377 Graffiti

[SECR263]

Saw 377 614 and 621 heavily grafiited this morning on a fast LBG from ECR. About 940 ish. How long will it be allowed to run in this state. Does Southern have a policy of not running grafiited stock? Thanks

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Saw 377 614 and 621 heavily grafiited this morning on a fast LBG from ECR. About 940 ish. How long will it be allowed to run in this state. Does Southern have a policy of not running grafiited stock? Thanks

They'll be returned to depot for cleaning as soon as reasonably practical.

Not a pretty sight but I would rather the train turn up rather than be cancelled altogether

 

[physics34]

Saw 377 614 and 621 heavily grafiited this morning on a fast LBG from ECR. About 940 ish. How long will it be allowed to run in this state. Does Southern have a policy of not running grafiited stock? Thanks

Probably done in Epsom sidings... or maybe Tattenham.

Offensive language and itll be taken out of service straight away

 

[Javelin_55]

Offensive graffiti should be taken out of service at the first practical opportunity.

Any graffiti covering the windows will also be taken out of service, offensive or not.

 

[ComUtoR]

Any graffiti covering the windows will also be taken out of service, offensive or not.

I've always wondered about that. What's the reason behind it ?

 

[Javelin_55]

I've always wondered about that. What's the reason behind it ?

You've got me there. I've always assumed it was for safety reasons, as taking the unit out of service is never ideal and quite often drivers will refuse to work it anyway.

 

[stj]

About time the sale of paint spray cans is banned they are not good for the environment and have little genuine use

 

[Revilo]

About time the sale of paint spray cans is banned they are not good for the environment and have little genuine use

But why should legitimate users of spray cans be penalised for the actions of the graffiti ‘artists’? They’ll just find another way anyway.

 

[zwk500]

About time the sale of paint spray cans is banned they are not good for the environment and have little genuine use

Spray paint has plenty of legitimate uses for home decorations, and in the building and landscaping trades (for starters).

It's a cultural thing. Clear Vinyl wraps might be a worthwhile short term investment, so that when the Graffiti appears all that the depot needs to do is rip the vinyl off and replace it. I'm with other posters that so long as the graffiti isn't outright offensive then the unit should work normally until a clean one can replace it with minimum disruption to the service.

Round here the Belgian trains could be mistaken for legitimate 'community relations' projects, with graffiti covering the unit from top to bottom, including most of the windows.

 

[CFRAIL]

I always understood graffiti covering Windows was an issue for hearing impaired people who may rely on seeing station signage.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

I always understood graffiti covering Windows was an issue for hearing impaired people who may rely on seeing station signage.

Most trains now have internal passenger information screens that will display the next station on the route

 

[Busman]

Offensive graffiti should be taken out of service at the first practical opportunity.

Any graffiti covering the windows will also be taken out of service, offensive or not.

As long as the brakes work let the trains run, we have enough issues with trains not running as it is without someone wanting trains to be taken out of service because of a bit of graffiti, offensive or not.

If you're offended, look the other way.

Unbelieveable.

 

[43096]

As long as the brakes work let the trains run, we have enough issues with trains not running as it is without someone wanting trains to be taken out of service because of a bit of graffiti, offensive or not.

If you're offended, look the other way.

Unbelieveable.

Not unbelievable at all. It is well known that the graffiti vandals like to see their work in public - it gives more kudos, apparently. So having trains running around with graffiti on only encourages more vandalism - go to Belgium or Slovenia to see the effect of that. Therefore the policy should be one of zero tolerance with trains taken out of service to be cleaned.

 

[Turtle]

Not unbelievable at all. It is well known that the graffiti vandals like to see their work in public - it gives more kudos, apparently. So having trains running around with graffiti on only encourages more vandalism - go to Belgium or Slovenia to see the effect of that. Therefore the policy should be one of zero tolerance with trains taken out of service to be cleaned.

Agreed. Don't let these criminal vandals think they're the norm.

 

[king_walnut]

The 'rule' is that any obscene graffiti, or graffiti that goes more than halfway up the window means that the train should be taken out of service straight away, or doesn't enter service at all.

The reality is a lot different.

 

[Alanko]

About time the sale of paint spray cans is banned they are not good for the environment and have little genuine use

Knee-jerk nonsense.

I always think that the real issue is that folk can loiter around in the four foot in sidings and depots and go undetected.

 

[Busman]

Agreed. Don't let these criminal vandals think they're the norm.

Do you think the criminals / vandals care? They know their tags won't last long anyway, but cancelling a train during the day when in all honesty, the train will be cleaned in a few days anyway is sheer lunacy. Right now, train services are suffering enough as it is with strikes, reduced trains available because of old stock going off for scrap and existing trains needing maintenance without taking trains out of service because it might mean someone is offended for 3 seconds while a train speeds past at 75-80mph. Keep the trains in service until they can be treated without affecting the service levels.

Stop this nonsense.

 

[Mzzzs]

I would rather my train turn up than being cancelled due to some graffiti. I think this is Same for the many people taking the train across the country.

 

[Rich1974]

Not sure if this has been said but when they graffiti trains you'll notice they don't tend to touch the area around the head/tail lights, I was always told it's because they know the train won't come into service displaying their artwork if the lights can't be seen due to spraying.

 

[pdeaves]

Would it be a reasonable assumption that, the sooner cleaning happens, the easier it is? Once the paint has hardened and the solvent evaporated off, it would be much the same as the base (proper livery) layer, yes?

If my assumption is correct, then taking a unit out of service 'now' means fewer trains cancelled than if they wait.

Paint chemists feel free to chip in if I'm barking up the wrong tree.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

I would rather my train turn up than being cancelled due to some graffiti. I think this is Same for the many people taking the train across the country.

Oh same here, but I also think graffiti on trains is unacceptable and should be cleaned at the earliest opportunity!

As a side note and related to the class 377, I got this photo today that might be of interest

 

[zwk500]

Oh same here, but I also think graffiti on trains is unacceptable and should be cleaned at the earliest opportunity!

Don't go to Belgium then!

 

[SouthEastBuses]

Don't go to Belgium then!

I am half Italian and have lived in Italy for about 10 years, so I'm well used to graffiti

 

[Merle Haggard]

But why should legitimate users of spray cans be penalised for the actions of the graffiti ‘artists’? They’ll just find another way anyway.

There are spray paint cans specifically designed for graffiti - have different nozzles, I think. Have a look on the web. First found out about them looking at discarded cans at graffiti sites.
Banning these wouldn't cause a problem for legitimate users,

 

[Meole]

Some of these artists are in effect professional, earning their living from advertising on social media posts, I came across one such spraying a railway arch in Bristol whilst apparently broadcasting live on you tube, the specialist spray cans in his rolling suitcase were altogether worth over £1k he told me.

 

[penguin8967]

It took over a month for the graffiti on GWR's 802020 to be cleaned, spoiling the rather nice (in my opinion) NHS livery - I guess this also made the removal harder?

 

[Mzzzs]

I am back in London for the Easter holidays. Taking the 700 frequently some things don’t change.
700 get a lot of it in toilets.

 

[Mike Machin]

The possibility of graffiti should be costed-in to fleet renewals with enough spare stock available to cover for any units that are affected. There also needs to be much greater security of sites where trains are parked, and the building of sufficient train sheds to ensure that the majority of stock is stabled under cover. No graffiti artists should be given the satisfaction of knowing that there handiwork will reach a public audience.

 

[jfowkes]

Would it be a reasonable assumption that, the sooner cleaning happens, the easier it is? Once the paint has hardened and the solvent evaporated off, it would be much the same as the base (proper livery) layer, yes?

If my assumption is correct, then taking a unit out of service 'now' means fewer trains cancelled than if they wait.

Paint chemists feel free to chip in if I'm barking up the wrong tree.

Depends a lot on the exact paint/solvent type, the temperature, humidity and wind conditions, but in principle if you got to fresh graffiti within a few hours it might be a bit easier to remove than if it was fully dry. In practise I suspect there is little difference - and of course the staff won't know the exact age and condition of any graffiti they find, so you might be moving a unit from service for an advantage that doesn't actually exist.

 

[zwk500]

The possibility of graffiti should be costed-in to fleet renewals with enough spare stock available to cover for any units that are affected. There also needs to be much greater security of sites where trains are parked, and the building of sufficient train sheds to ensure that the majority of stock is stabled under cover. No graffiti artists should be given the satisfaction of knowing that there handiwork will reach a public audience.

So instead you give the graffiti artists the satisfaction of knowing that they're costing the government hundreds of millions of additional pounds? That just ups the stakes in the game.

A clear plastic Vinyl would be a lot cheaper to apply over the livery, and the unit could be arranged to be taken out of service close to a depot suitably equipped to cut out the affected portion and replace it in a few hours.