South Wales Metro - Future

[Cardiff123]

Not sure where to put this, so dropping it in here.

Mark Hooper, Plaid Cymru MS for Vale of Glamorgan & Bridgend, has been announced today as the Deputy Minister for Transport in the new Welsh Government.
Ministers are not allowed to favour their constituency areas, but it'll be interesting to see if the VoG finally get to see some improved rail services going forward

 

[anthony263]

Not sure where to put this, so dropping it in here.

Mark Hooper, Plaid Cymru MS for Vale of Glamorgan & Bridgend, has been announced today as the Deputy Minister for Transport in the new Welsh Government.
Ministers are not allowed to favour their constituency areas, but it'll be interesting to see if the VoG finally get to see some improved rail services going forward

Given plaid want to show themselves as working for wales i suspect we will see improvements for areas not already having it undertaken metro.

Basically we may see the long overdue tondu loop and half hourly VOG service

 

[Topological]

Given plaid want to show themselves as worming for wales i suspect we will see improvements for areas not already having it undertaken metro.

Basically we may see the long overdue tondu loop and half hourly VOG service

Those would both be very welcome. Although, it would be good to see some work on the junction to the Maesteg line at the Bridgend end to clear the mainline even when a train is coming off the branch (as many others have said on this thread).

I like the interpretation of Plaid as "worming" for Wales. It will be good to see what results.

 

[SWML9102]

Given plaid want to show themselves as worming for wales i suspect we will see improvements for areas not already having it undertaken metro.

Basically we may see the long overdue tondu loop and half hourly VOG service

Perhaps he could also put in a word for Pyle (within Bridgend County) which doesn't even get a full hourly service, let alone half hourly. Another "metro" station with a long-way-short-of-metro service.

 

[MikePJ]

The half-hourly VoG service is in Plaid’s manifesto.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 May 2026 ==

Edit - as is 2tph to Maesteg: https://www.partyof.wales/y_rheilffyrdd

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 May 2026 ==

• Better and more frequent everyday services in South East Wales, including increasing service frequencies to 4 trains per hour to and from Cardiff to the Heads of the Valleys via Pontypridd and Caerphilly, and 2 trains per hour on the Maesteg branch and the Vale of Glamorgan Line beyond Barry.

 

[anthony263]

Pyle needs a full hourly service

 

[SWML9102]

That bullet point from the Plaid manifesto is carefully worded. It promises "2 trains per hour on the Maesteg branch", not 2 trains per hour between Maesteg and Cardiff, I.e. a shuttle between Bridgend and Maesteg.

The vast majority of passengers using the Maesteg branch are heading for Cardiff - I would guess 80-90%. People in the know will stick to the direct trains. Those not in the know will be dumped at Bridgend awaiting a quite likely already busy service from the West, or coming back just using the direct trains from Cardiff.

So upgrading the Tondu loop, whilst being welcome, could end up being a lot of cost and disruption with little gain.

If the restriction is capacity on the main line, then that needs to addressed as well.

 

[anthony263]

That bullet point from the Plaid manifesto is carefully worded. It promises "2 trains per hour on the Maesteg branch", not 2 trains per hour between Maesteg and Cardiff, I.e. a shuttle between Bridgend and Maesteg.

The vast majority of passengers using the Maesteg branch are heading for Cardiff - I would guess 80-90%. People in the know will stick to the direct trains. Those not in the know will be dumped at Bridgend awaiting a quite likely already busy service from the West, or coming back just using the direct trains from Cardiff.

So upgrading the Tondu loop, whilst being welcome, could end up being a lot of cost and disruption with little gain.

If the restriction is capacity on the main line, then that needs to addressed as well.

That bullet point from the Plaid manifesto is carefully worded. It promises "2 trains per hour on the Maesteg branch", not 2 trains per hour between Maesteg and Cardiff, I.e. a shuttle between Bridgend and Maesteg.

The vast majority of passengers using the Maesteg branch are heading for Cardiff - I would guess 80-90%. People in the know will stick to the direct trains. Those not in the know will be dumped at Bridgend awaiting a quite likely already busy service from the West, or coming back just using the direct trains from Cardiff.

So upgrading the Tondu loop, whilst being welcome, could end up being a lot of cost and disruption with little gain.

If the restriction is capacity on the main line, then that needs to addressed as well.

Swanline has taken the path of the 2nd Maesteg between Bridgend and Cardiff Central.

A shuttle i think might actually be a good idea

 

[Topological]

Nothing wrong with a shuttle.

However, would be good if another fast could be fitted into the Swansea - Cardiff section. Nominally using the path that the early morning Eastbound and late evening Westbound GWR use. That should support the shuttle, connect West Wales, and remove a terminating train from Cardiff Central.

Someone needs to think about what future Port Talbot Steel traffic will be like and then plan the rail network accordingly.

 

[Daniel Boone]

Is Bridgend Station entirely fit for purpose? Wouldn't it be ideal to have a pair of through lines?

 

[Smwrff]

Is Bridgend Station entirely fit for purpose? Wouldn't it be ideal to have a pair of through lines?

If its purpose is to provide through services on the SWML, a branch connection north on the Maesteg line and a branch connection south east on the Vale of Glamorgan line - then yes it is fit for purpose.

i think what you are suggesting is upgrading the junctions so that the Maesteg line can cross to the Vale of Glamorgan line. It can be done but would be disruptive.... I suspect not cost effective.

 

[Topological]

If you had more money you would make it possible for a train to get onto the Maesteg branch and off the mainline even when one was still heading towards Bridgend from the branch.

If you had even more money then making it possible to get to the VoG from both through platforms would be good.

No more through lines are needed though. Everything stops.

 

[Peter Sarf]

Is Bridgend Station entirely fit for purpose? Wouldn't it be ideal to have a pair of through lines?

Keep the two through platforms for Swansea/Cardiff. Use the bay platforms on each side for shuttles. One on the UP side for a Maesteg shuttle. One on the DOWN side for a Cardiff via VOG shuttle. Shuttles would remove the conflicting moves and allow a more frequent shuttle that does not have to dovetail in with SWML services. That would also be the cheapest and most resilient way.

 

[Smwrff]

But that would lose the existing Maesteg to Cardiff direct service.

I agree with what someone said earlier - Maintain 1tph Maesteg to Cardiff (and beyond) direct. Add 1tph Maesteg to Bridgend shuttle.

Keep VoG services as starting from Bridgend.

 

[The exile]

But that would lose the existing Maesteg to Cardiff direct service.

I agree with what someone said earlier - Maintain 1tph Maesteg to Cardiff (and beyond) direct. Add 1tph Maesteg to Bridgend shuttle.

Keep VoG services as starting from Bridgend.

What about the other way around - run VoG services to Swansea, freeing up the mainline for 2 tph to Maesteg? Doesn’t work if there’s massive demand from Swan Line stations beyond Bridgend towards Cardiff - although 2 tph via VoG (especially if the connections work at Bridgend) might be better than 1 direct.

 

[anthony263]

What about the other way around - run VoG services to Swansea, freeing up the mainline for 2 tph to Maesteg? Doesn’t work if there’s massive demand from Swan Line stations beyond Bridgend towards Cardiff - although 2 tph via VoG (especially if the connections work at Bridgend) might be better than 1 direct.

No thanks many of us who use swanline stations don't fancy longer trips via the VOG.

 

[Smwrff]

The only benefit would be a Swansea to Cardiff via Cardiff Airport service. But improve existing VoG and Cardiff Airport services first.

 

[anthony263]

The only benefit would be a Swansea to Cardiff via Cardiff Airport service. But improve existing VoG and Cardiff Airport services first.

Will reduce capacity at brisgens by having services crossover to acess the VOG through platform 1. I was told years ago that if they remodelled the junction east of Bridgend to allow acess to the VOG from platform 2 they'd havw to reduce the speed limit through the station.

Any improved acess.to Cardiff airport from West wales id say could be done by changing trains at Bridgend and say a coach link from West wales to Cardiff airport.



Just need improved flights servig the airport as well as 2tph VOG service

 

[Smwrff]

Will reduce capacity at brisgens by having services crossover to acess the VOG through platform 1. I was told years ago that if they remodelled the junction east of Bridgend to allow acess to the VOG from platform 2 they'd havw to reduce the speed limit through the station.

Any improved acess.to Cardiff airport from West wales id say could be done by changing trains at Bridgend and say a coach link from West wales to Cardiff airport.



Just need improved flights servig the airport as well as 2tph VOG service

I was not actually suggesting this should be done. As I said upthread - keep VoG services terminating at Bridgend - with Maesteg services alternating between through services and shuttle.

 

[anthony263]

I was not actually suggesting this should be done. As I said upthread - keep VoG services terminating at Bridgend - with Maesteg services alternating between through services and shuttle.

I agree with you its was others suggesting it.
Maesteg line should be 1tph to Ebbw Vale and 1tph shuttle timed so trains pass at Tondu using the existing loop once its relaid and resignalled. A loop between lynfi junction and Sarn needs to be looked at too.

 

[SWML9102]

At present every service in South East Wales bar one goes to/from Cardiff. There is a good reason for that - it is where people want to get to, and can be awkward to drive and expensive to park.

The only exception is the Ebbw Vale to Newport shuttle. That was provided to complement the hourly Ebbw Vale service to Cardiff. The cost of redoubling parts of the Ebbw Vale line was £70m and a further £17m for resignalling. Not cheap. Now take a look at the loadings on the Newport - Ebbw Vale services, compared with those between Cardiff and Ebbw Vale. The Newport shuttle is way less used, and that is with only around a 10min penalty to change at Newport for Cardiff, compared with going direct. I would suggest the £87m upgrade would have been a better investment providing a second direct Cardiff service.

The same would happen with a Maesteg - Bridgend shuttle, and that has less connecting services to Cardiff from Bridgend than Newport. It is not unreasonable to expect passengers to change trains for secondary destinations (like the airport). But Cardiff is THE primary destination in this area.

When the Maesteg line opened in the early 90s, the management of the day had to fight to get the service to run through to Cardiff, as they understood passenger needs, and placed that above operational convenience. Intercity resisted the 'local' trains on the mainline, to avoid delays to Paddington services. I believe the compromise at the time was additional (or upgraded) loops on the mainline. (I know Miskin loops were pre Maesteg reopening, not sure about Pencoed and Tremains).

The argument should be put forward just the same today. Trains need to run to where the majority of passengers want to go.

 

[anthony263]

Ebbw Vale to Newport services really should be extended through to Abergavenny if they reopen bay platform there and the new caerleon station

 

[SWML9102]

Abergavenny would benefit from an additional hourly service, possibly even extending to Hereford, but again that would ideally serve Cardiff, as well as Newport.

The Ebbw Vale shuttles should, in my opinion, be extended to Cardiff via a reversal at Newport.

I appreciate both the above would consume mainline capacity between Cardiff and Newport, and really do not want more Cardiff terminators, so should go further west. Maybe one providing a second Maesteg, and the other onto Swanline stoppers.

 

[Peter Sarf]

At present every service in South East Wales bar one goes to/from Cardiff. There is a good reason for that - it is where people want to get to, and can be awkward to drive and expensive to park.

The only exception is the Ebbw Vale to Newport shuttle. That was provided to complement the hourly Ebbw Vale service to Cardiff. The cost of redoubling parts of the Ebbw Vale line was £70m and a further £17m for resignalling. Not cheap. Now take a look at the loadings on the Newport - Ebbw Vale services, compared with those between Cardiff and Ebbw Vale. The Newport shuttle is way less used, and that is with only around a 10min penalty to change at Newport for Cardiff, compared with going direct. I would suggest the £87m upgrade would have been a better investment providing a second direct Cardiff service.

The same would happen with a Maesteg - Bridgend shuttle, and that has less connecting services to Cardiff from Bridgend than Newport. It is not unreasonable to expect passengers to change trains for secondary destinations (like the airport). But Cardiff is THE primary destination in this area.

When the Maesteg line opened in the early 90s, the management of the day had to fight to get the service to run through to Cardiff, as they understood passenger needs, and placed that above operational convenience. Intercity resisted the 'local' trains on the mainline, to avoid delays to Paddington services. I believe the compromise at the time was additional (or upgraded) loops on the mainline. (I know Miskin loops were pre Maesteg reopening, not sure about Pencoed and Tremains).

The argument should be put forward just the same today. Trains need to run to where the majority of passengers want to go.

If there is limited capacity at Bridgend and its junction, which would you favour :-
Through services between Cardiff and Swansea Newport (and further West)
or
Through services between Cardiff and Maesteg ?.
In my book getting a good frequency between Maesteg and Bridgend and good connections onwards is the best compromise.

There is even the challenge of terminating at Cardiff so the preference seems to be to run services across Cardiff.

EDIT 20:15
Corrected the question above (Swansea not Newport, apologies I was being distracted !.

 

[SWML9102]

Not sure I fully understand the question, but my preference would be 2 services per hour between Maesteg and Cardiff, with both extending east beyond Cardiff to avoid terminating at Cardiff Central, which only causes cogeston. For passengers from Maesteg, I don't think it makes a massive difference whether "further east" means via Newport or towards Ebbw Vale.

 

[The exile]

At present every service in South East Wales bar one goes to/from Cardiff. There is a good reason for that - it is where people want to get to, and can be awkward to drive and expensive to park.

The only exception is the Ebbw Vale to Newport shuttle. That was provided to complement the hourly Ebbw Vale service to Cardiff. The cost of redoubling parts of the Ebbw Vale line was £70m and a further £17m for resignalling. Not cheap. Now take a look at the loadings on the Newport - Ebbw Vale services, compared with those between Cardiff and Ebbw Vale. The Newport shuttle is way less used, and that is with only around a 10min penalty to change at Newport for Cardiff, compared with going direct. I would suggest the £87m upgrade would have been a better investment providing a second direct Cardiff service.

The same would happen with a Maesteg - Bridgend shuttle, and that has less connecting services to Cardiff from Bridgend than Newport. It is not unreasonable to expect passengers to change trains for secondary destinations (like the airport). But Cardiff is THE primary destination in this area.

I would dare to suggest that there is a bit of a difference. Although people will unsurprisingly prefer through services to Cardiff, changing at Bridgend is still “on the way” whereas Newport is “in the wrong direction” (are Ebbw Vale line - Cardiff tickets even valid via Newport? )

 

[Cardiff123]

There is even the challenge of terminating at Cardiff so the preference seems to be to run services across Cardiff.

Bringing back Platform 5 at Cardiff Central as a bay platform for terminating services from the West would help with this, and it almost happened during the Cardiff Area Signalling Renewal 10 years ago, but it didn't happen, because of, obviously, funding.

 

[SWML9102]

I would dare to suggest that there is a bit of a difference. Although people will unsurprisingly prefer through services to Cardiff, changing at Bridgend is still “on the way” whereas Newport is “in the wrong direction” (are Ebbw Vale line - Cardiff tickets even valid via Newport? )

Yes, tickets now valid either direct to Cardiff from Ebbw Vale, or via Newport. But didn't used to be the case.

Appreciate what you say, that Newport is not "on the way", but as I say only adds 10 mins, compared with a direct journey, so not that relevant. A change at Bridgend is likely to be worse, as it has a less frequent onward service to Cardiff.

 

[Mr. Angry]

Yes, tickets now valid either direct to Cardiff from Ebbw Vale, or via Newport. But didn't used to be the case.

Appreciate what you say, that Newport is not "on the way", but as I say only adds 10 mins, compared with a direct journey, so not that relevant. A change at Bridgend is likely to be worse, as it has a less frequent onward service to Cardiff.

But you would be changing onto an non-stop train between Bridgend and Cardiff.

 

[SWML9102]

But you would be changing onto an non-stop train between Bridgend and Cardiff.

Maybe...
Let's assume the shuttle between Bridgend would be a simple overlay onto the existing timetable, with times 30 mins offset from the existing Maesteg - Ebbw Vale services. That would give an xx04 arrival into P3 at Bridgend, and xx09 departure back to Maesteg.

Assuming a 4 min change is allowable at Bridgend, which would be a simple cross platform change from P3 to P2, then the connection would be into the xx08 all stops service from Pembroke Dock to Cardiff Central. However, that does not run every hour, so in the other hours you would have a 24 minute wait at Bridgend to connect into the xx28 Manchester service.

Going the other direction you would need to pick up the GWR Swansea or Carmarthen service at Cardiff, giving an 11/12 minute wait at Bridgend. Plenty of time for crossing from P1 to P3 if the GWR runs to time (my own experience is westbound GWR services are the most likely to run late between Cardiff and Bridgend). No good if you are using PAYG, in which case the preceeding train from Cardiff would be the Maesteg service anyway. And that assumes you are aware of the connection - I doubt platform announcements at Cardiff will advertise the GWR as next available service for Maesteg passengers with a change at Bridgend.

Sorry if my posts on this are negative! I just can't see it being much of a success, albeit a small improvement on the existing provision.