First Berkshire & Thames Valley

[K4016td]

Yeah... as I had mentioned before, road profile for X74 is really demanding for buses: first crawling through Slough, then onto A355 full of hills and bends, then speedy M40 bit, then crawl to Wycombe Bus Station again. You also need a bit of torque to manage these hills, but also not overheat in the traffic. I really miss Wright Solars that were great on this route - their powerful engines were a definite plus.

 

[johnsy112]

Seems like First are fully embracing the controversial AI timetables with new times for 3, 8 and X74.

X74 seems to have taken a bit of a beating with the last service out of slough at 19:55, rather than 21:00 as of currently! And some buses cut back to run only as far as Beaconsfield Services? What is the logic in that?!

Changes to timetables from 28 January 2024

Changes to timetables from Sunday 28 January 2024 From Sunday 28 January 2024, we will be introducing new timetables for services 3, 8 and X74.

bit.ly

 

[K4016td]

Looks like Carousel's 103 can be treated as a serious competition for X74 then, as the 21:05 103 from Slough to Wycombe remains unaffected. What I never understand about First is what's the point of running an empty bus every 30mins throughout the day rather than boosting frequencies at peak times only like Carousel currently does and 103 is the best example.

 

[johnsy112]

Often the case with First, is that routes run every 30 minutes through the day, and frequencies are worsened in the peak to say every 40 mins to give buses more breathing space between runs.

And definitely carousel can be taken a lot more seriously now, I find them to be more reliable also. It would be nice for them to take on the 3 between Slough and Uxbridge.

 

[wiltshirebloke]

Seems like First are fully embracing the controversial AI timetables with new times for 3, 8 and X74.

X74 seems to have taken a bit of a beating with the last service out of slough at 19:55, rather than 21:00 as of currently! And some buses cut back to run only as far as Beaconsfield Services? What is the logic in that?!

They also don't appear to be providing a summary of the changes either, just they are changing and look at the timetables..

 

[Goldfish62]

Seems like First are fully embracing the controversial AI timetables with new times for 3, 8 and X74.

X74 seems to have taken a bit of a beating with the last service out of slough at 19:55, rather than 21:00 as of currently! And some buses cut back to run only as far as Beaconsfield Services? What is the logic in that?!

Changes to timetables from 28 January 2024

Changes to timetables from Sunday 28 January 2024 From Sunday 28 January 2024, we will be introducing new timetables for services 3, 8 and X74.

bit.ly

Perhaps someone needs to tell First that producing timetables with running times varying according to traffic levels at different times of day is not a new thing and doesn't require any Artificial "Intelligence". Probably the most comprehensive example is London where schedules have had variable running time since the dawn of time.

Clearly the software is useful in producing a comprehensive data set of running times, but the schedulers appear to have simply converted this data into a timetable irrespective of how user-friendly it is. Hence you have nonsense like across three consecutive journeys the first and last have the same running time but the middle one is a few minutes less.

Also, if you're going to adopt the practice you need to accept that in order to maintain frequencies, particularly at busier times, that will cost you peak buses.

 

[GusB]

Reopened for further discussion - all yours, @Flange Squeal

 

[Flange Squeal]

First Berkshire have got begun to take delivery of a new batch of Irizar i6 coaches, with the first one being delivered having plate YR24OXF. This coach has a revised version of the RailAir livery, where the top part is in lighter blue. It has a fleet number of 25106.

Photo of the coach at Slough depot (not mine)

First Beeline 25106 - YR24 OXF

Newly delivered Irizar i6 Integral. Seen at the back of Slough depot, showing the revised RailAir livery of light blue on the front/upper half and branding on the roofline, contrasting with the metallic grey on former Truronian Caetano Levante 23651.

www.flickr.com

The above post was posted in the '24 registration buses and coaches' thread with a couple of replies regarding these replacing the Plaxton Panthers, which are reportedly earmarked to replace First South West's Plaxton Profiles.

I was wondering if anyone knew how many of these new Irizar coaches are due vs coaches potentially leaving, as we are still seeing a lot of instances of local service buses being used on the RA2 to Woking/Guildford rather than coaches matching the description of the service on the website (see quote below, my bolds). I'd therefore hope there will either be more new vehicles than older ones leaving, unless of course it's a case of the reliability of new coaches will be significantly better enough to allow a full complement of coaches to be available more often.

The coaches are smart, stylish and extremely comfortable. Sit back and relax into plush armchair seats and take advantage of the free Wi-Fi and at-seat USB charging. Some seats are set around tables, ideal for up to four people travelling together. There's plenty of room for all your luggage in the cavernous hold and there are additional racks inside located above your seat. Our drivers will help you with your luggage.

Source: RailAir website's Travel Information page - https://www.railair.com/plan-journey/travel-information

 

[cactustwirly]

Sad they have got rid of the destination adverts on the back.

"Newport to New York" and "Aberdare to Abu Dhabi" were examples

 

[johnsy112]

Sad they have got rid of the destination adverts on the back.

"Newport to New York" and "Aberdare to Abu Dhabi" were examples

Always liked these and thought they were quite cleber

 

[johnsy112]

A few tweaks in Slough

New times for Berkshire buses | FirstBusS&SW News

First Beeline buses has announced network changes for its services in Berkshire. The changes, which are part of a twice-yearly network review, come into force on Sunday 6 October.

news-ssandsw.firstbus.co.uk

Most notable being a slash in frequency on X74 to 40 minutely on Weekdays and 70 minutely on Saturdays. They have proudly stated this is for “reliabilty” reasons, a shame they didn’t fancy allocating an extra bus to help with reliability on their horrible new AI timetables.

As well as Route 7 cut to just 3 buses per hour maximum.

 

[Mag_seven]

A few tweaks in Slough

New times for Berkshire buses | FirstBusS&SW News

First Beeline buses has announced network changes for its services in Berkshire. The changes, which are part of a twice-yearly network review, come into force on Sunday 6 October.

news-ssandsw.firstbus.co.uk

Most notable being a slash in frequency on X74 to 40 minutely on Weekdays and 70 minutely on Saturdays. They have proudly stated this is for “reliabilty” reasons, a shame they didn’t fancy allocating an extra bus to help with reliability on their horrible new AI timetables.

As well as Route 7 cut to just 3 buses per hour maximum.

Thread reopened to allow updates.

 

[Flange Squeal]

The Hants & Surrey Bus News Facebook page is reporting some as yet unannounced changes to the Slough network, including the withdrawal from Maidenhead (a section of route Reading Buses’ Thames Valley subsidiary started competing on earlier in the year).

NOT YET ANNOUNCED FIRST BERKSHIRE CHANGES

Although not yet announced publicly, at least to my knowledge, reader Mark Smith has kindly given me a heads-up that looking ahead on Bustimes.org there appear to be some changes coming to the First Berkshire network, effective Sunday 7th December. These should only really be taken as a guide for now until details confirmed, but apparent highlights include...

The 6 appears to change from being a not-quite-hourly Wexham Court - Slough - Burnham (south) - Taplow - Maidenhead route, into a broadly half-hourly (Mon-Sat) Wexham Court - Slough - Trading Estate - Britwell - Burnham (northern loop) route. This adds Wexham Park Hospital along the way, but now running west of central Slough along what is currently route 12 north of the railway, rather than to/from Maidenhead south of the railway. On Sundays, it looks to be an hourly service Slough to Wexham Court route, with the western section (current route 12) not running Sundays today either. One assumes this will therefore see off the 12, if not also the peak 13 trips. The Slough - Burnham - Taplow - Maidenhead link will be maintained by Thames Valley's hourly route 704, launched earlier this year, although this doesn't currently run on Sundays.

The 7 currently runs roughly every 20 mins weekdays and half-hourly weekends Britwell - Slough - Langley - Heathrow Terminal 5. It appears that this will drop to half-hourly weekdays, increase to every 20 mins Saturdays, and remain half-hourly Sundays. The drop in weekdays look to be due to a new variant being introduced, which will provide four buses per hour over the Britwell - Slough - Langley - Heathrow (overall) section.

The 7X looks to be a new weekday service running roughly half-hourly, 0600-1715 from Britwell and 0705-1805 from Heathrow. It looks like it will run as per the 7 Britwell - Slough - Langley Academy, then rejoin the A4 rather than serving more of Langley like the 7. It will then continue to Heathrow Central Bus Station, rather than Heathrow Terminal 5.

You can view the timetables by looking at the First Berkshire page on BusTimes, selecting a route then changing the date in the URL to one after 7th December. Eg changing the end from ?date=2025-11-13 to ?date=2025-12-08

Source: https://www.facebook.com/share/1Bgj81VNxb/

 

[johnsy112]

The Hants & Surrey Bus News Facebook page is reporting some as yet unannounced changes to the Slough network, including the withdrawal from Maidenhead (a section of route Reading Buses’ Thames Valley subsidiary started competing on earlier in the year).


Source: https://www.facebook.com/share/1Bgj81VNxb/

First have confirmed these changes

They’ve confirmed route 13 has been cut, which is a shame as in its prime as route 1B the route had as many as 6 buses per hour.

I don’t think First have much time left in Slough in all honesty.

 

[K4016td]

I don’t think First have much time left in Slough in all honesty.

They're like that for the last 10 years. I was hoping that the competition from Carousel and Thames Valley will kick them out from Slough eventually, as not much is left from the former glory - but it seems the Heathrow routes and railair are keeping them afloat and profitable enough to justify their existence.

 

[RELL6L]

First have confirmed these changes

They’ve confirmed route 13 has been cut, which is a shame as in its prime as route 1B the route had as many as 6 buses per hour.

I don’t think First have much time left in Slough in all honesty.

Much though I criticise First I don’t think these changes are actually bad. Yes the 6 to Maidenhead is going but there’s already the 704 in place to replace it at a higher and mores regular frequency. The 7/7X looks positive and the 6/12 is going from silly frequencies to a better and more regular 30 minutes. The 13 is just a variation of the 12 which presumably is no longer justified. Competition to Wexham Park Hospital- or just a better range of services?

 

[Non Multi]

They're like that for the last 10 years. I was hoping that the competition from Carousel and Thames Valley will kick them out from Slough eventually, as not much is left from the former glory - but it seems the Heathrow routes and railair are keeping them afloat and profitable enough to justify their existence.

As well as the Flixbus work. The green coach runs to/from the depot are becoming a familiar sight. Only yesterday I saw a Railair coach on Flixbus duties at Hammersmith.

It's probably only a matter of time before Carousel start running something on First's Britwell - Slough - Langley corridor.

Much though I criticise First I don’t think these changes are actually bad. Yes the 6 to Maidenhead is going but there’s already the 704 in place to replace it at a higher and mores regular frequency. The 7/7X looks positive and the 6/12 is going from silly frequencies to a better and more regular 30 minutes. The 13 is just a variation of the 12 which presumably is no longer justified. Competition to Wexham Park Hospital- or just a better range of services?

They’ve confirmed route 13 has been cut, which is a shame as in its prime as route 1B the route had as many as 6 buses per hour.

SEGRO (Slough Estates GROup) must have withdrawn funding for the 13 altogether - the former LYNX/STE Hoppa 1/1b was also funded by SEGRO. They also funded a cheap £1 return adult fare between Burnham station and any destination up to Farnham Rd.

Burnham (Bucks) station loses it's bus service altogether as it was only served by the route 13. Fortunately it's only a 5 minute walk to the Bath Rd for the A4 & 704.

The TV 704 currently only runs hourly and not on Sundays - It's probably inevitable that the Carousel/Thames Valley bus war will spill onto this corridor too.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

the 6/12 is going from silly frequencies to a better and more regular 30 minutes.

The new timetable for the 6 has now been posted at https://www.firstbus.co.uk/berkshir...imetables?service=6-FB&day=mf&date=2025-12-07, and https://bustimes.org/services/6-slough-goodman-park-the-frithe-knolton-way?date=2025-12-08. Interestingly, the service now doesn't seem to serve Slough station as the 12 did, staying on Wellington Street instead, which will mean a rather longer walk from the train when I am staying at the Trading Estate Premier Inn.

 

[wiltshirebloke]

The withdrawal of the 13 through the middle of the Slough Trading Estate is quite a loss for those working within the central corridor which it provided a direct link to the Central railway station via the Three Tuns/Bath Road rather than via the northerly suburbs, and also as 'Non Multi' noted additionally Burnham Station.

There is a shuttle bus that runs from Central Slough to the A4 Bath Road, which I think is run by Stewarts, I'm not sure who funds this service as the website describes it as a contracted service, but I don't know whether thats local authority, SEGRO, or the businesses who are based on the Bath Road itself.

My wonder whether it would be possible to extend the service to Burnham station as this would provide an extra link to those businesses to Burnham Station for Elizabeth Line Services both East & West. If the route could be diverted via Leigh Road & Buckingham Avenue in some way that should attract more custom and replaced the lost 13 link. I'm not sure how many people are still employed by 02 in their offices as I think they downsized considerably over the last few years. Again I'm not sure what effect this would have on the routes PVR.

 

[markymark2000]

I don’t think First have much time left in Slough in all honesty.

It depends. The depot is currently thriving based on Heathrow funding. If Heathrow funding stopped and services were fully commercial with no external enhancement funding, I think they may struggle. Overall though, It depends on how well RailAir and Flixbus does. Can they alone sustain the costs of the depot?

Looking at things purely hypothetically here, I wonder if they cut services much more out of Slough, could they consider merging Slough with a TFL depot and have a split TFL/Country depot? Save on having multiple depots and they can make efficiency savings?

 

[Ralph Ayres]

Route 3 (Slough-Uxbridge) has been running until midnight since October thanks to funding from Bucks Council, rather than shutting down at 2000 previously. It's actually carrying a few passengers, which surprises me given the lack of on-bus publicity and no attempt to highlight the change online beyond just changing the pdf download timetable while also managing to remove the Sunday times despite the service still running. There are no new roadside timetables at least in the Uxbridge area where First are reliant on TfL to post them at stops. The comparison with the Carousel approach to publicising service improvements is striking.
The frequency has also been improved at peak times, which is a real benefit as they were often full to capacity. Having the bus sail past with the next one 40 minutes away was not a good experience!

Meanwhile of course the buses dump and pick up passengers on a grim dual carriageway in Slough as the local council still haven't done anything about the burnt shell of the former bus station next to the railway station following the fire 3 years ago. Even clearing the land and putting up a few basic shelters at the existing bays would be a start, and would probably give more protection from the weather than the fancy wavy roof did anyway.

 

[Simon75]

Didn't First have a garage in Maidenhead ?, as can't find much about like where it was, opened/closed

 

[cactustwirly]

Didn't First have a garage in Maidenhead ?, as can't find much about like where it was, opened/closed

No just Slough, but outstation the RailAir in Reading at Great Knollys Street

 

[Rebel Viking]

Didn't First have a garage in Maidenhead ?, as can't find much about like where it was, opened/closed

Thames Valley/Alder Valley/Bee Line had a depot on Staverton Way. It closed in the mid 90’s, I think when Bee Line bought out the old London Country Slough operations from Luton & District and started running everything from Slough.
There was also a bus station on Bridge Street in Maidenhead, but that was before my time so I’m not sure when that closed, maybe late 70’s or early 80’s

 

[Mark L]

No just Slough, but outstation the RailAir in Reading at Great Knollys Street

There was a garage in Maidenhead which closed in, I think, 1993 operations were then transferred to Slough which had been acquired along with the Slough operations of what was, by then, Luton & District.


Back in the day Thames (later Alder) Valley had an extensive network of routes between Slough and Maidenhead of which the 6 is the last remnant. TVs Maidenhead operation was one of the few outside London to display running numbers on the vehicles.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Back in the day Thames (later Alder) Valley had an extensive network of routes between Slough and Maidenhead of which the 6 is the last remnant. TVs Maidenhead operation was one of the few outside London to display running numbers on the vehicles

Stupid question time. What's a running number? What should I have been seeing when I got on a Maidenhead bound bus at the Three Tuns, and off at the Horse and Groom?

 

[Mark L]

Stupid question time. What's a running number? What should I have been seeing when I got on a Maidenhead bound bus at the Three Tuns, and off at the Horse and Groom?

The little metal plates on the side of a bus which show a roadside inspector where the bus sits within the overall schedule. In London they were historically carried next to the garage allocation letters but more often than not a laminated card is displayed in the windscreen these days. You can just see that plate underneath the first window of the bus in this image - https://www.flickr.com/photos/18186...pfvgc-2g81YAh-2ih7AZz-2ihbgaF-2pbc584-2gdmQeG

They are/were particularly useful on busy services where buses could end up out of sequence and in London where, historically, many routes operated from multiple garages.

I can’t recall when their use at Maidenhead ended - I don’t think any of the NBC era deliveries to Alder Valley had holders for the plates so they may just have withered on the vine, so to speak.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

The little metal plates on the side of a bus which show a roadside inspector where the bus sits within the overall schedule. In London they were historically carried next to the garage allocation letters but more often than not a laminated card is displayed in the windscreen these days. You can just see that plate underneath the first window of the bus in this image - https://www.flickr.com/photos/18186...pfvgc-2g81YAh-2ih7AZz-2ihbgaF-2pbc584-2gdmQeG

They are/were particularly useful on busy services where buses could end up out of sequence and in London where, historically, many routes operated from multiple garages.

I can’t recall when their use at Maidenhead ended - I don’t think any of the NBC era deliveries to Alder Valley had holders for the plates so they may just have withered on the vine, so to speak.

Thanks.

 

[K4016td]

An interesting registration had appeared on bustimes.org under First Berkshire from the 2nd of March under route number M40

M40 - High Wycombe BusStn - York Road (Stop V) Uxbridge Station

First Berkshire & The Thames Valley

bustimes.org

It appears that the route will run between High Wycombe and Uxbridge via M40 between Loudwater and Denham junctions.

Under the same registration it appears that the X74 will be extended from Slough to Uxbridge via Uxbridge Road, George Green and Iver Heath, following a bit of former shortlived route 7 between Slough and Uxbridge via Wexham. If you change the date manually to 2/03/26 you can see the timetable.

M40 - High Wycombe BusStn - York Road (Stop V) Uxbridge Station

First Berkshire & The Thames Valley

bustimes.org

https://bustimes.org/services/x74-slough-queensmere-high-wycombe-bus-station?date=2026-03-02&service=56674:X74

Looks like an attempt to curtail recent Carousel Buses competition on the Uxbridge corridor?

 

[Flange Squeal]

The extension of the X74 from Slough to Uxbridge via a more direct route, cutting end-to-end journey times by 10-20 mins compared to First’s 3 and Carousel’s new competitive 458, doesn’t surprise me as I believe there is demand end-to end. It can also be achieved by increasing the X74’s current peak vehicle requirement from four to six.

The addition of the M40 intrigues me more though, as it looks to essentially run non-stop from the outskirts of High Wycombe to central Uxbridge, given there’s not exactly much along the final stretch of road between the M40 Junction 1 and Uxbridge Station. Is there really that much end-to-end demand for a fast High Wycombe to Uxbridge service? Do many people travel High Wycombe to Uxbridge to then access the tube network? Sure, Carousel’s 102 takes a lot longer, but it does serve other markets along the way then continues to Heathrow Airport. It’ll be interesting to see how many a fast High Wycombe to Uxbridge service actually attracts.

My calculations also suggest this combined X75/M40 operation will require nine vehicles, so more than double the X74’s current four, and three more than just extending the X74 to Uxbridge (six). This is based on presumed interworking in High Wycombe, with buses doing X74 to Uxbridge and back, then M40 to Uxbridge and back, and so on (this seems to be what the typical off peak timings suggest to me, and allows for driver changeovers in Slough rather than run the M40 as an isolated three vehicle route with short Wycombe turnaround). For example:

- X74: 0915 High Wycombe to Uxbridge (1030)
- X74: 1040 Uxbridge to High Wycombe (1155)
- M40: 1210 High Wycombe to Uxbridge (1246)
- M40: 1300 Uxbridge to High Wycombe (1336)
- Back out at 1345 on route X74

One assumes the 3 will continue, rather than First give up on the slower route so soon? Although it didn't take that long for them to give up on the Maidenhead to Slough corridor after Thames Valley launched their 704.