East-West Rail (EWR): Consultation updates [not speculation]

[Mag_seven]

Just another reminder that posts in this thread should be confined to consultation updates only.

 

[Class 170101]

From BBC News today

Council 'shocked' by East West Rail plans to demolish more homes

East West Railway proposes removing a further 10 properties in Bedford to make way for a new line.

www.bbc.co.uk

A council said it is "shocked and disgusted" after learning more properties are set to be demolished to make way for a railway line

East West Rail (EWR) initially proposed demolishing 37 properties in Bedfordshire, but at a meeting on Tuesday, Bedford Borough Council was told a further 10 buildings, including flats and a GP surgery, are at risk.

An EWR spokesperson said that the proposed design changes "will be unsettling", but that it will be visiting residents to "explain our proposals in person".

 

[Magdalia]

From BBC News today

I was particularly interested in this comment in the BBC report:

In their statement, EWR described its plans for an enlarged Bedford Station as "ambitious and transformative".

It added: "The proposed demolition of properties, while difficult, is necessary to significantly reduce construction time - by up to three years. This means the benefits of the new station can be delivered sooner, with less disruption over time."

One thing I picked up in a discussion at one of the non statutory consultation meetings was that work at Bedford and Cambridge determine the construction timetable critical path.

At the end the BBC also links to another article from 3 July with more up to date information on Universal's plans see here:

In their planning documents, Universal has earmarked land for a bespoke station on the line outside their proposed resort.

Universal UK could feature Europe's tallest rides

New plans show the theme park firm wants to compete with attractions across Europe.

www.bbc.co.uk

The documents make clear that Universal chose the site at Kempston Hardwick, Bedfordshire, because of its transport links.

Visitors from abroad can easily fly to airports in London or Luton before driving or taking a train to the resort.

The proposals mention a new railway station could also be built on the East West Rail line, which links Oxford and Cambridge via Bedford, but planning permission is not being sought for this yet.

 

[BrianW]

From BBC News today

Council 'shocked' by East West Rail plans to demolish more homes

East West Railway proposes removing a further 10 properties in Bedford to make way for a new line.

www.bbc.co.uk

This can hardly be a surprise. The plans for redevelopment of Bedford Station, including its entrance, environs and link to the town centre have long been 'signalled'. IIUC no plans have yet been finalised; no building is yet 'scehduled for demolition', indeed the report states: 'The council said the properties at risk ...' note 'at risk'. I recognise that the days of large scale demolition have gone, but either Bedford wants a new station or it doesn't. Does it want EWR?

 

[Class 170101]

Does it want EWR?

Yes, but not in the way proposed. It wants EWR kept to the 'south' of the town aligned more closely to the old Varsity Line. This puts Bedford on the north point of a triangle with the line running east to west to the south of the town so trains calling at Bedford Midland would have to come from the south and reverse out south.

I think historically Bedford Midland wasn't technically on the Varsity Line but at the nearby station of Bedford St John's though NOT the current station of that name.

 

[BrianW]

Yes, but not in the way proposed. It wants EWR kept to the 'south' of the town aligned more closely to the old Varsity Line. This puts Bedford on the north point of a triangle with the line running east to west to the south of the town so trains calling at Bedford Midland would have to come from the south and reverse out south.

I think historically Bedford Midland wasn't technically on the Varsity Line but at the nearby station of Bedford St John's though NOT the current station of that name.

Is that the settled view of Bedford Borough Council? Is that a basis on which EWR might develop (change?) its plans; might it prolong (or reduce) the uncertainties of residents of the Poets area to the north of the station?

Opposition by the council will only prolong and increase anxieties, and maybe kick progress to Cambridge into the long grass-maybe that's what Bedford residents voted for. Will they prevail against government plans for growth?

 

[Magdalia]

This puts Bedford on the north point of a triangle with the line running east to west to the south of the town so trains calling at Bedford Midland would have to come from the south and reverse out south.

Reversing in and out of Bedford would not happen, just like it is not going to happen at Milton Keynes.

I think historically Bedford Midland wasn't technically on the Varsity Line but at the nearby station of Bedford St John's though NOT the current station of that name.

This is historically correct, but not relevant to the EWR proposals. The old Varsity Line closed almost 60 years ago, even I'm not old enough to remember it. EWR is to serve 21st century economic growth in the Oxford-Cambridge corridor, not to replicate 19th and 20th century history.

maybe kick progress to Cambridge into the long grass

The strong impression I get is that the revised EWR proposals for Bedford are driven by the desire to move more quickly, not more slowly. Both the Treasury and Universal will be pushing hard on this.

 

[jfowkes]

The Ashburnham Road buildings are quite a way to the east of the existing station footprint. I'm surprised they need that much space. Are EWRs proposals publicly available?
If the land was going to be used to make EWR or the station better for everyone then I probably be okay with the disruption to people's lives that the demolition will cause. But it's harder to get behind the "this will make construction quicker" argument.

 

[Magdalia]

The Ashburnham Road buildings are quite a way to the east of the existing station footprint.

That depends on your definition of "quite a way".

Given the need to take the EWR tracks through on the east side of the MML the station footprint is going to extend "quite a way" further east than now.

If the land was going to be used to make EWR or the station better for everyone then I probably be okay with the disruption to people's lives that the demolition will cause. But it's harder to get behind the "this will make construction quicker" argument.

I get to see a lot of modern construction projects in progress, including Cambridge South station and various new buildings on the Biomedical Campus. Work can proceed remarkably quickly but that requires good access to get raw materials in and waste products out. It also needs plenty of space for staff accommodation, storage of plant and equipment and storage of raw materials.

Compared to Cambridge South or the Biomedical Campus, Bedford station is a constrained urban site. It is more similar to the Crossrail sites such as Farringdon or Tottenham Court Road, both of which involved large scale demolition of existing properties.

Being able to demolish properties adjacent to the station will definitely make construction much quicker.

 

[camflyer]

This can hardly be a surprise. The plans for redevelopment of Bedford Station, including its entrance, environs and link to the town centre have long been 'signalled'. IIUC no plans have yet been finalised; no building is yet 'scehduled for demolition', indeed the report states: 'The council said the properties at risk ...' note 'at risk'. I recognise that the days of large scale demolition have gone, but either Bedford wants a new station or it doesn't. Does it want EWR?

Unfortunate for those affected - and they need to be fully compensated - but you can't expect the redevelopment and expansion of a town centre railway station without some properties needing to be be demolished.

Bedford really should be one of the big winners from EWR with direct services opening up to Cambridge and Oxford and being at the centre of the Ox-Cam Arc - plus the Universal theme park development. There should be huge economic benefits for the town.

 

[BrianW]

Unfortunate for those affected - and they need to be fully compensated - but you can't expect the redevelopment and expansion of a town centre railway station without some properties needing to be be demolished.

Bedford really should be one of the big winners from EWR with direct services opening up to Cambridge and Oxford and being at the centre of the Ox-Cam Arc - plus the Universal theme park development. There should be huge economic benefits for the town.

Is that what Bedford Borough Council wants? If so they will need to be more open to the need for development, including redevelopment. Much local 'government' has been infected by NIMBYism- 'the voice of the people'. EWR is not 'democraticly eleected'. The Labour Government may not have long in which to get 'facts on the ground'.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Unfortunate for those affected - and they need to be fully compensated - but you can't expect the redevelopment and expansion of a town centre railway station without some properties needing to be be demolished.

Given the massive street level car parks and depot around Bedford station I think you easily could expect that. A bit of local knowledge does help when it comes to this. Yes you'd lose parking but that could be replaced by going multi storey, it's all street level at present.

 

[Robin Edwards]

In the greater scheme of EWR - the route in & out of Bedford to Cambridge has been under debate for 30+ years so regardless of what Bedford Borough Council or it's residents still want, I think it's indicative that uncertainty over selection of a route has taken so long and still now, may get changed again?

 

[Trainbike46]

Given the massive street level car parks and depot around Bedford station I think you easily could expect that. A bit of local knowledge does help when it comes to this. Yes you'd lose parking but that could be replaced by going multi storey, it's all street level at present.

Or you know, lose the parking. Especially if it is temporary for construction compounds and access, that seems entirely acceptable.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Or you know, lose the parking. Especially if it is temporary for construction compounds and access, that seems entirely acceptable.

Thus spake someone who doesn't understand how a lot of people commute in the South East. Losing parking entirely would not be an option. Going multi storey absolutely would though.

 

[Trainbike46]

Thus spake someone who doesn't understand how a lot of people commute in the South East. Losing parking entirely would not be an option. Going multi storey absolutely would though.

I know lots of people drive to stations to take the train into London, if that is what you mean. You state there is lots of parking, I wasn't suggesting taking anything beyond what is necessary for station construction.

 

[zwk500]

Given the massive street level car parks and depot around Bedford station I think you easily could expect that. A bit of local knowledge does help when it comes to this. Yes you'd lose parking but that could be replaced by going multi storey, it's all street level at present.

Given the constraints at either end of Bedford Station and the use of the slow line platforms for Thameslink I think it would be unreasonable to suggest it is possible to add another railway without affecting any properties outside the railway boundary at all.
Whether that involves demolition and if EWR are proposing doing more than the minimum though is another question.

 

[jfowkes]

If they do demolish, are they required to build/provide suitable replacements? I have no idea how these kind of things work.

 

[Brubulus]

The article specifically mentions Dom Polski and Ashburnham Road, surgery, to give a sense of where these buildings are located relative to the railway and station.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not at all sure why those would need to be demolished, there's clearly room for another two tracks well away from those properties.

On the other hand neither of those buildings is of particular architectural merit.

 

[Brubulus]

Not at all sure why those would need to be demolished, there's clearly room for another two tracks well away from those properties.

On the other hand neither of those buildings is of particular architectural merit.

The cost of purchasing and demolishing the buildings will need to be balanced against the costs of a more constrained work site. If it requires a longer construction period or the use of specialized equipment/more line closures, that can tilt the balance in favour of demolition, but that can then cause planning delays and associated costs.

 

[mwmbwls]

Compulsory purchase and compensation: guide 4 - compensation to residential owners and occupiers

Guidance about compensation to owners and occupiers of residential properties once a compulsory purchase order comes into force.

www.gov.uk

This document sets out the general principles as to how compensation is calculated. This is a complex topic with various processes for individuals and corporate bodies.

I would expect Bedford Council to have views on this matter but that this may end up as a Government decision.

 

[edwin_m]

Not at all sure why those would need to be demolished, there's clearly room for another two tracks well away from those properties.

On the other hand neither of those buildings is of particular architectural merit.

I guess they want to clear the whole block to make a clear site for the station and parking.

 

[JamesT]

Not at all sure why those would need to be demolished, there's clearly room for another two tracks well away from those properties.

On the other hand neither of those buildings is of particular architectural merit.

The EWR website page for Bedford https://eastwestrail.co.uk/your-area/bedford has:

We are considering a range of work for Bedford station including rebuilding the station building, creating a new station plaza, constructing footbridges and two new platforms (reduced from the three shown in previous proposals), and providing replacement car parking, all to give passengers the best possible experience.

I could certainly see if the footprint of the current station was pushed out by the width of a couple of tracks that it’s encroaching on the car parks at the back of the properties on Ashburnham Road. Given talk of enlarging the station and putting a public square out the front that could easily need those properties demolished.

 

[London Trains]

Deleted

 

[LMS 4F]

Yes, but not in the way proposed. It wants EWR kept to the 'south' of the town aligned more closely to the old Varsity Line. This puts Bedford on the north point of a triangle with the line running east to west to the south of the town so trains calling at Bedford Midland would have to come from the south and reverse out south.

I think historically Bedford Midland wasn't technically on the Varsity Line but at the nearby station of Bedford St John's though NOT the current station of that name.

Bedford St John’s was next to London Road, Bedford, and to the west was the flat 90 degree crossing with the Hitchin line
that started at Midland Road.
i caught many trains from St John’s in the 50s and 60s in both directions. The last time was in July 1963 on a trip to Cambridge to enlist as a boy soldier.

 

[mwmbwls]

In the greater scheme of EWR - the route in & out of Bedford to Cambridge has been under debate for 30+ years so regardless of what Bedford Borough Council or it's residents still want, I think it's indicative that uncertainty over selection of a route has taken so long and still now, may get changed again?

“It must be remembered that there is nothing more difficult to plan, more doubtful of success, nor more dangerous to manage, than the creation of a new system. For the initiator has the enmity of all who would profit by the preservation of the old institutions and merely lukewarm defenders in those who would gain by the new ones.” Niccolo Machiavelli is alive and well in living in Bedford.

The plans for East West rail as a key element of the Oxford Cambridge arc predate the announcement of the construction of Universal leisure complex and have been controversial in the City of Bedford, The directly elected City Mayor lives east of the city and has views about the overall routing of the line. The only general consensus about new railway facilities is the need for a new station at Wixams servicing Thameslink trains.

The home counties are in general sensitised to new infrastructure projects as evidenced by the protracted disputes concerning HS2 and the ability of the internet to link up opposition. For those interested in the gritty detail of how to cope the political opposition to new rail infrastructure, I commend Sally Gimson’s new book about HS2 = “Off the Rails” ISBN 978 1 83643 017 9

 

[Railwaysceptic]

In all the discussion and consultation about EW Rail in the Bedford area, has the idea of a triangular junction with the Midland Main Line been suggested? This would enable freight trains to access the very lightly-used slow lines north of Bedford and avoid Soham and Ely.

 

[Robin Edwards]

“It must be remembered that there is nothing more difficult to plan, more doubtful of success, nor more dangerous to manage, than the creation of a new system. For the initiator has the enmity of all who would profit by the preservation of the old institutions and merely lukewarm defenders in those who would gain by the new ones.” Niccolo Machiavelli is alive and well in living in Bedford.

The plans for East West rail as a key element of the Oxford Cambridge arc predate the announcement of the construction of Universal leisure complex and have been controversial in the City of Bedford, The directly elected City Mayor lives east of the city and has views about the overall routing of the line. The only general consensus about new railway facilities is the need for a new station at Wixams servicing Thameslink trains.

The home counties are in general sensitised to new infrastructure projects as evidenced by the protracted disputes concerning HS2 and the ability of the internet to link up opposition. For those interested in the gritty detail of how to cope the political opposition to new rail infrastructure, I commend Sally Gimson’s new book about HS2 = “Off the Rails” ISBN 978 1 83643 017 9

I don't under estimate the difficulties however the impact over decades on those who might be impacted where governments and councils haven't been decisive is not to be under-estimated. Thirty years ago the EWR consortium was managing communications to the villages on the original varsity routs between Bedford and Sandy/Cambridge on the basis that there would be a return to trains running on what is now Sustrans Route 51 cycle path.

 

[weeklycommuter]

Bedford Council made clear in their following response to the 2019 East West Rail Consultation that they wanted East West Rail to call at Bedford Station in the centre of Bedford and not bypass Bedford to the South. This was option E and was accepted as it clearly offered the best connectivity for East West Rail. There were other options which bypassed Bedford and connected with a Bedford South Station but Bedford Council opposed this for the reasons stated. Bedford Council really should have anticipated that some buildings close to the railway could be affected by the development of the new East West railway if it served the existing Bedford Station in the centre of Bedford and they need to work with East West Rail to get this new railway built as soon as possible.

https://www.bedford.gov.uk/files/190325-ewr-letterfinal-002.pdf/download?inline

Therefore the Council’s view can be summarised as follows,
• That EWR should connect with the centre of Bedford and that any Bedford south station does not achieve this objective
• That any proposed interchange with the Wixams is significantly more complex than has been presented in the consultation documents and in our opinion, is undeliverable in the available footprint
• That a connection into Bedford Midland is deliverable with significantly reduced costs to those put forward by EWR Company, and given the improved economic performance and connectivity, that this should be the preferred route.
In addition, we would like to reiterate the following comments which were addressed in our original response,
• The opportunity to create a national and regional transport hub which has the potential to benefit the Oxford Cambridge Arc and the East Midlands will be missed if there is no connection to Bedford Midland
• A connection to Bedford Midland will deliver 12% more economic benefits to Bedford, and EWR generally than a southern route, and that by contrast a southern option would damage the town’s competitiveness and future development
• A connection which directly serves the centre of Bedford meets the DfT’s strategic aim to ‘provide rail links between key urban areas’
• A station serving the centre of Bedford would support regeneration in the town and the delivery of the Town Centre Masterplan, including the area around the station
• A station in central Bedford provides access to jobs and leisure opportunities for people within existing and expanded settlements served by the railway
• The new rail market provided by EWR Western Section between Oxford and Bedford will be lost if a southern option is selected
• A route serving Bedford Midland will best support additional new growth. Developments to the south of Bedford are already committed and have been factored into current service patterns.