Fare dodging at Wigan Wallgate

[strange6]

A sight never ceases to amze me when I get off the train at Wigan Wallgate and it occurs particularly when the guard has not been around the train collecting revenue from those getting on at unmanned stations. That sight is the use of Wigan Wallgate's platform lift by hordes of healthy young men and women.
I know what they're up to! The lift doors both at platform level and station entrance level are never supervised. RPI's are always present at Wigan Wallgate but they are situated at the top of the stairs, next to the ticket office, which is quite well secluded from the lift door. Quite easy to skip a fare when you haven't paid on the train. I'm amazed Wigan Wallgate Northern haven't sussed this out yet! They must be losing quite a bit of revenue, especially during peak times

 

[BrummyBoy]

When ive used Wigan Wallgate i only ever been checked for a ticket once (granted ive only ever used it a few times, the most recent been 2008).

 

[Flamingo]

Cardiff used to be the same. One RPI used to follow them down, and stop them as they were at the station doors. Always good for a laugh watching him in action.

 

[Captain Chaos]

Reading has a similar problem on certain platforms with lifts. Some of the lifts will allow you to exit/enter the station without going through the barriers. Fortunately the RPI's are aware of this and from time to time will block the lifts and anyone coming out without a ticket is in for a surprise when they are there!

I understand this problem won't exist once the station remodelling has been completed though.

 

[Intermodal]

Merseyrail have this issue at Lime St - or they used to - until they started putting RPIs at the top of the lift round the corner. People walk out the lift - see an RPI - bucket it but have nowhere to go.

 

[JoeGJ1984]

I think it's a similar situation at Birmingham New Street (in that the lifts will take you past the barriers - surely travellers must have become wise to this? Have the revenue protection staff become wise to this I wonder?)

 

[CarterUSM]

I would have thought it pretty obvious that people using the lifts would need to have their tickets checked during barrier times.

 

[bengolding]

Exiting via the lifts at New St into the taxi rank area is a sure way of avoiding the manual ticket check, if any determined people want to avoid it. Surprised that revenue staff haven't cauight onto this. But then again, you can often wave any ticket at the manual barrier. Hopefully, the revamped New St station will have much needed ticket gates. As DfT love them so much, the winner of the WCML franchise will no doubt have to put them up - many existing Virgin stations can easily be gated, e.g. Birmingham Intl, Wolves or Coventry.

 

[mindfeeder]

At New Street you could easily get away with flashing any old ticket at the ticket inspectors considering the amount of people who use the station.

 

[LexyBoy]

Reading has a similar problem on certain platforms with lifts. Some of the lifts will allow you to exit/enter the station without going through the barriers. Fortunately the RPI's are aware of this and from time to time will block the lifts and anyone coming out without a ticket is in for a surprise when they are there!

I understand this problem won't exist once the station remodelling has been completed though.

It certainly does - recently though there seem to be RPIs (often hordes thereof) more often than not. It did bring a smile to my face a while ago though, when some RPIs were sent up after a horde of youths with tiny bikes were spotted getting the lift... and all had valid tickets!

The reverse does happen though - I've seen someone taking the lift down to platform 4 (presumably having come from the car park) and had to come back and go down the stairs. Admittedly there are signs saying "ticket holders only" but they're not very noticeable.

 

[SS4]

The lift at new st has been known for ages although I've seen people get on without a ticket at local stations (five ways before the barriers was common and Aston) and change at new st: no exit = no check.

At New Street you could easily get away with flashing any old ticket at the ticket inspectors considering the amount of people who use the station.

Especially if you coalesce with a train just in from Euston or another busy destination, I've only ever been asked to show my railcard a couple of times at the gates.

Staffing level is also lower at the Victoria Square exit although no lift trick exists there

 

[BrummyBoy]

Agree, staff at New Street usually dont give a proper ticket check, that said last time i used New Street i was checked twice.

 

[Stonesourscotty]

Manchester Victoria has a Far Worse problem than Wallgate.. Exit from platforms 3-6 and Walk out the Victoria Carpark exit at the top of steps on Platform 6 ironically does happen quite a bit on Southport/Kirkby and Wigan trains.

Wallgates Problem is amde worse by having a Couple of Colleges on the routes within two stops of them.

Orrell/Gathurst are bad for fare dodgers during College times especially during lunch hours.

 

[strange6]

Manchester Victoria has a Far Worse problem than Wallgate.. Exit from platforms 3-6 and Walk out the Victoria Carpark exit at the top of steps on Platform 6 ironically does happen quite a bit on Southport/Kirkby and Wigan trains.

Wallgates Problem is amde worse by having a Couple of Colleges on the routes within two stops of them.

Orrell/Gathurst are bad for fare dodgers during College times especially during lunch hours.

You can also get free rides to Southport from Wigan if you do your research properly. There are so many inconsistencies in the rail network you could exploit with a bit of research and planning

 

[bnm]

You can also get free rides to Southport from Wigan if you do your research properly. There are so many inconsistencies in the rail network you could exploit with a bit of research and planning

Best not keep advertising them on a public forum then, eh?

 

[ian959]

Exiting via the lifts at New St into the taxi rank area is a sure way of avoiding the manual ticket check, if any determined people want to avoid it. Surprised that revenue staff haven't cauight onto this. But then again, you can often wave any ticket at the manual barrier. Hopefully, the revamped New St station will have much needed ticket gates. As DfT love them so much, the winner of the WCML franchise will no doubt have to put them up - many existing Virgin stations can easily be gated, e.g. Birmingham Intl, Wolves or Coventry.[/QUOTE

Actually I would think that Wolverhampton would be near impossible to practicably gate in its current form. The only platform entry/exit is far too narrow and at peak times the ticket office area would be far too congested (it often is now), as would likely be the exit area off Platform 1. Sorry for going OT.

 

[chuckles1066]

Cardiff used to be the same. One RPI used to follow them down, and stop them as they were at the station doors. Always good for a laugh watching him in action.

I've posted here previously about Filton Abbey Wood and the scores of MOD employees who, unless there's a sting in operation (as there was recently, complete with multiple PCSO presence, why would you need PCSO to attend?), enjoy a free daily commute.

Likewise, Bath Spa has two exits, the stairs where you encounter barriers and staff or a back way out which is used by all and sundry because there are no checks in place.

If FGW made more of an effort to maximise revenue streams they might actually be able to fix their rolling stock and not provide shortformed services.....just a thought

 

[stut]

Welwyn GC has a similar trick with the lifts (they're supposedly by request from barrier staff). However, it's not unknown for RPIs to leg it up the stairs if the lifts seem suspiciously busy...

However, don't assume that everybody using the dodgy exits is fare evading - plenty of us have valid tickets but just want to avoid the queues for exit that the TOCs insist don't exist!

 

[Flamingo]

I've posted here previously about Filton Abbey Wood and the scores of MOD employees who, unless there's a sting in operation (as there was recently, complete with multiple PCSO presence, why would you need PCSO to attend?), enjoy a free daily commute.

PCSO's were there to "keep the peace", as some individuals were very upset and irate at having to pay for their journey, especially when they had to do so two days in a row and were being PF'd. Also, if they tried to push past the revenue staff, revenue staff do not have powers to detain. The sight of a police uniform does often defuse situations, as people realise that they have to moderate their behaviour.

If FGW made more of an effort to maximise revenue streams they might actually be able to fix their rolling stock and not provide shortformed services.....just a thought

There would be a lot more posts on here complaining about "the nasty RPI gave me a PF" or "the nasty guard charged me a full open when I was 15 minutes off with my ADVANCE ticket", or "the train was 20 late waiting for police at Reading because someone had the wrong ticket...".

Be careful what you wish for!

 

[chuckles1066]

PCSO's were there to "keep the peace", as some individuals were very upset and irate at having to pay for their journey, especially when they had to do so two days in a row and were being PF'd. Also, if they tried to push past the revenue staff, revenue staff do not have powers to detain. The sight of a police uniform does often defuse situations, as people realise that they have to moderate their behaviour.

I'm fairly switched on but I genuinely don't know how to take your post.

Tongue-in-cheek?

Or are you *really* suggesting the concept of actually paying for your train journey is beyond the grasp of MOD employees' comprehension?

FWIW, the latter was my opinion having witnessed the indignation of the (very) long queue of potential fare-dodgers at first hand.

Why don't FGW employ someone dedicated to tracking down bottom-sniffers for, say, £30k a year? I'd do it........I can guarantee between Filton Abbey Wood and Bath I'd claw back five times my annual salary.

Any takers?

 

[Mojo]

People other than MOD staff use Filton station you know!

 

[Stonesourscotty]

I Know there are certain Services between Southport and Vic to... but im stuck on the Kirkby Line Where one carriage is full of Fare dodgers and the other gets checked...

Noticed Northern used dual guards on some Saturday workings on the Kirkby line recently presumably to avoid this issue recently with one just doing the doors and the other doing the tickets but the ticket guy was having a natter with everyone on board advising people of the cheapest possible tickets which amused me...

College days are alot worse than normal service days and as more people become aware of the loophole its clearly affecting loadings on local bus services to.

 

[deltic1989]

The station street Entrance/ Exit at Nottingham is ideal for avoiding fares. I've often had conversations with the mrs where the fact that the people that installed the ticket barriers there did'nt think it through. seems to be the case at a fair few stations if this thread is anything to go by. I wish good luck to the RPI's that are trying to catch these fare dodgers. why sould we pay our fare, and them get away with free riding? It really grinds my gears.

 

[chuckles1066]

People other than MOD staff use Filton station you know!

Not during early morning rush hour, which is when the sting was in operation.

I kid you not, the line of disgruntled punters fumbling around in their pockets and muttering would have filled a village hall.

As a non-rail person, I find it bizarre that FGW (and other TOCs) aren't more proactive in stamping down on fare evasion.

Everyone knows Filton Abbey Wood was built purely for the MOD establishment (what was wrong with the old Filton station?) so maybe there's a political angle to all of this?

Summut along the lines of "memo to FGW MD, lay off the MOD employees and we'll OBE you".

But what would I know?

 

[WestCoast]

Not during early morning rush hour, which is when the sting was in operation.

I kid you not, the line of disgruntled punters fumbling around in their pockets and muttering would have filled a village hall.

As a non-rail person, I find it bizarre that FGW (and other TOCs) aren't more proactive in stamping down on fare evasion.

Everyone knows Filton Abbey Wood was built purely for the MOD establishment (what was wrong with the old Filton station?) so maybe there's a political angle to all of this?

Why on earth is Filton Abbey Wood station unstaffed?:roll:.

I presume FGW employ their own RPIs. These MOD staff should be made to pay every day and if they get angry well tough. Contact their employers about them constantly fare evading, if they care. Put a "name and shame" board outside the station like London Midland and Tyne and Wear Metro do. If I ran the TOC that's what I would do. Or contact the media about the problem - I am sure the Daily Mail would love yet another "national disgrace".

FGW could get G4S as RPIs at this station(like Northern do), they are often rubbish about ticketing knowledge but some of them are like bouncers - you wouldn't mess with them when they form a human barrier.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Why on earth is Filton Abbey Wood station unstaffed?:roll:.

One of the greatest questions on Earth if you ask a pro-staffing person (such as myself ). There really is an air of mystery about it, both FGW and NRE say it is staffed, but for something like 1600-1900 only daily, or something equally as stupid, thought the portacabin booking office looks like it hasn't been touched for a while:

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations/sjp/FIT/images/photos/800/o1838-0000037.jpg

When was the last time a booking office was padlocked?

Strange one, I would think they could make more than enough money to justify it being there (obviously they did at one point) - could chuckles1066 or Mojo or another local clear this up?

 

[WestCoast]

One of the greatest questions on Earth if you ask a pro-staffing person (such as myself ). There really is an air of mystery about it, both FGW and NRE say it is staffed, but for something like 1600-1900 only daily, or something equally as stupid, thought the portacabin booking office looks like it hasn't been touched for a while:

Something rather odd about that one.

As a pro-staffing person as well, I like TOCs that care about staffing. I always think Merseyrail are quite good at this as almost all of their stations are staffed for long periods - even at some relatively lightly used stations.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Something rather odd about that one.

As a pro-staffing person as well, I like TOCs that care about staffing. I always think Merseyrail are quite good at this as almost all of their stations are staffed.

Same 'ere. I think Merseyrail's first-to-last staffing policy is really good, part of the wider Merseytravel initiative I think. Used to be the same under West Midlands Centro/Central Trains, but we all no where that's off to.

Greater manchester seem a lot less pro-staff though, there are so many stations that would benefit from them, for the purposes of this thread, places like Appley Bridge, and Orrell, or maybe Westhoughton, or Blackrod... you get the idea I'm sure.

 

[Jonny]

Equally though, if people are being held up because they want to pay and haven't had the chance, it is inevitable that frustration is going to occur. It is also annoying that people seem willing to wait - I have shown valid tickets to staff and they haven't even seen it or me for that matter.

 

[trickyvegas]

Manchester Victoria has a Far Worse problem than Wallgate.. Exit from platforms 3-6 and Walk out the Victoria Carpark exit at the top of steps on Platform 6 ironically does happen quite a bit on Southport/Kirkby and Wigan trains.

Or you can exit at the Salford end of the platforms via the footbridge to the front of the MEN, I use this occasionally if I'm headed down Deansgate/Chapel Street as it saves me a bit of time.