Royal mail parcel dumped on doorstep

[Buzby]

Is having a regular postman still a ‘thing’? I.ve lived at my address since 1988. Everyone knew the postie until he retired in 2004. Since then the postman is unknown, changes regularly and since closing and relocating the delivery office from 1 to 5 miles away, folk are prepared to put up with sloppy service if it saves them a 10 mile round trip clutching a 739/While You Were Out card. That‘s exactly what we get - little customer service and no consistency…..

 

[styles]

Is having a regular postman still a ‘thing’? I.ve lived at my address since 1988. Everyone knew the postie until he retired in 2004. Since then the postman is unknown, changes regularly and since closing and relocating the delivery office from 1 to 5 miles away, folk are prepared to put up with sloppy service if it saves them a 10 mile round trip clutching a 739/While You Were Out card. That‘s exactly what we get - little customer service and no consistency…..

I can't speak for the whole of the UK but I've had regular posties for years yeah.

My last postie lived in the village and she would sometimes keep parcels in her house and attempt redelivery in the evening when she knew you were home. Again, against RM policy, but it worked.

Obviously we have stand-in posties to cover leave etc.

 

[david1212]

As already stated unless instructed otherwise Royal Mail are supposed to take any item they can not deliver back to the delivery office and redeliver the next day again unless instructed otherwise.
This of course is additional work at the sorting office plus the next day may not be a scheduled delivery day for the address so again extra work.

Just last week from their website I delayed delivery of an item for a day as I knew I would be out.
The next day I was waiting but heard a thump and the item had been forced through the letter box ..... too much rush to ring and wait? What I don't know is if the person delivering knew the item had been rescheduled, if so I would have hoped they would have presumed done so the item could be handed over.
While when I tried again there was not much deflection so I think not the cause of the item was damaged but regardless annoying.

Is having a regular postman still a ‘thing’? ..... That‘s exactly what we get - little customer service and no consistency…..

Not around here now, there may be a regular team who rotate.

The Royal Mail delivery office is only around a mile away, the problem is that since 2020 the hours are so limited, no longer 6pm every day, 8pm one evening and until 2pm Saturday.

I try to avoid anything that will not safely pass though the letter box by e.g. choosing eBay sellers who offer 'Click & Collect' even if the price is higher.

Of the others from my experience Amazon are the worst - non-delivery at the first attempt is not an option even if left out for all to see in heavy rain. I rarely buy if too big for the letter box and delivery to local newsagent or Post Office is not an option. I have though been caught by eBay sellers not using the service stated on the listing.

As I've posted before much depends on the local person.
Yodel here I know normally is mid-late afternoon.
Last year DPD delivered a large heavy item to a neighbour even though I was waiting for them. I only found when the tracking changed to 'delivered' then saw the photo ...

 

[styles]

As I've posted before much depends on the local person.
Yodel here I know normally is mid-late afternoon.
Last year DPD delivered a large heavy item to a neighbour even though I was waiting for them. I only found when the tracking changed to 'delivered' then saw the photo ...

This also my experience. In my last two properties I've known the Evri driver on first name terms and again come to an informal agreement. The place I lived before though, well they left my £240 package in plain sight on a busy zone 2 central London street so...

 

[GusB]

I think I must be fairly lucky in that I've never personally had any issues with deliveries from any of the companies. Rather than waiting for an answer, my local Hermes/Evri driver used to knock on the door, open it and shout "parcel" before leaving the parcel just inside. If we were out he'd leave soft items such as clothing behind one of the bins and anything else would go to a neighbour. Some of the "national" courier firms seem to use local logistics companies as sub-contractors and they seem to have regular drivers that do the various routes (M & H Carriers is one of them).

I don't recall any issues with Royal Mail, though. On one occasion I was in but couldn't make it to the door quickly enough and the postie had disappeared by the time wheezed my way downstairs (it was a Covid test kit). However, he handed it in to the local post office and one of the staff there was good enough to post it through the letterbox on her way home; I'd imagine that was probably against the rules, but it helped me out immensely.

Having said that, I've heard plenty of horror stories first-hand from when I worked for a large home shopping retailer. The most common marking on the delivery card was "front porch"; one customer jokingly told me that he'd love to have a front porch but that he lived ten floors up in a tower block! I won't mention the name of the courier, but it rhymed with "NoDel"...

On a more serious note, I don't necessarily blame the individuals who work for these firms. Many are "self-employed" and get paid a pittance for what they do. As far as I'm aware, if delivery is unsuccessful on the first attempt there is no additional payment for re-delivery. They're also highly monitored and have very strict targets to meet. I remember watching a documentary (I think it was C4 Dispatches) showing that many drivers don't even have time to take care of basic personal needs. It's an industry that needs stricter regulation and it saddens me to think that Royal Mail is joining the race to the bottom.

 

[Bletchleyite]

This also my experience. In my last two properties I've known the Evri driver on first name terms and again come to an informal agreement. The place I lived before though, well they left my £240 package in plain sight on a busy zone 2 central London street so...

There are two types of Evri driver, I find. Those doing it for a bit of extra pocket money while retired do a good job, generally, and do offer stuff like this (and sometimes more e.g. letting you pick up from their house). Those trying to make a living out of it just do bare minimum as to earn even minimum wage you can't spend the time.

 

[35B]

On a more serious note, I don't necessarily blame the individuals who work for these firms. Many are "self-employed" and get paid a pittance for what they do. As far as I'm aware, if delivery is unsuccessful on the first attempt there is no additional payment for re-delivery. They're also highly monitored and have very strict targets to meet. I remember watching a documentary (I think it was C4 Dispatches) showing that many drivers don't even have time to take care of basic personal needs. It's an industry that needs stricter regulation and it saddens me to think that Royal Mail is joining the race to the bottom.

Royal Mail are doing so because they can’t afford not to. We* refuse to pay the postal charges that would allow the pressure to come off the delivery people, and instead go for the cheapest options. And until someone comes up with a way of making the company rather than the delivery driver responsible for misdelivery at the door, that will remain the case.

* - both directly and also in what we're willing to pay retailers for delivery.

 

[PeterC]

I provided my own DropBox adjacent to the Front Door door. Sometimes they even ignore this! There really is no ‘proper’ solution!

I have had one for around 20 years. I think it has been used twice. Amazon drivers in particular invariably ignored the instruction to use it.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Royal Mail are doing so because they can’t afford not to. We* refuse to pay the postal charges that would allow the pressure to come off the delivery people, and instead go for the cheapest options. And until someone comes up with a way of making the company rather than the delivery driver responsible for misdelivery at the door, that will remain the case.

* - both directly and also in what we're willing to pay retailers for delivery.

Precisely this. If we want proper service for deliveries, we probably need a delivery fee of around £10 per parcel or thereabouts, I reckon. We don't want to pay anything, generally speaking. Thus we end up with a race to the bottom.

I will to be fair pay extra for DPD over others as I find them better and they'll deliver to my local shop which is barely a minute's walk away. But most won't.

 

[Tetchytyke]

If we want proper service for deliveries, we probably need a delivery fee of around £10 per parcel or thereabouts, I reckon. We don't want to pay anything, generally speaking. Thus we end up with a race to the bottom.

Of course the customer has no choice over the courier that a retailer chooses to use. The retailer gets the choice as the contract for delivery has nothing to do with the customer: it is between the courier and the retailer.

The retailer is responsible for the goods being delivered, too. Which is why I'm surprised that retailers aren't a bit more choosy about the couriers they use. If the courier loses, "loses," or inappropriately delivers an item, it is for the retailer to provide redress to the customer. Yes, some retailers have started pushing back on this, demanding things like police reports, but that's not what the law says should happen. The retailer's on the hook for delivery failures so I'm surprised that retailers keep using the same shoddy courier companies.

From my experience, DHL are by far and away the best of the mainstream couriers.

 

[35B]

Of course the customer has no choice over the courier that a retailer chooses to use. The retailer gets the choice as the contract for delivery has nothing to do with the customer: it is between the courier and the retailer.

The retailer is responsible for the goods being delivered, too. Which is why I'm surprised that retailers aren't a bit more choosy about the couriers they use. If the courier loses, "loses," or inappropriately delivers an item, it is for the retailer to provide redress to the customer. Yes, some retailers have started pushing back on this, demanding things like police reports, but that's not what the law says should happen. The retailer's on the hook for delivery failures so I'm surprised that retailers keep using the same shoddy courier companies.

From my experience, DHL are by far and away the best of the mainstream couriers.

Not all retailers are like that - I've had a few times when I've been given a choice.

As for retailers' choice of couriers, at least part of the issue is that there aren't that many suppliers to choose between in a market which is driven by price rather than quality

 

[Bletchleyite]

Of course the customer has no choice over the courier that a retailer chooses to use. The retailer gets the choice as the contract for delivery has nothing to do with the customer: it is between the courier and the retailer.

This is something where I'd like to see some legislation. You can't force companies to allow you free choice of courier (that would make the whole operation way more complex) but to me it should be a legal requirement to state who it is before the final check-out button is pressed committing to the contract. That's entirely possible and should be a legal requirement. I suspect it would motivate companies to abandon the very worst ones (Evri and Yodel) as it would put customers off - it would certainly put me off, particularly Yodel! (Evri is borderline tolerable now I can just divert parcels to my local garage so they can show up whenever and not be left in the road).

The retailer is responsible for the goods being delivered, too. Which is why I'm surprised that retailers aren't a bit more choosy about the couriers they use. If the courier loses, "loses," or inappropriately delivers an item, it is for the retailer to provide redress to the customer. Yes, some retailers have started pushing back on this, demanding things like police reports, but that's not what the law says should happen. The retailer's on the hook for delivery failures so I'm surprised that retailers keep using the same shoddy courier companies.

The retailer can usually claim from the courier for the cost, though. It might concentrate minds if they could not!

From my experience, DHL are by far and away the best of the mainstream couriers.

For me it's between UPS and DPD. DHL may be reliable, but it has few of the useful modern features like decent tracking and a wide range of diversion shops/lockers, at least on the consumer services.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 May 2026 ==

Not all retailers are like that - I've had a few times when I've been given a choice.

Much maligned Sports Direct does allow you to pay extra for DPD and consequently I often do. I'm not willing to pay extra for "next day delivery" in the hope it might be DPD, I only will if it actually commits to being DPD.

 

[Tetchytyke]

And until someone comes up with a way of making the company rather than the delivery driver responsible for misdelivery at the door, that will remain the case.

The retailer is on the hook for misdelivery under s.29 Consumer Rights Act 2015.

The legal provision is that the retailer is liable until the goods come into the physical possession of the consumer. Leaving something on a doorstep is not physical possession.

Trouble is, people don't know their rights and so retailers get away with playing silly buggers about it.

Not all retailers are like that - I've had a few times when I've been given a choice.

Truthfully, I can't think of any cases where I have been given a choice. I make an order and it turns up. I do look at who is delivering and that does influence whether I'll use that retailer or not

But even if the retailer gives you a selection of couriers, they're still liable under s.29 Consumer Rights Act.

As for retailers' choice of couriers, at least part of the issue is that there aren't that many suppliers to choose between

Yeah, that is the real issue. But that doesn't excuse retailers still going with Evri and Yodel.

DHL may be reliable, but it has few of the useful modern features like decent tracking and a wide range of diversion shops/lockers

The tracking is pretty good IME with DHL but, no, they don't really offer diversion to lockers. It's less of an issue for me as I'm a mile away from the DHL office here, but I do remember the days of having to trek out to some Godforsaken industrial park to collect a parcel.

Living on Fraggle Rock also helps here. If I'm in the house and my front door is unlocked, most couriers here will just open the front door and leave the parcel in my hallway. I probably wouldn't leave my door unlocked if I lived on a main road in London though.

 

[35B]

The retailer is on the hook for misdelivery under s.29 Consumer Rights Act 2015.

The legal provision is that the retailer is liable until the goods come into the physical possession of the consumer. Leaving something on a doorstep is not physical possession.

I didn't make myself clear. There are economic consequences to both retailer and delivery firm for misdelivery, but culpability lies with the delivery driver. Taking as read that the primary cause of bad delivery (most recently, a suitcase left in full view of the road at a side gate, rather than in the designated safe place through the gate and round the back) is the pressure that drivers are placed under, I was looking for culpability to go back up the chain so that the delivery firm are put under real pressure to make rounds manageable. In the same way that hauliers are criminally liable in Australia if their routes are set so fast that drivers have to speed to meet schedules.

 

[barringtoncem]

Agree that not having a regular postman it not a thing now ours used to be based locally so knew the village well and could spot if anything was out of the ordinary when on his round
but since he has left it is a different postman each day who comes from the main sorting office about ten miles away

 

[Peter Mugridge]

And until someone comes up with a way of making the company rather than the delivery driver responsible for misdelivery at the door, that will remain the case.

Vicarious liability should already cover that?

 

[Broucek]

My favourite recent delivery fail was a courier who left a cardboard box containing a new handbag in our recycling bin! The evening the bins go out....

There was no note through the door. By the time I saw the email with the picture it was too late!

Retailer was delightful and sent a new bag

 

[35B]

Vicarious liability should already cover that?

See post #44

 

[styles]

My favourite recent delivery fail was a courier who left a cardboard box containing a new handbag in our recycling bin! The evening the bins go out....

There was no note through the door. By the time I saw the email with the picture it was too late!

Retailer was delightful and sent a new bag

I've always thought this is probably the worst approach to ever be taken. Even if it wasn't bin day, this is a ridiculous strategy. If somebody's on holiday for example then they come back the bin could go out on any day. Putting deliveries in the bin just sounds absurd.

 

[Broucek]

I've always thought this is probably the worst approach to ever be taken. Even if it wasn't bin day, this is a ridiculous strategy. If somebody's on holiday for example then they come back the bin could go out on any day. Putting deliveries in the bin just sounds absurd.

Exactly. Particularly a recycling bin already full of cardboard!

 

[AY1975]

You can divert to your nearest post office which in effect fulfils that, but they do have some lockers too.

Does it have to be your nearest post office, or can it be any post office of your choosing within a certain distance of the delivery address (maybe within the same postcode area)? I've often asked to have parcels delivered to another post office nearby rather than my local branch.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Does it have to be your nearest post office, or can it be any post office of your choosing within a certain distance of the delivery address (maybe within the same postcode area)? I've often asked to have parcels delivered to another post office nearby rather than my local branch.

I've only ever tried my nearest two which are equidistant. I suspect it's probably any served by the same delivery office.

 

[dgl]

At my current place it's no issue if a package is left outside as nothing gets stolen, a neighbour has had a package on their front step for a couple of days and no issues and I once left my keys in the door for about half a day!
With restricted opening hours for delivery offices and being at work 5 days a week it's handy to be able to have a package delivered and not be in.

 

[bubieyehyeh]

A relative finds amazon invariablely leave parcel on front doorstep in full view of a busy street, and don't even ring the doorbell.
They had a parcel being delivered by Evri who have done the same in the past, so added a note to say leave at back door if no-one in.
They had to pop out for a hour, and the courier came when they were out and didn't leave the package, and said they would try one more time the next day or put it in a locker
So I wonder if this retailer was insisting that orders had to be correctly delivered, and not just left.

 

[AdamWW]

Well I got a response from the Royal Mail.

A complete brush-off, ignored my request to escalate, case closed.

I wonder how many copies of their form response they send out a day?

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Well I got a response from the Royal Mail.

A complete brush-off, ignored my request to escalate, case closed.

I wonder how many copies of their form response they send out a day?

Psst.... check your DMs...

 

[308165]

In an ideal world parcels would be a regulated monopoly (Royal Mail), but properly regulated and enforced. The benefit would be huge economies of scale on both trunk movements and last mile delivery, might even be a role for rail to support and quite a lotnof environmental benefits. That might start to offset the the increased cost of paying delivery staff a sensible wage, and would get over the delivery issues.

 

[35B]

In an ideal world parcels would be a regulated monopoly (Royal Mail), but properly regulated and enforced. The benefit would be huge economies of scale on both trunk movements and last mile delivery, might even be a role for rail to support and quite a lotnof environmental benefits. That might start to offset the the increased cost of paying delivery staff a sensible wage, and would get over the delivery issues.

A properly regulated and enforced statutory monopoly. I can see the Pink Arrows rehearsing overhead as I type those words - regulatory capture by private companies is absolutely a thing, while many of the issues of both Royal Mail and Post Office are rooted in how they were managed by the government, especially the grasping demands of the Treasury for dividends regardless of business need.

 

[styles]

In an ideal world parcels would be a regulated monopoly (Royal Mail), but properly regulated and enforced. The benefit would be huge economies of scale on both trunk movements and last mile delivery, might even be a role for rail to support and quite a lotnof environmental benefits. That might start to offset the the increased cost of paying delivery staff a sensible wage, and would get over the delivery issues.

I wouldn't agree with monopolosing parcels. Other couriers can and do offer a better service using the same shared infrastructure like roads and airports.

Letter delivery on the other hand, no private company is going to want to take up unless they're allowed to charge sky high fees because it's a high-cost, low-return business, but we treat it as critical national infrastructure. For that reason I would've never have privatised Royal Mail.

 

[308165]

I wouldn't agree with monopolosing parcels. Other couriers can and do offer a better service using the same shared infrastructure like roads and airports.

Letter delivery on the other hand, no private company is going to want to take up unless they're allowed to charge sky high fees because it's a high-cost, low-return business, but we treat it as critical national infrastructure. For that reason I would've never have privatised Royal Mail.

But two pages have been expended saying awful the other couriers are as well as Royal Mail! Plus with better regulation Royal Mail could start to offer a better service rather than be in a race to the bottom