Euston to Holyhead via Shrewsbury

[tbtc]

Has it brought the north and south faster together??? Yes, yes I do.

Was that worth £1.6m?

I could spend £1.6m linking two places and succeed at "bringing them faster together", but would it be value for money?

Doesn't bother me, as its Welsh money paying for it, but there are a lot of better uses of transport budget (like providing services to places where private sector jobs are, providing direct links for tourists to come and spend their holiday money...)

 

[merlodlliw]

Has it brought the north and south faster together??? Yes, yes I do.

Its brought Valley & Rhoose faster, Not North Wales in my opinion, thank you for your response 175001.
As you work & live in Manchester you will be well aware of the need for extra services between Pic & North Wales

Bob

 

[Gareth Marston]

as i have said before cardiff is the ninth most popular destination from bangor,also dont forget that some people also buy advances for the other hours service from bangor to bhm with a change at shrewsbury into the man-cdf,plenty of people travel from the coast to wrexham as a shopping service too.i would say that wrexham has reaped some economic benefits from the hourly service from the coast.i dont see people from warrington or manchester coming to wrexham as ashopping destination in the way that they do from flint,rhyl etc.as for nth sth services i dont see anyone calling for the liverpool to norwich service to be split at nottingham just because all the passengers on the train travelling to norwich didnt join at lime street! incidentally work is under way in the former goods yard at bangor to increase the car park by 140 spaces we look forward to further growth in travel from bangor.there will be days when there is less nth sth travel, college hols,business hols,wag not in session etc.

Wrexham shopping service? The Eagles Meadows shopping development which opened last year is as far from Wrexham General as you can be in the town center being on the other side of it. The centers unique selling point is of course its underground car park not its rail links. Parts of the the rest of town centre are somewhat rundown I'm afraid. Some might have been curious the once but I cant see that there much more on offer for someone coming from the North Wales Coast than is already provided in Chester. Which has more and larger shops anyway. There's a retail park In Llandduno too and I understand that the brown field site to the east of Prestatyn town centre adjacent to the railway is earmarked for a retail park including Marks and Spencer's.

Bangor is indeed lucky to have the space free- every station in the UK could do with more parking space. It perhaps says more about economic conditions in Bangor that the old goods yard survived undeveloped.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Was that worth £1.6m?

I could spend £1.6m linking two places and succeed at "bringing them faster together", but would it be value for money?

Doesn't bother me, as its Welsh money paying for it, but there are a lot of better uses of transport budget (like providing services to places where private sector jobs are, providing direct links for tourists to come and spend their holiday money...)

It does however "bother me" as I live in Wales and can see that there are better choices than yet more north to south trains. OK I live in Mid Wales and will undoubtedly trumpet the Cambrian however I do travel across all Wales and the Borders on business and can see the bigger picture than my local station. Quite frankly a parkway station for Pontypool would be top of my shopping list giving the people of the North of Torfaen and Monmouthshire a chance to park up and access the train to get into Cardiff and employment opportunity.

 

[merlodlliw]

Wrexham shopping service? The Eagles Meadows shopping development which opened last year is as far from Wrexham General as you can be in the town center being on the other side of it. The centers unique selling point is of course its underground car park not its rail links. Parts of the the rest of town centre are somewhat rundown I'm afraid. Some might have been curious the once but I cant see that there much more on offer for someone coming from the North Wales Coast than is already provided in Chester. Which has more and larger shops anyway. There's a retail park In Llandduno too and I understand that the brown field site to the east of Prestatyn town centre adjacent to the railway is earmarked for a retail park including Marks and Spencer's.

Bangor is indeed lucky to have the space free- every station in the UK could do with more parking space. It perhaps says more about economic conditions in Bangor that the old goods yard survived undeveloped.

Much of your comment is correct, A Rhyl bus Company runs specials to Wrexham on Mondays( Market Day), as do other bus operators, its the buses that feed Wrexham shoppers not the train,& as Gareth says Eagles Meadows with its big stores is a mile from the rail station, with over a thousand car spaces underground.
Stopping a well used Birmingham service for a Cardiff service,shows how little WAG understand of North East Wales commuters.

Bob

 

[175001]

Its brought Valley & Rhoose faster, Not North Wales in my opinion, thank you for your response 175001.
As you work & live in Manchester you will be well aware of the need for extra services between Pic & North Wales

I'm originally from Betws-y-Coed so i'd love to see £1.6 million spent on the Conwy Valley Line

The hope for extra Chester-Manchester services will come with the Northern Hub project I'm sure.

 

[Gareth Marston]

I'm originally from Betws-y-Coed so i'd love to see £1.6 million spent on the Conwy Valley Line

The hope for extra Chester-Manchester services will come with the Northern Hub project I'm sure.

Yes the Ordsall curve has got the go ahead and the plans include 6tph between Manchester and Leeds, 2 tph to Manchester Airport, 2 tph to Liverpool, 1 tph to Southport via Wigan and 1tph to Chester. However with the artificial barrier of the Wales and Border franchise these Transpenine Express's will come no further West, even though historically they did go along the North Wales Coast.

When there pouring £600 million of tarmac into the Head of The Valleys Road to create just 12 miles of new carriageway there will be crumbs from the table for everyone else.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Much of your comment is correct, A Rhyl bus Company runs specials to Wrexham on Mondays( Market Day), as do other bus operators, its the buses that feed Wrexham shoppers not the train,& as Gareth says Eagles Meadows with its big stores is a mile from the rail station, with over a thousand car spaces underground.
Stopping a well used Birmingham service for a Cardiff service,shows how little WAG understand of North East Wales commuters.

Bob

My other half has tried Eagle Meadows a couple of times, but will still bypass Wrexham and head for the park & ride on the outskirts of Chester. However I suspect it will keep some Wrexham £ in Wrexham that were being spent elsewhere. She likes the idea of Birmingham and the train but the reality of a 2 hourly service and gross overcrowding coming out of New St puts her off though she has done it over the years.

 

[175001]

even though historically they did go along the North Wales Coast.

Indeed, the days of a Holyhead-Scarborough service have long passed

 

[tbtc]

Indeed, the days of a Holyhead-Scarborough service have long passed

No railway reason they can't be brought back (Scarborough - Liverpool is every hour after all) and encourage more people to visit the North Wales coast.

 

[Rhydgaled]

When there pouring £600 million of tarmac into the Head of The Valleys Road to create just 12 miles of new carriageway there will be crumbs from the table for everyone else.

I think there needs to be a petition against that. Last night I re-calculated the cost per mile of electrification based on the £62 million that's being spouted about for Swansea to Cardiff and I got 1.4 million. At that rate, and assuming a baseline of GWML electrification through to Swansea, WAG could electrify all 134 miles of the ValleyLines network (except Severn Tunnel Junction to Cheltenham Spa) for under £200 million. Purchase 61 3-car class 377s as well and they would have only spent £400 million of that £600 million. The figure 61 isn't completly random, it's the number of ATW 150s and pacers wikipedia provides added together. The 150s released would be useful across the rural lines of Wales.

 

[Gareth Marston]

I think there needs to be a petition against that. Last night I re-calculated the cost per mile of electrification based on the £62 million that's being spouted about for Swansea to Cardiff and I got 1.4 million. At that rate, and assuming a baseline of GWML electrification through to Swansea, WAG could electrify all 134 miles of the ValleyLines network (except Severn Tunnel Junction to Cheltenham Spa) for under £200 million. Purchase 61 3-car class 377s as well and they would have only spent £400 million of that £600 million. The figure 61 isn't completly random, it's the number of ATW 150s and pacers wikipedia provides added together. The 150s released would be useful across the rural lines of Wales.

The money being spent to finish an old welsh office join the dots road project today is grossly obscene and comes at huge opportunity cost for the transport of the entire south wales region. Despite most modern economists citing workforce skills/eduction as the primary driver of the post industrial globalised economy most "stakeholders" in Wales still think building roads brings economic prosperity. They ignore the fact that Merthyr has had a dual carriageway (A470) for 20 years but is still deprived and the A55 expressway has failed to do anything for Anglesey's "flat lined" economy.

Cardiff City Council are building a 4 million sq ft business park to the south of Central station hoping that the electrified line to London and being near to public transport links will create a City region effect. You cant get to this part of Cardiff by dual carriageway as built up areas and the city centre are in the way. Yet a 2 car Pacer is still the mode of transport from the hinterland. The Heads of the Valleys are chock a block with half empty 70's/80/s business parks that were suppose to replace heavy industry, despite most of the A465 being dual carriageway already business on the whole doesn't want to know.

You have to link the population to where the jobs are /will be and the only option is to electrify the valley lines, all the road traffic snarls to standstill at the Coryton Interchange (A470/M4) already and Valleys folk still haven't got into Cardiff.

 

[merlodlliw]

The money being spent to finish an old welsh office join the dots road project today is grossly obscene and comes at huge opportunity cost for the transport of the entire south wales region. Despite most modern economists citing workforce skills/eduction as the primary driver of the post industrial globalised economy most "stakeholders" in Wales still think building roads brings economic prosperity. They ignore the fact that Merthyr has had a dual carriageway (A470) for 20 years but is still deprived and the A55 expressway has failed to do anything for Anglesey's "flat lined" economy.

http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/nor...-a55-thanks-to-more-roadworks-55578-28444470/

I can imagine the weekends of July & August with the usual 20 mile tailbacks, as for Anglesey who would start a factory when the County cant even run its Council due to Political infighting, even the Commissioners sent in are suspect, see this http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/nor...-aldridge-i-m-not-a-wag-crony-55578-28444420/ what a shambles.

One asks how many jobs in the private sector as Gerald & WAGAIR brought in to Anglesey? answer none, but it offers a first class Premier service for the Commissioners on £500 a day/best hotels plus expenses.

Bob