Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Pendolinos are like that. The intermediates are roughly 24m and the end vehicles roughly 25m. You can do that in UK loading gauge provided you taper the nose.
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HS2 Class 895s (Hitachi Alstom High-Speed)
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Pendolinos are like that. The intermediates are roughly 24m and the end vehicles roughly 25m. You can do that in UK loading gauge provided you taper the nose.
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I feel like every time I end up on one I can't see out the window as the pillars are so wide and I end up with a seat beside a pillar. Coupled with the small size of the windows they feel a bit claustrophobic to me.And you say we're in for a treat ? I agree with you, I love the Pendolinos, there's something so "solid" and "tactile" about the whole thing/experience, they just feel like a lovely quality train through and through, nothing cheap or rattly. Just love them, especially in the new Avanti livery, there's something so special about seeing them pull into the modernist Euston with their sleek lines and elegant colours and knowing you're going to be whizzing through the British countryside at 125mph on a magic tilting ride
Hopefully the HS2 stock will be better in this regard though I read previously it has already been decided not to align the seats with the windows for HS2
Indeed, but interestingly one thing I've noticed in the artist rendering of the 895s is that there might be a subtle tapering at the end of each coach similar to what we see on the 80x trains. It's hard to tell though on a second glance, but ultimately I still expect them to be uniform coach lengths with the nose not quite as streamlined as it's Italian counterpart. Allegedly the Pendolino design was originally going to be tapered like a Shinkansen but had to be scaled back, a design choice that I actually think works for the better.
I was told this at the HS2 event in Derby relating to the 895s.
This was referenced as part of the reason for no platform-edge doors, as the doors at the end units would be either further apart or closer together than the plug doors across the rest of the train's coaches, so any platform door system would require additional complexity both in terms of ensuring stopping positions are accurate, and additional doors to account for different unit lengths, coupled units, etc.
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Yes, the middle carriages also had tapering at the vestibule ends in the door mock-ups.
Thank you very much for clarifying!
With regards to platform-edge doors I don't really think they're as important to long-distance high-speed rail services compared to frequent high-capacity metros anyway, so not having them doesn't seem like too great a loss. In fact I don't think I've seen them be used anywhere other than Japan, and that's only at stations where Shinkansen trains pass the platforms at high-speed rather than a middle set of tracks (which I believe will be the case with HS2).
Yes, I agree. It's not that big of a deal not to have them, especially if it causes complexity like this.
It would have been nice, though, given HS2 will largely work off of automatic train operation with ETCS L2.
240W won't be on train USB ports, and even dedicated chargers rarely have that high of a wattage. 60W is the plausible maximum, but having used USB Type A ports on trains, I'd bet on 12W at most. The vast majority of the time you're better off using a proper plug socket, and that's not just limited to trains.
rmHawk765
Member
Yes, it will be a right headache timetabling them to just about fit in without causing delays to WCML services. And I suspect any slight delay will cause a domino effect (like it already often has).
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
Have you not seen where it’s been stated, many times, that they used bland colours for the mock up deliberately, to keep the focus on the design and not the colour scheme, which will be finalised at a later date?
You reckon the interiors will have anything other than brilliant white lighting?
I will bet fifty pounds the interior will be almost exactly as shown.
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
I emboldened grey and white, not the part about the lighting.
I will bet fifty pounds the final interior will not have any colour beyond any that is necessary for visual accessibility. The claim that the reason it’s grey and boring at its first public reveal is 4D chess is not worthy of belief by anyone who has been following the rapid decline of ambience in train interiors in Britain.
It really is a horrific, soulless project despite being absolutely necessary. It’s like watching a major sewer being built.
I sort of disagree because at the very least sewers aren't really supposed to be anything beyond functional and will be unpleasant by their very nature but are still crucial pieces of infrastrucutre. But a new flagship high-speed train is there for all to see and something we have a vested interest in actively encouraging people to use, therefore it should actually have a duty to be comfortable and pleasant to travel on as well as functional and accessible. I have rather fond memories of travelling on the Frecciarossa (sadly not alone in Executive like you did though) and I hope the 895s at least try to be that good, but I kind of share the dread that they'll end up feeling much too clinical and lifeless.
With sufficient boarding area markers on platforms (including north of Crewe), this probably won't have a negative effect, but it still feels unnatural. Perhaps people already used to seat assignments won't have this feeling.
Go on any modern vehicle and you'll see it's just how modern design is. The bold and colourful designs that were prevalent ten years ago now look horrifically dated - just go on the P&O Spirit of France and you'll see what I mean.
You don't have a problem with the trains themselves, you just don't like modern design. That's okay, I long for the return of the Aqua/Aero look myself, but it isn't a valid criticism of the train itself.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
I actually quite like the colour scheme they have used. The grey around the windows adds a bit of class over beige or white (I think that works really well on the Lizzie 345s). Indeed the scheme seems rather close to that!
(Yes I know that it isn't necessarily finalised - but I'd be quite happy if it was!)
FWIW the Pioneer (the newish double ended ferry) has an interior scheme straight out of Ikea, but I really do like it, it's quite classy. Maybe more fake wood would help?
Any modern vehicle *where*? There isn’t a global standard for “boring interior”.
Well, it is - are you suggesting the interior isn’t part of the train?
Which components of the train actually count as part of it in your view? The brakes? Driver’s console? Overhead racks? Accessible toilet door?
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
You say boring, I say classy.
There is boring out there, the original GWR 800 interior was beyond drab with that horrible lime green which just reminds me of grab poles in 1990s buses. But the Class 345 interior to me is *classy*, and this is basically a near copy. It's also quite similar to the ICE interior but without the very 1990s chrome accents.
I disagree about grey looking classy. It works for the Class 345 interior but I feel like for a flagship high-speed train we need something a bit less industrial. Something like a bronze chrome colour. Not quite as expensive or extravagant as gold but also not so dull and common as grey, and something that still looks good with predominantly white interior panelling. I can't quite put a name on the colour so do excuse me if it's a bit hard to imagine.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
I know exactly what you mean and it belongs in about 1995. Emirates have that sort of scheme in their premium classes and it looks hideous.
I wasn't thinking of the fake wooden panelling, I was thinking more metallic. On second thoughts I'm not too sure about the idea anyway, and seeing another Italian train interior actually warmed me up to darker colours on the window pillars, but the interior will definitely need the right carpet, seat and table colours to make it work.
I've been on the Pioneer and Liberte very frequently and while the first impressions have been good, I actually really dislike them now. The interiors are very low-quality and P&O aren't very good at maintaining it. There are doors that don't open and close properly, collapsed seats, exposed wires, smashed screens, etcetera. The Spirit of Britain and France, while dated, were built to a much higher standard. And now that the Spirit of Britain is with Irish Ferries as the Oscar Wilde, their improved maintenance has really fixed up the mistreatment P&O gave it.
You misunderstood my post completely. I'm saying that the interior of the trains themselves isn't the issue; rather you don't like modern design trains that aren't just found in the 895s.
I dislike the ambience of some British modern train designs, yes. Not all “modern design” (I’m not sure what you mean by this or in what context - other types of design are available if you look more than 1000 miles from home!)
A number has to be chosen anyway, so why not have some thinking behind it…
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Copper ?
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I was thinking of something along those lines, but also slightly leaning towards a lighter bronze tint. But for these kind of colours it'd probably be best kept for trimmings rather than the predominant panelling.
Yes, copper accents are usually pretty nice if done properly.
London Trains
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Are you suggesting it's sensible to remove further seats on the off chance a third buggy user who can't fold the buggy boards that part of the train? While I'm sure your intentions are honourable I don't think the space would be used by buggies. Most people with them can fold them up or fit them in the available space.
Now if you were suggesting a dedicated children's section with something other than a bare carpet and a wall, plus seating / nursing area then maybe that'd make more sense.
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