• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

London Buses Discussion

PGAT

Established Member
Joined
13 Apr 2022
Messages
2,121
Location
Selhurst
Is Superloop route SL12 (Gants Hill to Rainham) due to start tomorrow? I've seen from a few online sources that Saturday 4th April is the start date but nothing from TfL....
No it isn’t. That date comes from an FOI request document which includes a line saying the earliest possible date would be 4 April, however no actual date has been confirmed.

The current time floating around at the moment from more reliable sources is September. Bearing in mind the new batch of electric buses due for the route have not been built/delivered yet, and standing space still needs to be sorted at both ends.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

ChilternTurbo

Member
Joined
15 Jun 2016
Messages
323
The current time floating around at the moment from more reliable sources is September. Bearing in mind the new batch of electric buses due for the route have not been built/delivered yet, and standing space still needs to be sorted at both ends.
Thanks for that. I thought that would be very much the case as TfL usually get advance publicity and comms out. Plus the Mayor mentioning that his dad was a bus driver!
 
Joined
31 Oct 2017
Messages
78
Location
London
Is Superloop route SL12 (Gants Hill to Rainham) due to start tomorrow? I've seen from a few online sources that Saturday 4th April is the start date but nothing from TfL....
It won't be starting until September at the earliest. Anything that states SL12 starts tomorrow was a false rumour that unfortunately got spread around.
 

450.emu

Member
Joined
21 May 2015
Messages
287
Hoping that soon the SL2's new buses are on order, along with those for the SL1. Tottenham Garage are slowly rolling out their new Volvo BZL deckers, some of them have gained 26 plates now.
 

LUYMun

Established Member
Joined
15 Jul 2018
Messages
1,373
Location
Cancelled
Followers of the much-appreciated Greater London Bus Map which have been produced independently of TfL for the past 30 years has announced that it will no longer make the physical bus maps. From my email:

After 30 years of producing The Greater London Bus Map, I have decided to cease production of printed bus maps. The difficulty in obtaining accurate and up-to-date information in advance of publication, not least from TfL, coupled with my advancing years and the stress of production has meant I must call time on something that I have enjoyed creating and maintaining.

The time has come for Transport for London to once again promote the bus network, a role that in my opinion it has side-stepped for far too long. I will, however, continue to produce the digital download version of my maps, and will endeavour to update them more frequently.

I will update my newsletter subscribers when updated digital maps are available.

I am grateful to all those customers who have purchased and supported the map over the years and enabled me to raise more than £30,000 for various charities.

All existing printed editions of my map can still be purchased from my online shop, together with my historical and night map ranges.
 

J-2739

Established Member
Joined
30 Jul 2016
Messages
2,237
Location
London
Followers of the much-appreciated Greater London Bus Map which have been produced independently of TfL for the past 30 years has announced that it will no longer make the physical bus maps. From my email:
That's the first I've ever heard of this map. As someone who used to stare at bus maps as a kid, I might get myself a copy! :smile:
 

Simon75

On Moderation
Joined
25 May 2016
Messages
1,498
How come buses in London stick to 1 route all day, compared with outside London? Are there exceptions to to this?
 

MotCO

Established Member
Joined
25 Aug 2014
Messages
6,078
How come buses in London stick to 1 route all day, compared with outside London? Are there exceptions to to this?
Some buses do interwork with other routes - I recall the R3 interworking with the R4 at some stage until the Streetlites introduced were unsuitable for one of the routes so the interworking ceased. Also buses do work from day routes onto N-night routes.

However, if contracts specify new buses, then buses are specifically ordered for that route, and they tend to stick to that route. The tendering regime also tends to let contracts for a single route, so the opportunity to interwork is not always available, especially if the interworked route is lost on re-tender, and the tenders were let at different times..
 

Statto

Established Member
Joined
8 Feb 2011
Messages
4,052
Location
At home or at the pub
Followers of the much-appreciated Greater London Bus Map which have been produced independently of TfL for the past 30 years has announced that it will no longer make the physical bus maps. From my email:
That's disappointing, TFL have given up publishing maps which is a disgrace for a Capital City & massive tourist destination, think the last TFL map was 2016, the TFL spider maps can often be out of date, & there is no spider map for Uxbridge.
 

Cesarcollie

Member
Joined
5 Jun 2016
Messages
820
How come buses in London stick to 1 route all day, compared with outside London? Are there exceptions to to this?

In general terms interworking takes place to provide maximum efficiency of bus and crew schedules. In London, frequencies are such that schedules efficiency is high anyway, so there is no need for buses and drivers to move to other routes. This also reduces the potential for delays on one route to knock-on to others. This has been the case since the early days of buses in London, so it has also now generally become ‘custom and practice’ that buses and drivers stay on one route. There are, as ever, exception!
 

Snow1964

Established Member
Joined
7 Oct 2019
Messages
11,015
Location
West Wiltshire
How come buses in London stick to 1 route all day, compared with outside London? Are there exceptions to to this?
From memory, a small number of school routes are linked to a main route, and buses interwork for the approx 200 days a year they run, but generally majority of school routes are operated separately from garages.
 

fairysdad

Member
Joined
27 Dec 2010
Messages
958
Location
London, Surrey... bit of a blur round here...
Random question - does anyone happen to know why TfL have stopped the 139 stopping at Beak Street southbound? Or at least, removed it from the iBus system and websites (and busmaps.org), even if the tiles are still there and the past few days drivers have still stopped and dropped off / picked up passengers? Permanent thing or system glitch?
 

Mark L

Member
Joined
12 Dec 2023
Messages
314
Location
West London
How come buses in London stick to 1 route all day, compared with outside London? Are there exceptions to to this?
Each route is contracted separately. There are some that inter work extensively (406/418 and 209/378) but this reflects the nature of their contracts.
 
Joined
31 Oct 2017
Messages
78
Location
London
Each route is contracted separately. There are some that inter work extensively (406/418 and 209/378) but this reflects the nature of their contracts.
209 & 378 won't be for much longer, both routes are being restructured later this year which sees the 209 taking over the 533 route to Hammersmith. 209 will be going to First and the 378 is off to Transport UK.

EL1 & EL2 when both of those routes ran to Ilford up until March 2026, were interworked between each other. Since those changes where the EL2 goes to Becontree Health both routes are worked separately but of course do still run from the same garage with the same LTs.
 

Goldfish62

Veteran Member
Joined
14 Feb 2010
Messages
13,109
Each route is contracted separately. There are some that inter work extensively (406/418 and 209/378) but this reflects the nature of their contracts.
There's nothing stopping operators intetworking buses on separately contracted routes. However, it's generally not a good idea because frequencies mean there'd be little or no resource savings, plus the potential impact of delays being imported from one route to another.

Extensive interworking was tried by Bexleybus in the late 1980s and it was quickly abandoned due to being unworkable.
 

Simon75

On Moderation
Joined
25 May 2016
Messages
1,498
I believe there still some First Buses with RATP still on them, would have thought they were removed after the take over?
 

Mark L

Member
Joined
12 Dec 2023
Messages
314
Location
West London
There's nothing stopping operators intetworking buses on separately contracted routes. However, it's generally not a good idea because frequencies mean there'd be little or no resource savings, plus the potential impact of delays being imported from one route to another.

Extensive interworking was tried by Bexleybus in the late 1980s and it was quickly abandoned due to being unworkable.
There are strong commercial (and other reasons) for treating each contract as a self contained unit.
 

Statto

Established Member
Joined
8 Feb 2011
Messages
4,052
Location
At home or at the pub
TFL call it crosslinks, some routes do interwork with other routes, i remember the X68 (before it became SL6) interworking with a few routes.

This is the best one to go to, just type in the number

 

Deerfold

Veteran Member
Joined
26 Nov 2009
Messages
13,676
Location
Yorkshire
TFL call it crosslinks, some routes do interwork with other routes, i remember the X68 (before it became SL6) interworking with a few routes.

This is the best one to go to, just type in the number

Night schedules may cause confusion for those not used to the 32½ hour clock.

Surely night buses interwork with day routes, as they're not going to have a separate fleet for night buses
They generally use the same vehicles, but often there's no strict interworking. By late evening several buses will usually have finished for the day and will then be selected for Night service as it starts - but with no repeated pattern.
 
Last edited:

MotCO

Established Member
Joined
25 Aug 2014
Messages
6,078
They generally use the same vehicles, but often there's no strict interworking. By late evening several buses will usually have finished for the day and will then be selected for Night service as it starts - but with no repeated pattern.
Probably those fully charged up, or not requiring any maintenance that night.
 

Deerfold

Veteran Member
Joined
26 Nov 2009
Messages
13,676
Location
Yorkshire
Agreed, the night schedules are barmy, would think drivers sometimes get confused by them too.
I think drivers are usually given a duty card with normal times on them. These schedules are the ones the systems use. I used to have fun pulling data out of them.
 

Thirteen

Established Member
Joined
3 Oct 2021
Messages
1,888
Location
London
Does Merton garage not have fixed bus types for their various routes? The 219 uses the BYD Enviro200 as well as the GB Kite for example while the 131 uses Streetdeck and the odd Enviro400.
 

Mark L

Member
Joined
12 Dec 2023
Messages
314
Location
West London
Does Merton garage not have fixed bus types for their various routes? The 219 uses the BYD Enviro200 as well as the GB Kite for example while the 131 uses Streetdeck and the odd Enviro400.
On paper there are specific vehicle types allocated. In practice of course things may be different.
 

PGAT

Established Member
Joined
13 Apr 2022
Messages
2,121
Location
Selhurst
Does Merton garage not have fixed bus types for their various routes? The 219 uses the BYD Enviro200 as well as the GB Kite for example while the 131 uses Streetdeck and the odd Enviro400.
Sometimes yes sometimes no. There is only one GB Kite at Merton and is strictly allocated to the 219. Other than that, routes in the garage have their allocations but can see strays for a plethora of reasons.
 

Statto

Established Member
Joined
8 Feb 2011
Messages
4,052
Location
At home or at the pub
London has always had the situation were most buses stick to the routes they're allocated to, even going back to LT era, back then it was they couldn't fit all the destinations on the blind the depot served, as the blind would have been too large fit into the mechanism.
 

Thirteen

Established Member
Joined
3 Oct 2021
Messages
1,888
Location
London
I've noticed some buses like the 270 as one example are missing iBus information and just showing the time. Anyone know what the reason is?
 

Top