CrossCountry's Driver Shortage

[NEDdrv]

Yes it could, but obviously it averages out over X number of weeks - and hence some weeks will be less - as per the roster.

No you don’t get to wish to only do a 35 hr week you work to your link line which yes maybe less than 35 hrs but is supposed to average out at 35hrs as that is what we are paid for.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 3 Mar 2025 ==

Ok, so an average of 35 hours excluding Sundays a week noting some weeks are longer than others?

Yes, over the link it averages at 35 hrs, with your committed Sundays on top.

 

[Bald Rick]

So, if I’ve understood correctly, this is the situation at XC:

The drivers can, if they wish, only work 35 hours a week. They are expected to work another 5-10 if they happen to be rostered on a Sunday but aren’t in trouble if they say with sufficient notice that they aren’t coming in. If they do come in then they are paid for Sundays at an overtime hourly or daily rate, but this salary is excluded from pension contribution calculations? Is that the summary?

I appreciate there are different situations at other TOCs and there have been thousands of threads on this general topic but it isn’t always clear to the lay reader so thank you to @Bald Rick and others for clarifying things on this specific thread.

Not quite.

The drivers will work an average of 35 hours a week over the year Mondays - Saturdays, and will be expected to work the shift lengths on Sundays they are rostered to work. I don’t know the average turn length for a Sunday at Cross Country, nor the proportion of Sundays rostered, but at some other TOCs it is typically 1:3, which may or may not be sufficient to run the timetabled service without recourse to Rest Day Working (ie volunteers) even if everyone rostered for the Sundays actually works them. Neither do I know the arrangements at Cross Country for declaring oneself unavailable for a rostered Sunday.

However at some TOCs Sundays and/or Rest Days are paid at a flat rate regardless of shift length, and therefore volunteers will tend to go for the shorter turns, and people declaring themselves unavailable (for whatever reason) will tend to go for the longer turns.

The main point is that the arrangements at every TOC are subtley different.

 

[GoneSouth]

So in summary, you are expected to work your rostered Sunday, unless it happens to fall within a period of other leave. However, if you don’t want to then nobody is going to tell you you have to or sanction you if you don’t. Obviously there will always be sickness, that is a fact of life and can’t be avoided. Add to the mix that whilst knowing these circumstances cause problems, XC don’t roster enough people to start with and here we are, a public service run by simpletons.

Also, you can’t tell me that a Sunday when only one of the Cardiff to Nottingham services ran in full is ALL down to illness and leave happening to wrap around a drivers committed Sunday.

What a way to run a public service! Depressing and too unpredictable for those of us who don’t have any other option.

 

[NEDdrv]

So in summary, you are expected to work your rostered Sunday, unless it happens to fall within a period of other leave. However, if you don’t want to then nobody is going to tell you you have to or sanction you if you don’t. Obviously there will always be sickness, that is a fact of life and can’t be avoided. Add to the mix that whilst knowing these circumstances cause problems, XC don’t roster enough people to start with and here we are, a public service run by simpletons.

Also, you can’t tell me that a Sunday when only one of the Cardiff to Nottingham services ran in full is ALL down to illness and leave happening to wrap around a drivers committed Sunday.

What a way to run a public service! Depressing and too unpredictable for those of us who don’t have any other option.

As has been said many times on this forum ASLEF policy is to have Sundays in the working work but it has been cheaper for companies to not bring Sundays inside due to the uplift in driver numbers it would take to bring in. No knowledge of links at Birmingham so don’t know if they are running under quota leading to uncovered turns on Sundays. Drivers don’t just not turn in for booked Sundays as there are quite often driver shown on daily alteration sheets showing as wanting Sunday off but no cover is available to grant their request (most times this is then covered by a colleague who did not have a Sunday shift) don’t think the company could push to hard if someone didn’t turn in as it is forced overtime but as I said drivers don’t just not turn in as if this was the case you may find there would be a lot more cancellations.

 

[Krokodil]

Yes but many have alluded to if you don't turn up for your rostered Sunday turn, does anything actually come of it?

I believe that the general feeling in TOC management is that "committed Sundays" may not be enforceable in law and therefore they don't risk testing it lest it be found to be completely unenforceable, losing the "management might do something if my Sunday goes uncovered" threat they currently have to keep most of them covered.

 

[4COR]

Because if your expected earnings for the year were (say) £75k but you’ve actually earned £110k due to a £28k back pay payment and overtime worked earlier in the year, your tax code won’t change automatically.

Not being an earner of anywhere near those figures, is it an issue in how long it takes for the back payment for overtime/RDW to come through that makes a difference, or is it just a quirk of the tax system?

Put another way, if you plan to work (say) 20 rest days this calendar year, they will be worth more in the next tax year than the current one, so it makes sense to do them after April.

So this I'm not so convinced - year ends are arbitrary - we (at my current employer) work on Aug-Aug (accounting), Oct-Oct (leave) and then Apr-Apr (tax) years. If you're basing tax calcs on tax years, but counting annually, isn;t it just a case of when you start counting? (I say this all as an outsider, in a salaried job that doesn't have the concept of any paid overtime (we work enough to get stuff done), let alone rest day working...)

 

[Horizon22]

So this I'm not so convinced - year ends are arbitrary - we (at my current employer) work on Aug-Aug (accounting), Oct-Oct (leave) and then Apr-Apr (tax) years. If you're basing tax calcs on tax years, but counting annually, isn;t it just a case of when you start counting? (I say this all as an outsider, in a salaried job that doesn't have the concept of any paid overtime (we work enough to get stuff done), let alone rest day working...)

If you've just had a big one-off back payment in this tax year, it does make more sense if you know it will not be coming the following year.

 

[4COR]

If you've just had a big one-off back payment in this tax year, it does make more sense if you know it will not be coming the following year.

How long do the back payments tend to take to come through? A multi thousand back payment is a very large number of RDW/overtime days?

 

[Horizon22]

How long do the back payments tend to take to come through? A multi thousand back payment is a very large number of RDW/overtime days?

Well you don't even have to do RDW/overtime for it to have made a difference. 4 years (so 52 pay slips) of back pay (let alone any RDW) all condensed into one is quite the chunk!

 

[4COR]

Well you don't even have to do RDW/overtime for it to have made a difference. 4 years (so 52 pay slips) of back pay (let alone any RDW) all condensed into one is quite the chunk!

Ok - I'm coming at this from the outside - if there's 4 years (!) of back pay, then it makes more sense. (With all lack of knowledge, where did the 4 years of back pay originate?)

 

[Horizon22]

Ok - I'm coming at this from the outside - if there's 4 years (!) of back pay, then it makes more sense. (With all lack of knowledge, where did the 4 years of back pay originate?)

It's closer to 3 years, but did you not notice all the industrial action and strikes over the past few years?! Most rail staff hadn't had a pay rise since 2019/2020.

Train drivers accept pay deal bringing end to strikes in England

Aslef said 96.6% of its members who voted backed the deal, marking the end of long-running strikes.

www.bbc.co.uk

Train drivers have accepted a pay deal that will see the end of more than two years of strike action in England, Scotland and Wales.

Aslef union members accepted an offer which included a 5% backdated pay rise for 2022-23, a 4.75% rise for 23-24, and a 4.5% increase for 24-25.

 

[4COR]

It's closer to 3 years, but did you not notice all the industrial action and strikes over the past few years?! Most rail staff hadn't had a pay rise since 2019/2020.

Train drivers accept pay deal bringing end to strikes in England

Aslef said 96.6% of its members who voted backed the deal, marking the end of long-running strikes.

www.bbc.co.uk

Yes, for the strikes etc, but less about the settlement, and the knock ons. Thanks for the pointers: for at least me(!), outside of the industry, not always obvious in putting 2 and 2 together! Especially where there are knock on effects like we see with the current service level.

I won't comment on the pay rises (or lack of) in my industry....!!

 

[Bald Rick]

Ok - I'm coming at this from the outside - if there's 4 years (!) of back pay, then it makes more sense. (With all lack of knowledge, where did the 4 years of back pay originate?)

Average back pay in some (not all) TOCs was in the region of £15k, but some individuals recieved nearly twice that.

 

[43066]

So this I'm not so convinced - year ends are arbitrary - we (at my current employer) work on Aug-Aug (accounting), Oct-Oct (leave) and then Apr-Apr (tax) years. If you're basing tax calcs on tax years, but counting annually, isn;t it just a case of when you start counting? (I say this all as an outsider, in a salaried job that doesn't have the concept of any paid overtime (we work enough to get stuff done), let alone rest day working...)

No, because it’s the tax year end for individuals that matters here. If you’re on just over £100k this tax year due to the back pay you’ll be taxed at a higher marginal rate on overtime worked this side of April. The accounting year end of the company you’re employed by doesn’t have any bearing on this.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Mar 2025 ==

Not being an earner of anywhere near those figures, is it an issue in how long it takes for the back payment for overtime/RDW to come through that makes a difference, or is it just a quirk of the tax system?

Normally pay rises are agreed annually, and might only be backdated for a short time, so you wouldn’t get a big chunk of back pay in one tax year.

 

[whoosh]

So in summary, you are expected to work your rostered Sunday, unless it happens to fall within a period of other leave.

Not quite. If you want a long weekend off that isn't made up of rest days, then you would use annual leave for the Saturday and annual leave for the Monday. However, because it isn't a rostered 'annual leave week', you will need to scratch around trying to find someone else to cover the Sunday for you, should your TOC's Sunday working be of the 'committed' variety.

Of course, the more services there are added to the timetable on a Sunday - as Sunday travel is increasing - the harder this will be, as other drivers will be more likely to already have their own booked Sunday shifts in the roster, and the number available to ask favours of decreases.


Even making a week off using 'ad-hoc' days would land you with the same issue.

It's only an 'annual leave week' - a rostered week of annual leave, where you guarantee the surrounding Sundays off.

 

[Zerothebrake!]

Re above, you are only guaranteed one of the Sundays off with an AL week, either the one before or the one after.

 

[dvboy]

Four cancellations each way between Cardiff and Birmingham today (including one I had planned to take), with another turning round short at Gloucester.

 

[duffield]

Four cancellations each way between Cardiff and Birmingham today (including one I had planned to take), with another turning round short at Gloucester.

So quite good for a Sunday.

 

[Zerothebrake!]

Watch this space.

 

[Russel]

Watch this space.

Somewhat ominous...

 

[duffield]

No cancellations or truncations on any routes today due to driver (or other train crew) shortages, the only disruption today so far is due to overrunning engineering works between Reading and Basingstoke.

Somewhat ominous...

Maybe. Possible meanings - another emergency timetable, early franchise termination, something else?

 

[TheGuy77]

Quite a few cancellations today: twenty-three services cancelled or curtailed:

All Updates Affecting CrossCountry Services​

Service Updates | CrossCountry Trains

Book quickly and easily. Buy cheap train tickets, find live train times, explore Railcards, and more today with CrossCountry.

www.crosscountrytrains.co.uk

 

[TPO]

So in summary, you are expected to work your rostered Sunday, unless it happens to fall within a period of other leave. However, if you don’t want to then nobody is going to tell you you have to or sanction you if you don’t. Obviously there will always be sickness, that is a fact of life and can’t be avoided. Add to the mix that whilst knowing these circumstances cause problems, XC don’t roster enough people to start with and here we are, a public service run by simpletons.

Also, you can’t tell me that a Sunday when only one of the Cardiff to Nottingham services ran in full is ALL down to illness and leave happening to wrap around a drivers committed Sunday.

What a way to run a public service! Depressing and too unpredictable for those of us who don’t have any other option.

Four cancellations each way between Cardiff and Birmingham today (including one I had planned to take), with another turning round short at Gloucester.

Not just Sundays; at least 2 return trips Cardiff-Nottingham canned yesterday due to "lack of traincrew." (The 07:45 off Cardiff Central and the one back to Cardiff that departs Birmingham New St at 14:30). Yes, the trip can be made via Bristol Parkway provided you have the "any permitted rotue" ticket- and I did that in both directions- but for anyone who had reserved a seat- tough. I had to move during the trip out (to seats reserved various part-trips) to keep sitting down.

I don't travel for work that often thankfully- do much by Teams- but that corridor is one of the main routes I must use if I do have to travel on the train.

XC is very poor; the Voyages and CL170s they use are all desperately in need of refurbishment, seats deteriorating and come carriages rattle like a bag of nails. Fares are expensive (I need flexibility for work) along the route, even if you can split tickets. Canning the Cardiff-Nottingham is just the icing on the cake. I lament the demise of the XC HST sets.

On a busy XC train, sometimes the Guard will let people know that there's seats further along the train. Sometimes not. There doesn't seem to be much consistency on which is the unreserved coach, and when most toilets on a set are locked out of use it's not great.

XC needs to be a lot better.

TPO

 

[TheGuy77]

Quite a few cancellations today: twenty-three services cancelled or curtailed:

Service Updates | CrossCountry Trains

Book quickly and easily. Buy cheap train tickets, find live train times, explore Railcards, and more today with CrossCountry.

www.crosscountrytrains.co.uk

Twenty-seven services cancelled today - only really seems like Sundays are an issue.

 

[The Planner]

Twenty-seven services cancelled today - only really seems like Sundays are an issue.

Sun is out and its Mothers Day.

 

[TheGuy77]

Sun is out and its Mothers Day.

You do realise that services have been like this all Sundays, even when it's not Mother's Day or if sun isn't out.

 

[The Planner]

You do realise that services have been like this all Sundays, even when it's not Mother's Day or if sun isn't out.

Yes, but we all know the general reasons behind that, but I bet its higher today.

 

[Sporty60]

Agreed!
If the publicised reason was given as , " service cancelled because it's Mother's day and also the sun is shining"
could it shame those in charge to get their act together?
Probably not!

 

[Krokodil]

Yes, but we all know the general reasons behind that, but I bet its higher today.

I did notice where I am that all of the overtime merchants were working buckshee Sundays today, whereas normally some would lose out to those with smaller counts.

 

[Peterthegreat]

Today I intended to go from Sheffield to Oxford on the 06.24 Newcastle to Reading service. Cross Country Journey check shows the train cancelled between Newcastle and Birmingham due to "a shortage of train drivers".
However on consulting Tracksy and RTT it appears this train is running EMPTY from Newcastle to Birmingham!
So either XC gave got the first mainline driverless trains or it is more likely a shortage of train managers.
Therefore how many XC cancellations are publicly blamed on shortage of drivers when it is actually train managers?