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I can't seem to find details of the fee I will be charged for my split tickets ahead of making a booking enquiry.
The i that comes up next to the split price merely says the fee is up to 15%. What is the precise fee structure and shouldn't this be easy to find from the homepage before making a booking?
Yes, 15% but capped to a maximum share of £25 as of writing.
Some people might be surprised how easily you can hit that when booking for multiple people. A search I just did from Plymouth to Edinburgh for 2 adults + 1 child saved ~£440 because there were no cheap through advances (they actually cost more than the flexible single) available.
It's also super easy to avoid should you wish by booking the listed tickets yourself, but many happily pay as thanks for the saving or simplicity - do as you please
Have you ever had to pay for a licence for any software? Computer programmes are often expensive - especially if it specialist or requires frequent updates.
Though personally I would go through the effort of adding the splits manually to my basket on the same website that suggested the split if the fee was more than I would be willing to pay - an option that is open to anyone, though it is really important to do it on the forum's website, so that they still get the commission from your purchase if not the fee
Have you ever had to pay for a licence for any software? Computer programmes are often expensive - especially if it specialist or requires frequent updates.
It's not worth saving £166 in exchange for £25? (I can't be bothered to do the maths to exclude the share of saving from that number.)
Not sure what the "plus commission" is referring to. Commission is a fixed cut of the ticket price that goes to the retailer from RDG, and is not a cost passed on to the customer as any kind of additional fee. You pay this "commission" when buying any rail ticket from any retailer.
You make it sound as though you pay up to £25 and commission. You don’t.
What you do pay is 15% of the value of any saving Trainsplit identifies, called at £25. If no saving is identified then there’s no share of saving to pay.
For every ticket sold, anywhere, a percentage of it goes to the retailer. It’s a small fee for online ticket purchases. I can’t remember the exact amount but it’s something like 5%
But if I use Trainsplit to identify split ticket opportunities then I do purchase through them because my view is it is unethical not to do so. I’m not comfortable using their systems and then buying from somewhere else. If everyone did that Trainsplit would not exist and everyone would lose out.
Today I’ve travelled to Bath to see a rugby match using a combination of tickets. I identified the combination and have been using them for many years before Trainsplit was a thing (since at least 2008!). I didn't use Trainsplit to buy these tickets but if I do purchase via the site I add the tickets separately to the basket because at least then Trainsplit (and in turn the forum) gets some benefit.
Do they consistently offer you the best deals? Or do you ever check Trainsplit for cheaper deals, leach the information, and use that for financial gain to book on a site that had wanted to charge you more for the journey?
It's unfortunate, there is no practical way to prevent scraping/leeching.
Have you ever had to pay for a licence for any software? Computer programmes are often expensive - especially if it specialist or requires frequent updates.
Though personally I would go through the effort of adding the splits manually to my basket on the same website that suggested the split if the fee was more than I would be willing to pay - an option that is open to anyone, though it is really important to do it on the forum's website, so that they still get the commission from your purchase if not the fee
And if you really think the fee is excessive, you can do as you suggest and then add a donation that strikes you as fair.
To me £25 would seem perfectly fair if the site had genuinely saved me more than six times that amount on tickets that I would have bought anyway, however, it may be that the through fare that the site uses as a basis for comparison is not one that I would have paid. It may be that I would have driven, flown or travelled by coach if I hadn't found splits on the forum's site. In that case, a share of any saving I've made compared to those other modes might seem a fairer reflection of the value I've had from the resource.
In practice I just pay the fee (though it's never been anywhere near £25, so far!).
And if you really think the fee is excessive, you can do as you suggest and then add a donation that strikes you as fair.
To me £25 would seem perfectly fair if the site had genuinely saved me more than six times that amount on tickets that I would have bought anyway, however, it may be that the through fare that the site uses as a basis for comparison is not one that I would have paid. It may be that I would have driven, flown or travelled by coach if I hadn't found splits on the forum's site. In that case, a share of any saving I've made compared to those other modes might seem a fairer reflection of the value I've had from the resource.
In practice I just pay the fee (though it's never been anywhere near £25, so far!).
This is the crux of the matter for me and I suspect its because of my home location on the Kent coast. Trainsplit is trying to charge me a fee of 15% based on an expensive cross-London fare that I would never buy. That then looks expensive when its a £6+ fee on a ticket cost of £24
In practise its no longer my first point of call because of the incentives offered elsewhere and Im using LNER because of the cashback offer even though I think my travel on LNER services has been limited to 1 return trip between Kings Cross and Peterborough in the last year.
Currently the only tickets i buy through trainsplit are those to Underground Zones, usually to pick up an Intercity Coach at Finchley Road/ Golders Green. As these are always TOD I rather imagine that trainsplit looses money on them.
I can see it would be different if your travel included a lot of journeys on something like Cross-country but thats of little use to those of us in the southeast.
This is the crux of the matter for me and I suspect its because of my home location on the Kent coast. Trainsplit is trying to charge me a fee of 15% based on an expensive cross-London fare that I would never buy.
Why are you searching for a part of the journey you would never buy?
Given you buy tickets from the other companies you suggest, and given you never buy the cross London element, why is it you appear to be comparing a search from Kent on Trainsplit with a search from the other side of London, on other sites?
Unless there is something we are missing, something doesn't quite add up.
In practise its no longer my first point of call because of the incentives offered elsewhere and Im using LNER because of the cashback offer even though I think my travel on LNER services has been limited to 1 return trip between Kings Cross and Peterborough in the last year.
Currently the only tickets i buy through trainsplit are those to Underground Zones, usually to pick up an Intercity Coach at Finchley Road/ Golders Green. As these are always TOD I rather imagine that trainsplit looses money on them.
I can see it would be different if your travel included a lot of journeys on something like Cross-country but thats of little use to those of us in the southeast.
If Trainsplit doesn't save money for your journeys, there wouldn't be a fee, as the only fee is where there is a saving. And if the saving is very small, the fee is going to be small as you get to keep 85 per cent of any saving.
So I'm not sure if there is some confusion here, or maybe shifting of goalposts.
If there is a journey where you feel the fee is too high, feel free to post a link to it and a screenshot and we can certainly look into it.
There have been some edge cases where there can be issues regarding choosing the correct fare to compare with, but constructive feedback is always positively received.
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And if you really think the fee is excessive, you can do as you suggest and then add a donation that strikes you as fair.
To me £25 would seem perfectly fair if the site had genuinely saved me more than six times that amount on tickets that I would have bought anyway, however, it may be that the through fare that the site uses as a basis for comparison is not one that I would have paid. It may be that I would have driven, flown or travelled by coach if I hadn't found splits on the forum's site. In that case, a share of any saving I've made compared to those other modes might seem a fairer reflection of the value I've had from the resource.
In practice I just pay the fee (though it's never been anywhere near £25, so far!).
All good points and one thing I feel train companies don't like to admit, is that sites such as the forum's/Trainsplit can, and do, actually grow the market.
Train companies typically seem to take the view that the fare is the fare, and that if anyone is paying less than that (e.g. by starting or finishing short, or buying a loophole ticket, or a combination of tickets) then any shortfall is lost revenue to the railway, without accepting the possibility that some people are only prepared to travel if the fare is reduced to the level they are paying.
For example if there was no way to pay less than £19.40 for an inter-available York to Leeds fare, I would always travel by either bus (£4) or by Northern (£13.80) and never ever make that journey on TPE or XC.
I met a financial director of a TOC on a train to York a while back, and I put it to them that split ticket sites actually grew the market; they did actually agree with me. Of course this was very much off the record, and there is no way TOCs would officially admit this.
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I can't seem to find details of the fee I will be charged for my split tickets ahead of making a booking enquiry.
The i that comes up next to the split price merely says the fee is up to 15%. What is the precise fee structure and shouldn't this be easy to find from the homepage before making a booking?
There is no booking fee and no fee added to the price displayed. The full price is advertised at the earliest stage, so you can be confident that id the actual price.
There is only a fee where the site has identified a saving compared to the price that a train company would ask you to pay, for the same journey.
Where these prices differ, 85 per cent of the saving is handed to you, with 15 per cent retained by the site (and then distributed, with the forum receiving a proportion of it).
It all adds up and helps support the forum, and enables us to keep adverts non-intrusive and offer other activities such as free fares workshops, we also ran a free Photoshop workshop too.
Also if anyone reading this would like to attend a forum meal, get in touch if you have never attended one before as we may be able to provide your first meal on us.
Why are you searching for a part of the journey you would never buy?
Given you buy tickets from the other companies you suggest, and given you never buy the cross London element, why is it you appear to be comparing a search from Kent on Trainsplit with a search from the other side of London, on other sites?
Unless there is something we are missing, something doesn't quite add up.
Because on certain routes north of London (MML, Avanti to Chester) northbound there are still bargain advances available, about a month ago I travelled to Sheffield from Rye for about £3 more than a single to St Pancras. Southbound as Im often returning late evening there are even more routes available at bargain prices.
As a consequence on a day football trip I often now travel north on Megabus or Flix to the northwest and return on an Avanti service.
If cheap tickets on those routes are not available i then resort to splitting in London or known savers such as LNR trent valley services, route Kenny Olympia tickets etc. often with a change in ticket type mid journey or an overlap or a coach operator. I would never buy the full price LNER or Avanti plus connections ticket that trainsplit base their fee on.
If Trainsplit doesn't save money for your journeys, there wouldn't be a fee, as the only fee is where there is a saving. And if the saving is very small, the fee is going to be small as you get to keep 85 per cent of any saving.
So I'm not sure if there is some confusion here, or maybe shifting of goalposts.
If there is a journey where you feel the fee is too high, feel free to post a link to it and a screenshot and we can certainly look into it.
Theres no shifting of goalposts here or confusion on my part. The bottom line is that many people can do the same travel much cheaper than trainsplit because they will consider modes that trainsplit doesnt, ticket overlaps, partial railcard journeys that trainsplit doesnt. Trainsplits fees are imho too expensive- if trainsplit cant make a business case on reduced fees thats not really my problem anymore than why LNER give me 10% discount and then 2% perks on their own tickets
But if I use Trainsplit to identify split ticket opportunities then I do purchase through them because my view is it is unethical not to do so. I’m not comfortable using their systems and then buying from somewhere else. If everyone did that Trainsplit would not exist and everyone would lose out.
Today I’ve travelled to Bath to see a rugby match using a combination of tickets. I identified the combination and have been using them for many years before Trainsplit was a thing (since at least 2008!). I didn't use Trainsplit to buy these tickets but if I do purchase via the site I add the tickets separately to the basket because at least then Trainsplit (and in turn the forum) gets some benefit.
I also don‘t feel comfortable using Trainsplit just to identify cheaper split ticket opportunities and then purchase my tickets separately from elsewhere. It wouldn’t be fair and if everyone did that Trainsplit would soon go out of business. I find Trainsplit very useful and appreciate the work that they do and don’t mind paying a few pounds fee if they have saved me quite a bit of money.
However, the amount of fee being asked for needs to be reasonable, and there is one fare in particular that I use occasionally where I will purchase my tickets separately. I do still use the forums booking system through Trainsplit to buy these tickets so at least the forum gets some benefit. Whenever I travel from Nottingham down to Devon and Cornwall I know from past experience to do at least one split at Cheltenham which gives a big saving. Slightly more can be saved by additional splits at Bristol and Tiverton Parkway. I know this, so Trainsplit are not finding me a new split.
XC Anytime through fares are extortionate for this journey and a split at Cheltenham allows a 1 hour earlier start for my return journey which can be done with off peak tickets. Therefore even for just a single traveller using a Senior Railcard, the saving is so large that the maximum £25 fee would be charged. I wouldn’t pay that as it’s something I know about and is an unusual exception caused by XC ridiculous pricing, which only applies to one particular train at around 8.30am. For most other journeys with reasonable sensible pricing I don’t mind paying a small fee to help the work of Trainsplit and the forum.
Because on certain routes north of London (MML, Avanti to Chester) northbound there are still bargain advances available, about a month ago I travelled to Sheffield from Rye for about £3 more than a single to St Pancras.
Southbound as Im often returning late evening there are even more routes available at bargain prices.
As a consequence on a day football trip I often now travel north on Megabus or Flix to the northwest and return on an Avanti service.
If cheap tickets on those routes are not available i then resort to splitting in London or known savers such as LNR trent valley services, route Kenny Olympia tickets etc. often with a change in ticket type mid journey or an overlap or a coach operator. I would never buy the full price LNER or Avanti plus connections ticket that trainsplit base their fee on.
In that case there isn't going to be much of a fee, if you look at the portion of journey you are going to be making, i.e. if you are making a like for like comparison.
In that case can you provide an example of an actual itinerary where the fee is particularly high, and where you book that journey through one of the other retailers you mentioned?
In that case the comparison wouldn't be with the sites you mentioned but would instead be with a bus, coach or air operator. I doubt this applies to many journeys or many people.
And if they find it expensive when Trainsplit is finding a huge saving of dozens of pounds, then they would find the through train fare really expensive!
Are you combining two separate Railcards? If not then Trainsplit will handle this. If so, then again the comparison with other sites isn't fair because they won't do this either!
I also don‘t feel comfortable using Trainsplit just to identify cheaper split ticket opportunities and then purchase my tickets separately from elsewhere. It wouldn’t be fair and if everyone did that Trainsplit would soon go out of business. I find Trainsplit very useful and appreciate the work that they do and don’t mind paying a few pounds fee if they have saved me quite a bit of money.
However, the amount of fee being asked for needs to be reasonable, and there is one fare in particular that I use occasionally where I will purchase my tickets separately. I do still use the forums booking system through Trainsplit to buy these tickets so at least the forum gets some benefit.
Whenever I travel from Nottingham down to Devon and Cornwall I know from past experience to do at least one split at Cheltenham which gives a big saving. Slightly more can be saved by additional splits at Bristol and Tiverton Parkway. I know this, so Trainsplit are not finding me a new split.
XC Anytime through fares are extortionate for this journey and a split at Cheltenham allows a 1 hour earlier start for my return journey which can be done with off peak tickets. Therefore even for just a single traveller using a Senior Railcard, the saving is so large that the maximum £25 fee would be charged. I wouldn’t pay that as it’s something I know about and is an unusual exception caused by XC ridiculous pricing, which only applies to one particular train at around 8.30am. For most other journeys with reasonable sensible pricing I don’t mind paying a small fee to help the work of Trainsplit and the forum.
Problem is there is no easy way to establish a users prior knowledge; the solution is, as you say, to put multiple journeys in your basket and then you reduce (or eliminate) the fee, while still supporting the site.
There are tickets I buy for journeys I might make that this forums site couldn't find in a search.
Thus if I wish to make even longer journeys, I combine these tickets with the power of forums site to save even further than I othereise could on my own or I l otherwise could solely using the forums site.
No cash back is likely to match the saving, unless it is a ticket I known about that the forums site couldn't bring up for the journey I wish to make.
I understand the 5%/10% cashback is a limited time offer from certain credit cards such as American Express and Lloyds Banking Group, and is funded partially by the card issuers and partially by the merchant.
An FOI request on the subject would fall to be refused under section 43 (2) of the Act (commercially sensitive information).
I understand the 5%/10% cashback is a limited time offer from certain credit cards such as American Express and Lloyds Banking Group, and is funded partially by the card issuers and partially by the merchant.
An FOI request on the subject would fall to be refused under section 43 (2) of the Act (commercially sensitive information).
Details about the cashback offer itself and any agreements between LNER and Amex/Monzo/TopCashback/Quidco/Awin/whoever, sure, but I don't see why details about the funding from LNER would be rejected under FOI.
A fundamental problem the likes of Trainsplit have is that even semi-regular / informed travellers will tend to get to know where the best splits usually are. I do not in any way begrudge paying a website the “finders fee” the first time I want to go to someplace even if its £25 and buy from the website, but I do notice what splits I am offered and next time I first try the same splits myself. I might not always get the optimal result second time around doing it myself, but if the saving is similar to the previous occasion or I’m happy with the saving I’ll then just buy direct from a TOC to save more. So for such semi-regular travel, the share of the savings model may not be guaranteed to be sustainable longer term.
A fundamental problem the likes of Trainsplit have is that even semi-regular / informed travellers will tend to get to know where the best splits usually are. I do not in any way begrudge paying a website the “finders fee” the first time I want to go to someplace even if its £25 and buy from the website, but I do notice what splits I am offered and next time I first try the same splits myself. I might not always get the optimal result second time around doing it myself, but if the saving is similar to the previous occasion or I’m happy with the saving I’ll then just buy direct from a TOC to save more. So for such semi-regular travel, the share of the savings model may not be guaranteed to be sustainable longer term.
In that case, simply add each ticket to your basket separately; no fee would be payable as there is no booking fee.
The forum still benefits by a share of the commission, especially if the fares are high value and/or e-tickets are chosen (rather than TOD, which is expensive to operate and the TOCs pass these costs onto retailers)
