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Progress on Avanti West Coast's 805/807s Hitachi AT300 sets
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norbitonflyer
Established Member
Exciting - do you know the weekday diagrams?
hexagon789
Veteran Member
110mph until equipped with TASS or AWC's waiver is granted.
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
Rugby-Coventry is signed 100/125MU/125EPS, Wolves-Stafford is 90/125MU/125EPS.
If 80x can't use MU speeds they will be limited to the PS.
There might be special dispensation of course.
Interesting. So even though XCs 22x that isn’t equipped with Tass can run along the section from Stafford to wolves at 125, the 805/7s can’t because of this?
hexagon789
Veteran Member
According to a driver I asked at Preston when an 807 appeared for testing it's something like perceived risk by the ORR by having different train types some with and some without an overspeed intervention system.
I think this cropped up a few months ago and has been mentioned in Modern Railways iirc.
Avanti have appealed the decision, but presumably if unsuccessful then either the 80x need TASS fitting or are held to a 110 ceiling.
poffle
Member
On 1G00 operated by 805005 this evening from Holyhead to Birmingham. Reservations loaded 30 mins before departure from Holyhead.
I do notice that announcements are quite loud. First announcements I've heard clearly all day with noise cancelling headphones on ! Obviously optimised for headphone wearers.
DJH1971
Established Member
Considering these are the only service routes the 807's are able to do for the time being.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
Are drivers that sign to Liverpool/Blackpool not passed on 80x yet then?
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
The wires are too cheap and weak to take them.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
They can take Pendolinos, surely those have a similar power draw?
Unless their difference between a 390 pantograph and an 80x pantograph that makes the latter unsuitable, but i dont think that's what you meant?
I'm well aware of the power supply issues, but you'd run the 807 either in lieu of a 390 or in an hour when there is otherwise less demand on the power supply, no?
poffle
Member
Blackpool was meant to 805 rather than 807.
Currently there is one mainly North Wales double Voyager diagram which starts the day in Blackpool ( after running ECS from Crewe ) runs to Euston and then spends the rest of the day on North Wales services.
I think there was an aim to have a second 805 service to Blackpool.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
Supposed to be two return pairs of Euston/Blackpool from May 2025, both via Trent Valley and both timed as 80x.
You are correct yes.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
In which case, is this not actually the intention from December with the few extra Liverpools?
I.e. the two extras will be 390
Some current XX:43s will be 805s and or 807s?
Thus balancing out power draw in certain hours and making some use of the 807s on intended routes.
I wouldn't imagine you'll find 805s with Chester pretty much going back to hourly, there's barely enough to operate those!
The extra peaks could still be an electric train, it all depends what electric powered trains are planned to operate in the affected area.
Am sure it’s been discussed many many times on here, but there will not be enough 805s to go to Liverpool.
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
Are we looking at a fully 805 operated North Wales & Chester service from December then, i.e. all remaining Voyagers stood down? I’d expect so by then.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
Well, I didn't know how many they required but certainly if you read up thread there are plenty of suggestions of 805s going to Liverpool vice 807s.
Southbound at least, the two extras are off-peak, 0902 and 1004 IIRC.
It may have been discussed, but I'm afraid my overwhelming recollection is of several instances of 805s being touted as running to Liverpool on diesel from Weaver because of the power supply issues, glad to hear it will be 807s as planned but with perhaps restrictions on the number of additional services until the power supply is upgraded to handle the traffic all the time instead of only when there are fewer non-Avanti electric services on the line such that they can run two in an hour.
Another 805 delivered to Oxley today (007), one left at Aycliffe 805006 now liveried up and has been back out on overnight test/mileage runs.
And that will then just leave 002, which is accepted by Avanti, but for some reason not done passenger services yet.
norbitonflyer
Established Member
Given a 390 has more carriages than an 807, surely it's better to run the 390 if you have the choice?
Although a Pendolino, being longer, will presumably take more power.
It’s also a bit rubbish for Liverpool passengers who have been used to the availability of standard premium on all services for the last few years - to now go to a service where all bar 2 trains a day will no longer have this facility. And a lot of the Liverpool trains std prem usage was very high. If the availability had still been there on 1/2 trains an hour it wouldn’t be as bad - but this is not good on what was Avantis best performing route in terms of passenger numbers coming out of Covid. (The Liverpool service being the quickest to recover after Covid and exceeding passenger numbers for a period of time - unsure if this is still the case)
Peter Sarf
Established Member
Correction.
The wires are too cheap and weak to take more of them.
Where "them" is any 807 and/or 390.
hexagon789
Veteran Member
Though a 9-car Pendolino has only 16 seats more than an 807, and 34 fewer in First Class.
Well, the original intention was of course two every hour - one 807 and 390.
The two extra per day being simply what's being added in December and that will make four 390-timed services, not two.
There's only one mention in one railway media publication that states otherwise about further services being added in May.
Where is it stated that all Liverpool services will be switching to 807s?
Whistler40145
Established Member
Avanti West Coast’s new Hitachi train makes first test run to Chester and North Wales | Avanti West Coast News
Avanti West Coast’s new fleet marked a major milestone yesterday with its first journey to Chester and North Wales.
newsdesk.avantiwestcoast.co.uk
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
That doesn't say all Liverpool's will be 807, just that they will be used on the route.
It's just a generic puff piece of Avanti PR, and plans change anyway.
It's just a generic puff piece of Avanti PR, and plans change anyway.
Avanti West Coast’s new Hitachi train makes first test run to Chester and North Wales | Avanti West Coast News
Avanti West Coast’s new fleet marked a major milestone yesterday with its first journey to Chester and North Wales.
That is correct, they will run to Liverpool. But not on all Liverpool services, or even the majority of them.
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Whistler40145
Established Member
Is it a mixture of 390s and 807s or 805s and 807s?
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