hyde Road

Not sure exactly on frequency, someone did mention upto every 5 minutes.
It’s supposed to kick in from September and all run from Tameside depot. I’d imagine additional BZLs will be transferred from Hyde road.

 

[mattyharding]

Not sure exactly on frequency, someone did mention upto every 5 minutes.
It’s supposed to kick in from September and all run from Tameside depot. I’d imagine additional BZLs will be transferred from Hyde road.

Wow that's a very frequent service but I guess it's needed, I do kind of wish the 348 would get a frequency boost but I guess Oldham needs new buses first as some of the buses we have now are simply not good enough

 

[mattyharding]

Does Diamond have a few MMCs missing as over the past few days the 343 has had Mellor Stratas running instead of the usual MMCs

 

[MCRTransitYT]

I do kind of wish the 348 would get a frequency boost

Every 20 minutes seems decent for the areas, with the aforementioned 343 following quite a bit of the route, and the only place where it doesn't is near Stalybridge to Ashton, with the 216 and 219 connecting with the 348. Carrbrook doesn't *seem* too big, and personally, I think 20 minutes is fine for routes especially not into Manchester City Centre. Typically, these types of routes are 20/30 minutes in frequency, so unless it gets full and standing, I cant see it getting boosted.

 

[mayneway]

Every 20 minutes seems decent for the areas, with the aforementioned 343 following quite a bit of the route, and the only place where it doesn't is near Stalybridge to Ashton, with the 216 and 219 connecting with the 348. Carrbrook doesn't *seem* too big, and personally, I think 20 minutes is fine for routes especially not into Manchester City Centre. Typically, these types of routes are 20/30 minutes in frequency, so unless it gets full and standing, I cant see it getting boosted.

348 is only really busy up to Stalybridge and normally if a 237 pulls on to stand first in Ashton and starts loading, then it takes the majority of passengers and only a few hang on for the 348.

 

[mattyharding]

348 is only really busy up to Stalybridge and normally if a 237 pulls on to stand first in Ashton and starts loading, then it takes the majority of passengers and only a few hang on for the 348.

That is correct and i've seen it happen numerous times and even done it myself where I'd get a 237 to Stalybridge and then wait for the 348 there but with the recent closure of Armentieres Square all of the buses that usually stopped there are now stopping additionally at Stalybridge Bus Station

 

[Leyland Bus]

New Vantage Electroliners 2301/4/5/9 are now seeing service. There are around 20 at Wigan being PDI'd, so will start drifting into service over the coming weeks.

Someone upthread was asking about the GNW liveried Solo, that came from GNE, 5052 is currently parked outside engineering at Wigan.