Indian Railways 0-4-2T locos (History)

[70014IronDuke]

Talk of the fromer GWR 14xx (48xx) class 0-4-2T auto-train tanks in the last push-pull train thread made me think of their Indian 'cousins'. I remember seeing some of these locos in India in 1976, probably in the Punjab (maybe Ludhiana?) and Ambala Cantonment. I think they were painted maroon. They were in steam (from memory) but I did not see them working, so I have no idea as to what their duties were.

Did they actually have any relationship to the GWR locos, or was it just coincidence that the Indian railway of the day needed a small tank loco and chose the 0-4-2T arrangement as suitable for requirements? Presumably they could have been 0-4-0Ts, but needed a larger bunker, and hence the trailing axle? Did India use push-pull trains and were these locos so fitted, anyone know?

 

[Gloster]

Talk of the fromer GWR 14xx (48xx) class 0-4-2T auto-train tanks in the last push-pull train thread made me think of their Indian 'cousins'. I remember seeing some of these locos in India in 1976, probably in the Punjab (maybe Ludhiana?) and Ambala Cantonment. I think they were painted maroon. They were in steam (from memory) but I did not see them working, so I have no idea as to what their duties were.

Did they actually have any relationship to the GWR locos, or was it just coincidence that the Indian railway of the day needed a small tank loco and chose the 0-4-2T arrangement as suitable for requirements? Presumably they could have been 0-4-0Ts, but needed a larger bunker, and hence the trailing axle? Did India use push-pull trains and were these locos so fitted, anyone know?

Well, it wouldn’t have been directly influenced by the 14XX as the first XT appeared in 1929, three years before the GWR locos. However, the XT was a child of Indian Railway’s Locomotive Standards Committee that had been set up in (I think) 1924 and comprised, as far as I can check, British-trained engineers. It is possible that one or more of these remained deeply rooted in the Swindon or Wolverhampton tradition, but I think it would need some pretty strong evidence to make this a reasonable suggestion.

 

[Taunton]

Well, it wouldn’t have been directly influenced by the 14XX as the first XT appeared in 1929, three years before the GWR locos. However, the XT was a child of Indian Railway’s Locomotive Standards Committee that had been set up in (I think) 1924 and comprised, as far as I can check, British-trained engineers. It is possible that one or more of these remained deeply rooted in the Swindon or Wolverhampton tradition, but I think it would need some pretty strong evidence to make this a reasonable suggestion.

I believe the first XT batch were built in 1929 by Krupp, always surprising when one thinks the whole purpose of colonies was as a market for UK goods, and to an extent senior managers. The post-WW1 German pricing must have been very cheap. The loco does have an appearance of the more basic and industrial appearance of German steam locos. The drawings appear to have then been supplied to Indian loco workshops, who later built their own.

I did take a distant photo of one plinthed outside the railway HQ at Chennai, but was thrown out by security before I could get any closer!

 

[etr221]

A quick look in my reference books suggests that all the pre-war XTs were built by Krupp, it was only the post war batch(es) that were Indian built (at Ajmer).

With outside cylinders, I doubt they had any particular relationship to the GWR 0-4-2Ts - the 14xx (originally 48xx) and 58xx classes we are familiar with had Victorian predecessors (517 class and others(?)) - or any of the other British 0-4-2Ts - although the GNoSR Aberdeen dock shunters (Manning Wardle built, LNER classes Z4 and Z5) did have outside cylinders.

Nor do I think there was any real relationship between any of the IRS (or later) designs and British (or other) types - but doubtless all the various engineers had some familiarity with developments elsewhere which probably had some influence.

 

[70014IronDuke]

I did take a distant photo of one plinthed outside the railway HQ at Chennai, but was thrown out by security before I could get any closer!

Well, the secrets of these hi-tech machines are surely of great interest to the intelligence services of nearby hostile powers
Interesting that this was a Chennai - I did spend some time there back, back when, and never saw any of the 0-4-2Ts there from memory. (Lots of nice WPs though!)

A quick look in my reference books suggests that all the pre-war XTs were built by Krupp, it was only the post war batch(es) that were Indian built (at Ajmer).

With outside cylinders, I doubt they had any particular relationship to the GWR 0-4-2Ts -

Ah, very good point.
Long time since I saw either in the flesh, as it were!

Thanks to all who answered.