caught using wrong railcard today

[sillygirlfines]

Hi there,

I was caught today at blackfriars using the wrong railcard. I have been using the 16-17 railcard instead of my 18-25 railcard. I have ADHD and usually buying my tickets last minute so i clicked first railcard that pops up most of the time. I've been doing this for about two years!

I stupidly panicked and deleted my trainline account (SO dumb i know) and im really worried theyre going to backdate all the times ive done it. will i get a criminal record? i really worries this will effect me for life now.

should i call thameslink on my lunch break or just wait for letter to come? im happy to pay a fine i get what ive been doing is SO stupid - sometimes when inspectors check my ticket and see i have a railcard anyway they dont care, so i think thats why ive never bothered to click the right one

when i showed them my railcard, they couldnt seem to find my account associated - but when i showed them the ticket im assuming they'll be able to find my email and look back, any thoughts on what i should do ?? i feel really anxious about this -

 

[sillygirlfines]

Hi there,

I was caught today at blackfriars using the wrong railcard. I have been using the 16-17 railcard instead of my 18-25 railcard. I have ADHD and usually buying my tickets last minute so i clicked first railcard that pops up most of the time. I've been doing this for about two years!

when i showed them my railcard, they couldnt seem to find my account associated - but when i showed them the ticket im assuming they'll be able to find my email and look back, any thoughts on what i should do ??

I stupidly panicked and deleted my trainline account (SO dumb i know) and im really worried theyre going to backdate all the times ive done it. will i get a criminal record? i really worries this will effect me for life now.

should i call thameslink on my lunch break or just wait for letter to come? im happy to pay a fine i get what ive been doing is SO stupid - sometimes when inspectors check my ticket and see i have a railcard anyway they dont care, so i think thats why ive never bothered to click the right one

PLEASE help! im so scared of them

 

[Wethebest838]

How many journeys would that be over 2 years? As if they offer an out of court settlement then expect to pay it all back.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

will i get a criminal record? i really worries this will effect me for life now.

Just on this point: if this ends up in court and you are convicted, you will get a criminal record. But for most purposes that will go away after no more than a year.

But it's pretty likely that you will be able to sort this out with an 'out of court settlement'. So try not to panic just yet about what could happen in court: if it looks as if things are going down that road then we can explain what could happen at that point.

 

[sillygirlfines]

Just on this point: if this ends up in court and you are convicted, you will get a criminal record. But for most purposes that will go away after no more than a year.

But it's pretty likely that you will be able to sort this out with an 'out of court settlement'. So try not to panic just yet about what could happen in court: if it looks as if things are going down that road then we can explain what could happen at that point.

its hard to tell, sometimes i will click the right railcard.. but i'll say maybe 50+, so bad i know! i just never thought it was a big deal as i didnt realise their was a price different, i thought all railcards were 30% - i never travel big trips - just diff main stations round london (e.g ldn bridge to blackfriars, clapham junction to victoria etc.)

 

[Cuthbert]

Regards with paying back. I understand you deleted your account but if you can remember roughly how many days a week you travel. mon-fri for example.

They will charge a standard single for each journey. So a return will be two standard singles.
You can roughly work out over two years how much you think you didn't not pay for the full amount.
They will/might add an admin fee around £150 as well.

Any letters they send will have a threatening tone but don't worry just post it on here with personal details and reference numbers obscured.

 

[sillygirlfines]

its hard to tell, sometimes i will click the right railcard.. but i'll say maybe 50+, so bad i know! i just never thought it was a big deal as i didnt realise their was a price different, i thought all railcards were 30% - i never travel big trips - just diff main stations round london (e.g ldn bridge to blackfriars, clapham junction to victoria etc.)

How many journeys would that be over 2 years? As if they offer an out of court settlement then expect to pay it all back.

its hard to tell, sometimes i will click the right railcard.. but i'll say maybe 50+, so bad i know! i just never thought it was a big deal as i didnt realise their was a price different, i thought all railcards were 30% - i never travel big trips - just diff main stations round london (e.g ldn bridge to blackfriars, clapham junction to victoria etc.)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Feb 2025 ==

Regards with paying back. I understand you deleted your account but if you can remember roughly how many days a week you travel. mon-fri for example.

They will charge a standard single for each journey. So a return will be two standard singles.
You can roughly work out over two years how much you think you didn't not pay for the full amount.
They will/might add an admin fee around £150 as well.

Any letters they send will have a threatening tone but don't worry just post it on here with personal details and reference numbers obscured.

will they include railcard prices or just standard adult? i have always had a railcard - once it expires i always rebuy it, i just have been using the wrong one lol so stupid

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Feb 2025 ==

Just on this point: if this ends up in court and you are convicted, you will get a criminal record. But for most purposes that will go away after no more than a year.

But it's pretty likely that you will be able to sort this out with an 'out of court settlement'. So try not to panic just yet about what could happen in court: if it looks as if things are going down that road then we can explain what could happen at that point.

how likely is it i'll get a criminal record? do you think if i pay my fine immediately and explain im just quite stupid and careless and apologise, would i avoid court?

 

[Cuthbert]

its hard to tell, sometimes i will click the right railcard.. but i'll say maybe 50+, so bad i know! i just never thought it was a big deal as i didnt realise their was a price different, i thought all railcards were 30% - i never travel big trips - just diff main stations round london (e.g ldn bridge to blackfriars, clapham junction to victoria etc.)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Feb 2025 ==


will they include railcard prices or just standard adult? i have always had a railcard - once it expires i always rebuy it, i just have been using the wrong one lol so stupid

Very unusual if they do add it.
Also any fares paid (with incorrect rail card) already will be ignored as well.

 

[Spaceship323]

To answer your question...No don't try to contact them, they won't have the report from the inspector yet and nothing to match it to so just wait until you receive a letter (which may take a few weeks) then post a copy on here for further advice

 

[Titfield]

Please wait until the letter arrives. Then upload to here with your personal details and reference number obscured so advice tailored to the issues raised in the letter can be given.

EDIT Unfortunately all you can do is try and put it out of your mind until the letter arrives.

 

[sillygirlfines]

Please wait until the letter arrives. Then upload to here with your personal details and reference number obscured so advice tailored to the issues raised in the letter can be given.

Thanks - I'm also now been reading and worried theyre going to question why I have ldn bridge to blackfriars a lot? I usually lime bike to the station thats why, will i be able to easily explain this?

 

[Titfield]

Thanks - I'm also now been reading and worried theyre going to question why I have ldn bridge to blackfriars a lot? I usually lime bike to the station thats why, will i be able to easily explain this?

You can put forward any explanation you care to, but their judgement will be influenced by proof (or lack of) and how reasonable your explanation is likely to be. If you have proof of booking lime bikes then they are more likely to accept this explanation than a bare statement.

 

[Haywain]

i never travel big trips - just diff main stations round london (e.g ldn bridge to blackfriars, clapham junction to victoria etc.)

You would do better to be using Oyster for these sort of trips - you can have your railcard applied to an Oyster card and there is no risk of paying the wrong fare, plus Oyster fares are usually cheaper than what you can buy through Trainline.

theyre going to question why I have ldn bridge to blackfriars a lot?

That is likely to happen because tickets bought on Trainline are usually used for those sort of journeys by people travelling from further out and not buying tickets for the whole journey. There's a good chance that your home address might influence their thinking, and they might wonder why you would use a Lime bike to London Bridge but not all the way to Blackfriars.

 

[island]

Thanks - I'm also now been reading and worried theyre going to question why I have ldn bridge to blackfriars a lot? I usually lime bike to the station thats why, will i be able to easily explain this?

I would expect a prosecutor to treat a claim that a passenger takes a "lime bike" to London Bridge before boarding a Thameslink train to Blackfriars with a considerable amount of skepticism. It would take no more than 7-10 minutes to complete the journey by cycle, compared with up to 10 minutes waiting for the train, 5 minutes on the train, and more time getting to and from platforms. As I understand it, "lime bikes" cost under 30p per minute to use, so the train fare at £3.90 is also more expensive.

So if you are going to maintain this claim, I would suggest you make sure you can support it with evidence, which might include receipts for the bike hire, and e-tickets that have been scanned to enter London Bridge station. Without such evidence, the prosecutor (and, I suspect, a court) will be minded to infer that a train was used from a more distant location.

 

[sillygirlfines]

I’m now starting to worry they think I have given the wrong address. But I showed them proof of my address I just not sure

I would expect a prosecutor to treat a claim that a passenger takes a "lime bike" to London Bridge before boarding a Thameslink train to Blackfriars with a considerable amount of skepticism. It would take no more than 7-10 minutes to complete the journey by cycle, compared with up to 10 minutes waiting for the train, 5 minutes on the train, and more time getting to and from platforms. As I understand it, "lime bikes" cost under 30p per minute to use, so the train fare at £3.90 is also more expensive.

So if you are going to maintain this claim, I would suggest you make sure you can support it with evidence, which might include receipts for the bike hire, and e-tickets that have been scanned to enter London Bridge station. Without such evidence, the prosecutor (and, I suspect, a court) will be minded to infer that a train was used from a more distant location.

God, it looks bad doesnt it! I get passes so I limit the minutes I use. I probably won't mention this unless they bring it up.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Feb 2025 ==

I'm also really worried about

I’m now starting to worry they think I have given the wrong address. But I showed them proof of my address I just not sure

God, it looks bad doesnt it! I get passes so I limit the minutes I use. I probably won't mention this unless they bring it up.

I'm also quite worried they're going to think I lied about my address? They couldn't find me on the system and I did show them proof, but I'm worried my account will be attached to an old address. I'm not sure how I can find this out?

 

[AlterEgo]

God, it looks bad doesnt it!

Well, yes. Nobody is going to believe you get a Lime bike to London Bridge and then pay for a train ticket one stop. Clapham Junction to Victoria as well - another one stop trip. All of these journeys, if you are doing it legitimately, are almost always cheaper and easier using contactless anyway. Better hope they don't trawl your bookings, as you look like you've been short faring on an industrial scale and you know that is what worries you.

I probably won't mention this unless they bring it up.

I advise you not to mention it unless asked; they might not trawl your purchases. They don't always.

 

[Camsus]

So if you are going to maintain this claim, I would suggest you make sure you can support it with evidence, which might include receipts for the bike hire, and e-tickets that have been scanned to enter London Bridge station. Without such evidence, the prosecutor (and, I suspect, a court) will be minded to infer that a train was used from a more distant location.

Where E-tickets are concerned, The Trainline provide ticket scan data along with a record of the ticket purchases.

If the OP is telling the truth, there will be entry and exit scans at both the origin and destination stations. If there aren't, then clearly the rail company will (rightly) suspect travel from further afield.

 

[sillygirlfines]

I feel like such an idiot writing this because I know I have messed up, but the more I’ve looked in to it I now realise how bad this is. I start at North Dulwich to Blackfriars, theres no barriers at ND so I just wait to get my ticket from London bridge. I also have been using the wrong railcard (16-17) aswell so it’s a double whammy. I've been doing this for about 2 years. From looking at this forum it seems I'm going to be questioned for "industrial scale short faring" which sounds terrifying. I am such an idiot and I have not eaten all day and have thrown up from fear - dramatic I know

I am on minimum wage and after my rent and bills comes out I have about £300 and that doesn’t include travel/food/phone bill etc for the rest of the month and I am trying to get by on an entry level to work my way up in corporate world. Looking back now I can't believe I've been risking it all for about a £2 fare difference but if you're doing this 3/4 times a week it does add up on and I'd be left with even less and I already struggle with what I have at the end of the month - it’s a stupid way of thinking. But trying to be a 25 year old girl in London trying to live a decent life on no money you count every penny.

Sometimes I cycle to the train station so I'm not always short faring, but I can't imagine they're going to believe me looking at my track history.

My friend told me she has been short faring for about 8 years and only had a 500£ fine. I also told a friend at work and they said they once got an excel sheet of all the times they short fared, but that was 3 years ago and they haven’t heard from them since. This does make me feel better but I can't help but feel like she's been extremely lucky. I really just need some reassurance what to do next… it only happened today so I am assuming I will have to wait once my letter comes through, but I just can't stop thinking about this.


I am so worried I am going to end up with a criminal record - or worse - prison time. I genuinely fear I will do something awful if it comes to that - as I already am in a fragile state.

I feel like the worst person in the world right now, I've never put a foot wrong in life before apart from this - I think with having other friends telling me they've done this before I thought I'd be okay, but now I will never do such a thing like this again.


Sorry for the long message, any advice would be great.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Feb 2025 ==

I’ve also now worked out that it’s been about 90 times in the last 3 years, I always pay full for longer journeys and when I can I use the tube which I will always pay for. So I’ve averaged about 30 times a year. I know that’s so awful and i shouldn’t have let other people tell me it was ok to do but really i only have myself to blame. Please help!

 

[island]

Okay, well it would have been better to say the correct detail from the get go rather than leading us all on the merry dance, but better that we got here in the end.

I can say with certainty you won’t be going to prison, but a criminal record is a possibility. Best case will be an out of court settlement in the hundreds of pounds range, so start saving.

You will have to wait for the letter from GTR before anything can progress.

 

[Pushpit]

One thing is for certain. You will not end up in prison. There is a technical possibility, and exaggerating for effect, I doubt it has happened in the last 80 years, and you won't be the case that changes it.

It is not OK to do this, and yes there is a chance they will dig into the records to find any apps you have used. Shortfaring that particular journey, when contactless is almost always cheaper, is not going need AI to spot all those who do it, it is pretty obvious what has been going on, and features regularly in this forum.

I know it's easy to say, and yes this is a serious matter that will require effort and focus from you to resolve it, nevertheless it's not crime of the century, and while you may end up with a criminal record if everything goes badly, it is unlikely to be as dreadful as you currently think.

And slow down a bit! Read what has been said upthread and try to take it onboard.

 

[Haywain]

I feel like such an idiot writing this because I know I have messed up, but the more I’ve looked in to it I now realise how bad this is. I start at North Dulwich to Blackfriars, theres no barriers at ND so I just wait to get my ticket from London bridge. I also have been using the wrong railcard (16-17) aswell so it’s a double whammy. I've been doing this for about 2 years.

Well, if nothing else saying this here is a step in the right direction and will allow us to give you genuine help. The good news is that GTR are, from your point if view, probably the best train company to be dealing with.

 

[SuspectUsual]

I am so worried I am going to end up with a criminal record - or worse - prison time

You might end up with a criminal record, but you WILL NOT BE GOING TO PRISON

I'm sure it's really difficult, but try and stay calm. There's really nothing you can do until their letter arrives

 

[sillygirlfines]

Thanks so much to all of you for being so kind, I understand what I’ve done is wrong and I really appreciate you all trying to help considering. I really feel like such an idiot having done this, I really hope I can avoid a criminal record because that would really ruin my life lol as I wanted to one day be a counsellor and I probably have ruined those plans now.

I’m praying to all the gods I won’t get a record I can settle this out of court and happy to pay the fine whatever it may be. I will start saving my pennies now.

 

[Haywain]

I’m praying to all the gods I won’t get a record I can settle this out of court and happy to pay the fine whatever it may be. I will start saving my pennies now.

There is every chance that you will have an opportunity to settle with GTR, so finding the money will be essential as you are unlikely to be given time to pay.

 

[sillygirlfines]

There is every chance that you will have an opportunity to settle with GTR, so finding the money will be essential as you are unlikely to be given time to pay.

My finger will be crossed for the next month until I get the letter. I will post the letter on here once I get it to seek advice. Will try not to think about it until then! Thanks so much

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Feb 2025 ==

Sorry.. one final question (because I literally cannot stop thinking about it and have only been able to stomach a slice of toast today from stress)

How likely is it I will get a criminal record? Is it very likely do you think? I’ve been trying to see if anyone one else has posted if they’ve got one but I can’t find.

Also, if I did get one, I saw it would only show on my record for a year. Is this true? Will my employer be told? Will I be able to go to other countries? Will this affect me if I ever one day can afford to buy a house?

I am sure you can tell I am an overthinker! sorry for the oversharing

 

[Haywain]

How likely is it I will get a criminal record?

The chances are low.

Also, if I did get one, I saw it would only show on my record for a year. Is this true? Will my employer be told? Will I be able to go to other countries? Will this affect me if I ever one day can afford to buy a house?

If you did, the effect would not be particularly serious and certainly not long lasting.

 

[sillygirlfines]

The chances are low.

If you did, the effect would not be particularly serious and certainly not long lasting.

Ok. Thank you! I know you can’t guarantee this but that doesn’t ease my mind a little. Although I doubt I will sleep tonight anyway!!

A lesson has truly been learnt here today. I will be a law abiding citizen for the rest of my days from now on - my heart can’t take the stress!

 

[Hadders]

GTR are entitled to take the matter to the Magistrates Court if they want to but they normally offer an out of court settlement as long as you co-operate with them.

If they do offer you a settlement then expect to have to pay all of the outstanding fares at the full Anytime rate with no credit given for the invalid tickets you did purchase plus an admin fee, typically around £150. If you've been evading your fares on an 'industrial scale' then this could be a significant sum so think about how you are going to raise the sort of money required, especially if money is tight. GTR won't normally allow payment by installments.

As for cycling to London Bridge if you did do this will your Lime account show cycle rides at the appropriate times? Also, as others have noted if you did enter London Bridge then your barcode ticket would have been scanned at the barrier to enter and there will be a record of this scan on the train company database. If there's no entry scan then this would indicate that you short fared.

When it arrives upload a redacted copy of GTR's letter along with your draft reply and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

 

[sillygirlfines]

Hi there - I am considering contacting a solicitor, is this the right thing to do at this stage?

I am seeing some cases take months to get the letter and I am not sure I can cope with the stress. I have not slept at all and keep imagining the worst. This has really shaken me and I have never thought about these consequences before and just how unbelievably foolish I have been.

 

[island]

There is no benefit to consulting a solicitor before the letter arrives.