Arriva (Beds, Bucks, Herts)

[Voyager 2953]

A quick read of the Oxford and Chiltern Bus Page shows Carousel’s plans to further expand their operations in Wycombe and the surrounding areas. It’s really impressive and shows the right people in the right places can do the right things.

The frequency on the 850 is now doubled albeit with the 800 having departed but the CrossTown services are showing all the right signs now that they have reverted to their original form.

 

[Foxhound87]

A quick read of the Oxford and Chiltern Bus Page shows Carousel’s plans to further expand their operations in Wycombe and the surrounding areas. It’s really impressive and shows the right people in the right places can do the right things.

The frequency on the 850 is now doubled albeit with the 800 having departed but the CrossTown services are showing all the right signs now that they have reverted to their original form.

Where are you reading Carousel’s plans for further expansion, all I can see in the latest issue is the regular noncesense from Peter Cartwright?

The investment Buckinghamshire Council have put in to pump-priming frequency enhancements in High Wycombe, first with Arriva and then with Carousel, really is impressive.

Of course the frequency between Wycombe and Reading was already every 30 minutes in Arriva’s post-pandemic timetable, and now both buses per hour take the slightly more convoluted routing via Twyford, but it’s good to see the increased frequency to Henley that the Council have been working towards for some time now take shape. Are Carousel still running deckers on the 850 through journeys?

The re-linking of services across town is interesting, I wonder if this has had an impact on Carousel’s concessionary patronage. If so it might explain Mr Marion’s request for a significant per passenger increase in reimbursement.

 

[RELL6L]

Are Carousel still running deckers on the 850 through journeys?

Yes, normally 6 deckers and 5 singles on the 11 boards during the week. Typically deckers work all the boards that leave the two termini between 07.00 and 07.50, singles the others. Saturdays mostly deckers, Sundays entirely. Deckers just the Scanias, never seen an E400, either they are too high or too likely to break down.

With the new timetable next week the improved service may be adequate all round and no deckers will be used - we'll see on Monday.

 

[SteveHFC]

I guess the letter D has been forgotten about then haha. And yeah, I agree, didn't look at that part of the timetable haha, but I wouldn't be surprised in the future if the 23 gets withdrawn from Linmere because I think the Jo will make journey times a lot faster.

Having seen the 23 (and before that the 28) arriving and departing from outside the Lidl Warehouse, I would say that it is getting a steady flow of passengers at Linmere, particularly at shift change times and is worth continuing with. It does, of course, depend where the passengers are coming from.

 

[Haywain]

I think the Jo will make journey times a lot faster.

Faster journey times are no help if they're not at the times that people need them.

 

[Voyager 2953]

I’m told more changes coming in April; this time involving the X4, F70 and F77. Makes me wonder if they will do away with the X4 or at least part of it and divert one of the F(s) to Aylesbury. The X4 from the outside looking in must be loosing a lot of money; most people now use the 100 due to the constant altering of what was once a well used route.

On the plus side; there seems to be a plan in place to alter some of the fleets at the most neglected garages. I believe they have taken delivery of some classic and MMC Enviros.

 

[greenline712]

I’m told more changes coming in April

intalink reports changes on 20 April in Hemel Hempstead and Watford involving Routes 2 (Hemel town); 20; 320; 322 . . . all "timetable changes".
No idea what they might be . . . these routes either run quite well or appallingly badly, I suspect depending on the M25.

It would be nice if HH Garage got some newer buses . . . still plenty of 09-plate saloons in service.

 

[Voyager 2953]

MX09 LXN replaces 4102 at Milton Keynes which heads over to Luton. I believe the Olympus’ will all eventually leave Milton Keynes creating a standard type at both Milton Keynes and Luton garages.

 

[778]

intalink reports changes on 20 April in Hemel Hempstead and Watford involving Routes 2 (Hemel town); 20; 320; 322 . . . all "timetable changes".
No idea what they might be . . . these routes either run quite well or appallingly badly, I suspect depending on the M25.

It would be nice if HH Garage got some newer buses . . . still plenty of 09-plate saloons in service.

The 2 is changing to a 30 minute service Monday - Fridays non schooldays and Saturdays, and every 60 minutes on Sundays. I have included the link that shows the changes to the timetables from April.

I would not be surprised if Sunday buses will disappear completely from Hemel at some point.

www.intalink.org.uk/april-2025

 

[riceuten]

Seems like most of the services in question are being reduced from 3 an hour to 2 an hour. And, long rumoured but only confirmed yesterday, Arriva are ditching the 133 route from Braintree to Stansted.

Is this the iSquared owned company that was going to invest in buses and not just asset strip it? I think we should be told.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Seems like most of the services in question are being reduced from 3 an hour to 2 an hour. And, long rumoured but only confirmed yesterday, Arriva are ditching the 133 route from Braintree to Stansted.

Is this the iSquared owned company that was going to invest in buses and not just asset strip it? I think we should be told.

In terms of Colchester, there's precious there to asset strip. Just that they're being forced off in a battle by First.

 

[robert west]

Seems like most of the services in question are being reduced from 3 an hour to 2 an hour. And, long rumoured but only confirmed yesterday, Arriva are ditching the 133 route from Braintree to Stansted.

Is this the iSquared owned company that was going to invest in buses and not just asset strip it? I think we should be told.

will the arriva colchester 132 go as well

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

will the arriva colchester 132 go as well

As they're placement journeys for the 133.... yup

 

[robert west]

As they're placement journeys for the 133.... yup

Thought so thanks for confirming

 

[riceuten]

Interestingly one of the comments complaining about the axing of the 133 was answered by Arriva’s Facebook team pointed out that the X20 (First) covered broadly the same route.

 

[Foxhound87]

Is this the iSquared owned company that was going to invest in buses and not just asset strip it? I think we should be told.

Think you should be told what? iSquared are an investment fund, and while there is a lot of investment going in to fleet elsewhere I very much doubt they have any involvement in day to day operations in Hertfordshire.

Is it time to split this thread, with the Hertfordshire depots having been part of Southern Counties and the Beds & Bucks depots being part of Midlands for a number of years now? There are already separate threads for these areas.

 

[espicer]

Having seen the 23 (and before that the 28) arriving and departing from outside the Lidl Warehouse, I would say that it is getting a steady flow of passengers at Linmere, particularly at shift change times and is worth continuing with. It does, of course, depend where the passengers are coming from.

Steady flow at shift times yes, other times no.

MX09 LXN replaces 4102 at Milton Keynes which heads over to Luton. I believe the Olympus’ will all eventually leave Milton Keynes creating a standard type at both Milton Keynes and Luton garages.

Yes, all Olympuses at MK have now gone to Luton except for 4104, which is still at MK but isn't moving. Despite tracking on bustimes, it isn't 4104. 4101/3 are in maintenance at Luton and 4102/5 have entered service in Luton. I have heard all MX09 and CX58 E400s at Leicester are coming to Milton Keynes, but haven't had that confirmed, but I have heard that the Olympuses are coming to Luton for the 321/721 to be double-decker allocated, which Arriva promised in 2024!

 

[PeterC]

The 2 is changing to a 30 minute service Monday - Fridays non schooldays and Saturdays, and every 60 minutes on Sundays. I have included the link that shows the changes to the timetables from April.

I would not be surprised if Sunday buses will disappear completely from Hemel at some point.

www.intalink.org.uk/april-2025

I have also heard a rumour that the X5 is due for withdrawal in May although with a timetable change in April that seems a little odd. Red Eagle are introducing a competing service in April.

 

[Voyager 2953]

I have also heard a rumour that the X5 is due for withdrawal in May although with a timetable change in April that seems a little odd. Red Eagle are introducing a competing service in April.

Hopefully it doesn’t go the same way as Wycombe and Aylesbury with Red Eagle starting their new service.

Very sad that Carousel have made such inroads in High Wycombe and the surrounding areas where Arriva simply could not manage to. This actually needs addressing.

I feel Arriva have two options here; make the X5 an attractive service by tarting up the buses or ensuring a consistent allocation of double decks, making them look presentable or they can throw in the towel and quit while their ahead. The Arriva brand countrywide is an awful one and one that people have no trust in expect if you live in Leicester or Derby.

The Red Eagle service was initially to be run by Red Rose back in September however for what ever reason it wasn’t registered. The Red group must certainly have optimism that they can compete with Arriva on that corridor. It could end up badly for either operator.

I’ve heard the X4 is to undergo a change in April. I imagine it will be cut and one of the F routes will go via Heath and Reach to Milton Keynes, while one of the L routes could extend into Aylesbury and another into Bletchley. Wild guesses so who knows.

 

[espicer]

I have also heard a rumour that the X5 is due for withdrawal in May although with a timetable change in April that seems a little odd. Red Eagle are introducing a competing service in April.

I believe, personally, that the X5 will be withdrawn as, apparently, Hemel never really wanted to run the route and has been trying to get rid of it for a while. What I am concerned about is Red Eagle's fleet being solely Enviro 200s. They've just bought two more for the 500 route. I don't see how those buses will cope compared to Arriva, which has bigger buses.

I have also seen that Arriva are extending the 31 to serve Farley Hill, which seems pretty ludicrous to me as I am not sure where the demand for that has come from! I am interested to see how long that will last, I feel like it will be similar to when the 28/29 ran to Farley Hill and the 27 ran to Stopsley - not last long, then get reverted. I have seen a lot of demand for the 24 to be re-extended to Dunstable, but seems that that isn't going to be acted upon anytime soon, which is frustrating.

 

[778]

I believe the X5 will be withdrawn as, apparently, Hemel never really wanted to run the route and has been trying to get rid of it for a while. What I am concerned about is Red Eagle's fleet being solely Enviro 200s. They've just bought two more for the 500 route. I don't see how those buses will cope compared to Arriva, which has bigger buses.

I have also seen that Arriva are extending the 31 to serve Farley Hill, which seems pretty ludicrous to me as I am not sure where the demand for that has come from! I am interested to see how long that will last, I feel like it will be similar to when the 28/29 ran to Farley Hill and the 27 ran to Stopsley - not last long, then get reverted. I have seen a lot of demand for the 24 to be re-extended to Dunstable, but seems that that isn't going to be acted upon anytime soon, which is frustrating.

Will there just be one bus every hour from Hemel - Aylesbury after the X5 has been withdrawn?

 

[espicer]

Will there just be one bus every hour from Hemel - Aylesbury after the X5 has been withdrawn?

I don't actually know; I don't know if it's going to be 100% withdrawn, but it seems likely as Hemel depot want to get rid of the route

 

[Deerfold]

Hopefully it doesn’t go the same way as Wycombe and Aylesbury with Red Eagle starting their new service.

Very sad that Carousel have made such inroads in High Wycombe and the surrounding areas where Arriva simply could not manage to. This actually needs addressing.

I feel Arriva have two options here; make the X5 an attractive service by tarting up the buses or ensuring a consistent allocation of double decks, making them look presentable or they can throw in the towel and quit while their ahead. The Arriva brand countrywide is an awful one and one that people have no trust in expect if you live in Leicester or Derby.

They're halving the Saturday frequency...

My family who live in Leicester now have fewer than half as many buses than pre-Covid with the service finishing an hour earlier Mon-Sat and 4 hours earlier on a Sunday (where the frequency has gone from 4 buses an hour to 1 every 40 minutes).

 

[Simon75]

I believe, personally, that the X5 will be withdrawn as, apparently, Hemel never really wanted to run the route and has been trying to get rid of it for a while. What I am concerned about is Red Eagle's fleet being solely Enviro 200s. They've just bought two more for the 500 route. I don't see how those buses will cope compared to Arriva, which has bigger buses.

I have also seen that Arriva are extending the 31 to serve Farley Hill, which seems pretty ludicrous to me as I am not sure where the demand for that has come from! I am interested to see how long that will last, I feel like it will be similar to when the 28/29 ran to Farley Hill and the 27 ran to Stopsley - not last long, then get reverted. I have seen a lot of demand for the 24 to be re-extended to Dunstable, but seems that that isn't going to be acted upon anytime soon, which is frustrating.

Maybe instead of speculation , I wonder if @arrivamatt is able to confirm or not whether te X5 Hemel Hempstead to Aylesbury is staying or not

 

[Haywain]

I have also seen that Arriva are extending the 31 to serve Farley Hill, which seems pretty ludicrous to me as I am not sure where the demand for that has come from!

It seems that the extended 31 is replacing routes 1 and 4, so that will create the demand.

 

[greenline712]

Maybe instead of speculation , I wonder if @arrivamatt is able to confirm or not whether te X5 Hemel Hempstead to Aylesbury is staying or not

I don't believe the X5 belongs to @arrivamatt any longer .... Hemel Hempstead is an Arriva Southern Counties garage (unless I'm very confused now ...!).

 

[Foxhound87]

The Red Eagle service was initially to be run by Red Rose back in September however for what ever reason it wasn’t registered. The Red group must certainly have optimism that they can compete with Arriva on that corridor. It could end up badly for either operator.

Probably because Eagle is the one bit that hasn’t been called to Public Inquiry… yet…

I’ve heard the X4 is to undergo a change in April. I imagine it will be cut and one of the F routes will go via Heath and Reach to Milton Keynes, while one of the L routes could extend into Aylesbury and another into Bletchley. Wild guesses so who knows.

Maybe best avoiding mindless speculation, unless something has actually been registered?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

 

[Voyager 2953]

Probably because Eagle is the one bit that hasn’t been called to Public Inquiry… yet…


Maybe best avoiding mindless speculation, unless something has actually been registered?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Mar 2025 ==

It’s not mindless, there are official changes coming in April involving the X4 and F70/77. The X4 can’t be making any money and it’s sad really because before it was tampered with; it was a busy route.

 

[arrivamatt]

It’s not mindless, there are official changes coming in April involving the X4 and F70/77. The X4 can’t be making any money and it’s sad really because before it was tampered with; it was a busy route.

No, there aren't. Routes X4 and F70/F77 are not changing at Easter - all service change information for April is posted on the Arriva website for Luton and Milton Keynes.

Maybe instead of speculation , I wonder if @arrivamatt is able to confirm or not whether te X5 Hemel Hempstead to Aylesbury is staying or not

As @greenline712 highlighted, route X5 is operated by Hemel Hempstead which is part of the Southern Counties division. You'll appreciate that generally, we wouldn't be able to give any details of service changes until at least the point of registration - any information beforehand is commercially sensitive, particularly during the 28 day statutory consultation period.

 

[aswilliamsuk]

The 133 has been "saved" - Central Connect are taking it on as the 333, but on a reduced frequency and operating hours. Locals aren't happy: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp9ykd03d11o.amp