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ORR unveils station usage data between April 2022 and March 2023
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deltic
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And Salford Crescent to Manchester Victoria!
JW4
Member
Bordesley has a direct scheduled service (non-match days) on Saturdays only, departing 14:08 to Kidderminster via Moor Street, Snow Hill and Smethwick Galton Bridge. It doesn’t have any service to New Street.
Paddington Elizabeth Line, as I noticed earlier today, seems to be an extremely, in fact surprisingly, busy point. I know TCR is the busiest on the line but it would not have surprised me if Paddington had turned out to be.
However, like all the Liz stations there is much usage just within the Core. We didn't count Paddington Praed Street Underground in before for numbers, so is a poor comparison to do so for the same journeys now.
dk1
Veteran Member
Yes I have noticed how busy the station and car park is again and like everything around Cambridge the success just goes on and on. Cambridge South will also be a hit from day one of opening. Such a prosperous city/area these days.
SussexSeagull
Member
When I split ticket to get to London and beyond, sometimes it works out cheaper from Durrington to get an off peak return to Preston Park travelling on Southern then get a Thameslink only return to London. If enough people are doing this it might help the numbers a bit?
dk1
Veteran Member
How does that line up with anticipated usage in the first year do you know?
Kite159
Veteran Member
Short farers buying a ticket to/from Preston Park to bypass the barriers at Brighton/Hove?
northwichcat
Veteran Member
I like the new breakdown of data. Unlike the old data, it correctly implies that there's a lot of reduced (school aged) travel between Greenbank and Knutsford and between Altrincham/Hale and Knutsford. It also shows current demand still provides a stronger case for an additional hourly Greenbank to Manchester service, with one service being limited stop, rather than an additional hourly all stops from Chester to Manchester.
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Looks like it could have been one person on a child/railcard discounted ticket, travelling on a return from Crewe!
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
Looks like it could have been one person on a child/railcard discounted ticket, travelling on a return from Crewe!
Lies, damned lies and stats ... comparing apples and oranges. What is more useful is information; eg WHY has usage at X gone up or down by this or that %? As identified upthread the increase in WFH and reduction in Monday-Friday commuting is likely a strong factor (in some places, eg 'Stockbroker belt to Waterloo). Long Covid effects, strikes and their chilling effect, short-forming, crush-loading, surly service, new routes eg facilitated by Lizzie Line, very multifactorial; thus hard to relate effect / cause.
Anticipated? Quoted? '
Will it ever be possible to attain a 'steady state'/ 'normal' baseline?
What value are these figures to planners- some I hope or why bother- not good enough on their own to justify the expenditure. The 'so what' question?
northwichcat
Veteran Member
I don't think they can. When with some work colleagues we needed to get from a pub near Moorgate to an event being held near Tottenham Court Road. We went in through the Moorgate entrance, tapped in there and walked to the Elizabeth Line platform at Liverpool Street. They don't know if we caught the Elizabeth Line or if we took the Northern line down to Bank and changed there.
dk1
Veteran Member
Not quite sure what you mean. You’ve gone a little bit deep there. Just wondered if anybody knew the expected usage in the first year when in the planning stage that was all.
Pre-pandemic Watford Junction was busiest in Hertfordshire, but it's now behind St. Albans City by ~36,000; I wonder how much of that's down to Watford's Oyster advantage going away since contactless was extended to St. Albans, how much is down to where home working's increased more, and how much is down to people finding it preferable to change at Farringdon. It's almost still the busiest station on the WCML which isn't an Avanti terminus as well, but Coventry's overtaken it.
There's different numbers on this thread:
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/campaigners-‘aghast’-that-£20m-new-reston-station-in-borders-may-be-served-by-just-eight-trains-a-day.218916/#post-5187889
20,000 is the lowest number I can see.
There was one lady going to Reston in my carriage yesterday but clearly not getting many passengers a day. I might go there again sometime to get to Eyemouth (or even to get to Duns where I've never been) but I can't see myself using it on a regular basis for leisure purposes like I can for East Linton. Problem with Reston is it only caters to very limited Eyemouth/Duns etc-Edinburgh demand and doesn't make any sense to use for southbound journeys over Berwick's superior LNER/XC service.
dk1
Veteran Member
Interesting stuff & thank you. Looks like it was not expected to be that heavily used then.
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At 14,558 my local BRUNDALL GARDENS saw its highest usage than at anytime I recall since I moved here over 20yrs ago.
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YorksLad12
Established Member
Ta. I spotted some (more) tables the other week when pootling around trying to find a list of which operators called at which stations. It's only a faff for me as I have my Google Map thing to plot out - means looking at more files for the same dat, when it used to all be in the same table.
Read... oh, yes (ahem). Why they couldn't just wait then, instead of giving us a teaser, I don't know.
Ta. That's just the kind of table I'd do
Ta. I think it was your thread that first alerted me to the existence of significant flows.
deltic
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They are extremely useful. The more data the rail industry publishes the better.
They can provide an indication of
the propensity to use rail by looking at trips per head of population and or workforce within a given distance of station
how frequency can drive demand by benchmarking across routes
trends of changes in rail patronage in different areas
how rail use ramps up at new stations
whether it is worth keeping some stations open at all
why some stations should have more or fewer services than at present
dk1
Veteran Member
Such a good service now.
Goldfish62
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Six of service disruption (strikes then Covid then more strikes). I'm certain plenty of people have just gone away and not come back.
Lots of fun to be had with the new "top destination" figures.
For instance, in Scotland the stations with the highest percentage of journeys to the "top destination" were:
1. Taynuilt (to Oban) - 90.6%
2. Beauly (to Inverness) - 85.3%
3. Dalmally (to Oban) - 84.7%
4. Barry Links (to Dundee) - 83.4%
5. Longniddry (to Edinburgh) - 82.6%
6. Hawkhead (to Glasgow Central) - 82.0%
7. North Berwick (to Edinburgh) - 81.1%
8. Connel Ferry (to Oban) - 80.8%
9. Prestonpans (to Edinburgh) - 80.6%
10. Hairmyres (to Glasgow Central) - 80.5%
The stations with the lowest percentages were:
1. Glasgow Central (to Paisley Gilmour Street) - 6.6%
2. Charing Cross (to Glasgow Queen Street) - 7.5%
3. Partick (to Glasgow Central) - 10.2%
4. Argyle Street (to Rutherglen) - 10.3%
5. Edinburgh (to Glasgow Queen Street) - 11.8%
6. Edinburgh Gateway (to Inverkeithing) - 12.0%
7. Anderston (to Rutherglen) - 12.2%
8. High Street Glasgow (to Charing Cross) - 13.3%
9. Aberdeen (to Edinburgh) - 13.3%
10. Bridge of Orchy (to Corrour) - 14.6%
For instance, in Scotland the stations with the highest percentage of journeys to the "top destination" were:
1. Taynuilt (to Oban) - 90.6%
2. Beauly (to Inverness) - 85.3%
3. Dalmally (to Oban) - 84.7%
4. Barry Links (to Dundee) - 83.4%
5. Longniddry (to Edinburgh) - 82.6%
6. Hawkhead (to Glasgow Central) - 82.0%
7. North Berwick (to Edinburgh) - 81.1%
8. Connel Ferry (to Oban) - 80.8%
9. Prestonpans (to Edinburgh) - 80.6%
10. Hairmyres (to Glasgow Central) - 80.5%
The stations with the lowest percentages were:
1. Glasgow Central (to Paisley Gilmour Street) - 6.6%
2. Charing Cross (to Glasgow Queen Street) - 7.5%
3. Partick (to Glasgow Central) - 10.2%
4. Argyle Street (to Rutherglen) - 10.3%
5. Edinburgh (to Glasgow Queen Street) - 11.8%
6. Edinburgh Gateway (to Inverkeithing) - 12.0%
7. Anderston (to Rutherglen) - 12.2%
8. High Street Glasgow (to Charing Cross) - 13.3%
9. Aberdeen (to Edinburgh) - 13.3%
10. Bridge of Orchy (to Corrour) - 14.6%
Looking at newish stations, also interesting to see that Soham is now 55,518 (although the previous statistics only covered 4 months) despite the 1tp2h service and that the biggest destination is Ely not Cambridge although only about a third of the total. I would have thought Cambridge would have had a plurality?
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Interesting to look at Hatton and Lapworth - they certainly punch above their weight when it comes to season ticket entries and exits, driven by the annual season ticket being the cheapest Gold Card.
Hatton has 78,188 entries and exits with 57,508 of these being season ticket entries/exits
Lapworth has 77,008 extries and exits with 60,528 of these being season ticket entries/exits
The FAQs tell us that an annual season ticket assume 480 single journeys and we do need to realise that there might be some genuine season ticket holders at these stations we can take a guess at the number of people who buy a Hatton to Lapworth purely for the Gold Card benefits. Suspect it's around 100.
Hatton has 78,188 entries and exits with 57,508 of these being season ticket entries/exits
Lapworth has 77,008 extries and exits with 60,528 of these being season ticket entries/exits
The FAQs tell us that an annual season ticket assume 480 single journeys and we do need to realise that there might be some genuine season ticket holders at these stations we can take a guess at the number of people who buy a Hatton to Lapworth purely for the Gold Card benefits. Suspect it's around 100.
You asked for a comparison with anticipated first year useage. I'm suggesting that much has changed since Reston was planned. Initial proposals tend to inflate ideas of usage, and be overoptimistic about delivery dates and costs- it's called 'optimism bias'. And this is encouraged indirectly in order to get approval and backing. We've also had Covid, reducing current expectations, and refocusing (whether anticipated or not) of journeys previously undertaken or expected in the locality may also be a factor. The frequency, timings and stopping patterns of trains are further considerations. Such matters are typical 'why?' questions. I think you recognise that it's not as straightforward as 'numbers are up', which suit media and political reports.
In short- sorry, I dont know the figures, and if as I suspect use of Reston is much lower than projected, they may not be easily found now. I genuinely wish you well.
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The fact Woolwich has 8m justifies why a station was built there when apparently it was originally going to be fast from Custom House to Abbey Wood.
If you build a direct fast service into Central London and Canary Wharf from those two parts of SE London which for decades have been underserved by Southeastern and previous TOCs, the customers will come.
The success of the London Overground ELL extension to South London is another example if you provide a regular turn up and go service that connects with other TfL and NR modes, passengers will use it in comparison to the legacy poor TOC service provided previously.
If you build a direct fast service into Central London and Canary Wharf from those two parts of SE London which for decades have been underserved by Southeastern and previous TOCs, the customers will come.
The success of the London Overground ELL extension to South London is another example if you provide a regular turn up and go service that connects with other TfL and NR modes, passengers will use it in comparison to the legacy poor TOC service provided previously.
Western Sunset
Established Member
I don't understand Column F (labelled as just "entries and exits"). For example, the figure for Pilning is 2,554, whilst Plymouth is 205. What's all that about?
Peter Sarf
Established Member
I have the same puzzlement with Liverpool Street - up from 30m to 80m ?.
This is a very big increase to get just from one new line over the existing six tracks into Liverpool Street.
So what were Paddington and Liverpool Street like just before Covid - is it mostly down to a post Covid recovery ?.
If anything I would expect the Elizabeth line to have reduced entries and Exits at Paddington and Liverpool Street with people simply passing through.
My guess with Victoria is that, post Covid, I have come to see Thameslink and the Elizabeth Line via Farringdon as my chief way of entering/exiting London and beyond. That is from Croydon and so Victoria has fallen of my choice with only Clapham Junction featuring in that direction.Leeds has retaken the crown of the busiest in the North. That is enough for me.
All that commuter traffic. Now working from home or at least hybrid working. Season ticket sales have collapsed in the post-pandemic reality.
Notice Victoria's similar collapse.
Right, so not keen on stats then.
Won't be perfect and always will have loose ends BUT what alternative is there for those who need to know what is being used and by how much ?.
It does serve to show up bad methods of estimating usage at new stations or provoke question as to why there were errors (up or down).
These stats also help to see any recovery from Covid. To be frank right now I think DfT are probably very keen to save money spent on a declining railway. They will have seen costs go up and revenues come down. Without stats showing any sign of recovery the Dft would be very keen to simply look at service reductions and closures.
Has Corby been used more by people wanting nearby destinations on the Midland Mainline while their stations and line has been shut for electrification ?.
I hope it is caused by the improved service and it then goes to show what the latent demand was.
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Entries and exits RANK. i.e. busy stations have a low number.
NSEWonderer
Established Member
May have something to do with the EL offering faster times towards the west via Paddington.
You'll notice Waterloo brimming whenever Paddington has serious delays towards reading and Co like the incident on Thursday of last week.
Only way to explain how Paddington has risen so much as it used to be a nightmare to get to from South east and Co having to use the Southeastern, Jubliee and Bakerloo to just get into Paddington alone.
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