Gatwick Airport timetables now platform 5 & 6 open

[Bald Rick]

The timetable change occurred before platforms 5 & 6 reopend and thus when trains had fewer platforms to choose from.

The timetable change in December was based on the work being finished. Of course it wasn’t due to be done until the Christmas period, so there was a timetable variation put in place for the first couple of weeks from the start of the timetable until the work was due to finish, which replanned the platforming. (Albeit this all had to be ripped up for the strike timetables). However the work hit a snag a couple of months back which delayed completion, so the variations were carried forward for the first 2 weeks of January.

Now that the platforms are open, the variations have been discontinued, and the base timetable applies.

 

[AlbertBeale]

The timetable change in December was based on the work being finished. Of course it wasn’t due to be done until the Christmas period, so there was a timetable variation put in place for the first couple of weeks from the start of the timetable until the work was due to finish, which replanned the platforming. (Albeit this all had to be ripped up for the strike timetables). However the work hit a snag a couple of months back which delayed completion, so the variations were carried forward for the first 2 weeks of January.

Now that the platforms are open, the variations have been discontinued, and the base timetable applies.

Has all the work finished at Gatwick? Are all the platforms fully back in operation now? (There were hoardings up 10 days ago when I went through.) If so, the simplifying of the Coastway service split/join, which was supposedly because of reduced Gatwick capacity during the successive platform works [though I never understood the connection...], no longer has any rationale.

 

[Bald Rick]

Has all the work finished at Gatwick? Are all the platforms fully back in operation now? (There were hoardings up 10 days ago when I went through.) If so, the simplifying of the Coastway service split/join, which was supposedly because of reduced Gatwick capacity during the successive platform works [though I never understood the connection...], no longer has any rationale.

All the platforms are open, yes, as confirmed in post #1

 

[infobleep]

The timetable change in December was based on the work being finished. Of course it wasn’t due to be done until the Christmas period, so there was a timetable variation put in place for the first couple of weeks from the start of the timetable until the work was due to finish, which replanned the platforming. (Albeit this all had to be ripped up for the strike timetables). However the work hit a snag a couple of months back which delayed completion, so the variations were carried forward for the first 2 weeks of January.

Now that the platforms are open, the variations have been discontinued, and the base timetable applies.

Thanks for this, I hadn't realised there had been a variation in place with the timetable still. Perhaps I wasn't using the services where this was needed and thus didn't notice any changes.

I was expecting more fanfair though on the platforms reopening as it has been a big project. Maybe that will come when the footbridge works are completed.

Also, can all speculation now cease, as it was not my intention for this thread to contain speculation?

 

[WizCastro197]

As I haven’t been closely following the project, excuse me if I get this wrong:

Has all work at Gatwick now finished, and is all work that was first originally secured to be built there? For example has the new concourse been built?

I still retain the thought which I’ve expressed in earlier threads, that it would’ve been better to just do the whole station, but the cost would be skyrocketing and disruption would be huge as well. I am also rather disappointed that they haven’t taken the decision to remove some of the buildings on the platforms, especially on 1 and 2, that make the platform uncomfortably narrow and which also diverts most of the traffic into the landing of the escalators which can get crowded. Are such buildings needed, as they are quite a nuisance?

 

[Bikeman78]

More specifically, consecutive up and down fast trains alternate between 4 & 5, and 6 & 7, with all the GX trains using platforms 5 or 6.

I've not convinced that this is an improvement. Up trains using platform 5 will conflict at both ends of the station with down trains using platform 6. Down Arun Valley trains and up Brighton to Victoria trains are timed to arrive and depart around the same time. What could possibly go wrong!

 

[Peregrine 4903]

I've not convinced that this is an improvement. Up trains using platform 5 will conflict at both ends of the station with down trains using platform 6. Down Arun Valley trains and up Brighton to Victoria trains are timed to arrive and depart around the same time. What could possibly go wrong!

No they won't. The track layout has been changed so its parallel.

 

[cle]

Will platform 8 ever be built out? The road is there, and feels future-proofed - other than the escalator... and, would it be needed?

 

[PGAT]

Will platform 8 ever be built out? The road is there, and feels future-proofed - other than the escalator... and, would it be needed?

Unnecessary

 

[Bikeman78]

It seems a classic case of the tail wagging the dog. Surely Brighton must represent a much larger market than the small towns and villages along the West and East Coastway? And surely there must be a means of making those services which are busiest 4 x 3 coaches, allowing both portions to be of equal length?

If the West and East Coastway must have their disproportionate level of service, then the Gatwick Express should stop at Clapham Junction, as it did for most of the pandemic.

Back in the day, there were four Thameslink, two Brighton fast, two Haywards Heath splitters and four Gatwick Express on the fast lines north of Gatwick. Gatwick Express is only half hourly now so there ought to be two spare paths. So in theory Brighton could have its fast trains back with east and west Coastway trains continuing to run separately. Worth noting that slam door units, and class 319s, took 51 minutes to get to Brighton with two stops. The current "fast" trains take 58 minutes with two stops, or 62 minutes heading up.

EDIT: Apologies, I forgot about the Arun Valley trains which now run on the fast lines, so that makes it 12 fast trains per hour from Gatwick to East Croydon.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Jan 2023 ==

No they won't. The track layout has been changed so its parallel.

Thank goodness for that! OTT maps needs updating. What is the max speed through the pointwork? I remember the days when down fast trains going at 90 mph didn't start braking until Horley. Can't do that anymore.


EDIT: This video demonstrates the point perfectly. You can hear the brake handle click at 31:18 as the train passes Horley. Exactly how I remember it.

 

[WizCastro197]

Will platform 8 ever be built out? The road is there, and feels future-proofed - other than the escalator... and, would it be needed?

Where is the space? I think Gatwick Airport should focus on improving itself rather than pondering about an eighth unneeded platform.

 

[cle]

If you stand on P7 it’s very clear where P8 would be, and the permanent way-sized gap. It was envisaged as an island I recall.

But then the escalator was built against the edge - so a P8 would need to be wider, thus over the rail road, thus into civils outwith the car park.

And yes, probably not needed. A shorter train could terminate at either end, I suppose. With pax blocked / routed via P7 for egress. So 8A and 8B. Could it be useful from the South?

 

[AlbertBeale]

Will platform 8 ever be built out? The road is there, and feels future-proofed - other than the escalator... and, would it be needed?

Unnecessary

I thought part of the point of the Gatwick works was to add an 8th platform?

Back in the day, there were four Thameslink, two Brighton fast, two Haywards Heath splitters and four Gatwick Express on the fast lines north of Gatwick. Gatwick Express is only half hourly now so there ought to be two spare paths. So in theory Brighton could have its fast trains back with east and west Coastway trains continuing to run separately. Worth noting that slam door units, and class 319s, took 51 minutes to get to Brighton with two stops. The current "fast" trains take 58 minutes with two stops, or 62 minutes heading up.

EDIT: Apologies, I forgot about the Arun Valley trains which now run on the fast lines, so that makes it 12 fast trains per hour from Gatwick to East Croydon.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Jan 2023 ==


Thank goodness for that! OTT maps needs updating. What is the max speed through the pointwork? I remember the days when down fast trains going at 90 mph didn't start braking until Horley. Can't do that anymore.


EDIT: This video demonstrates the point perfectly. You can hear the brake handle click at 31:18 as the train passes Horley. Exactly how I remember it.

So - looking at that video - didn't London-Hove trains stop at Preston Park in those days?

 

[WizCastro197]

The Network Rail page says the concourse will open later this year, I do look forward to seeing it, however the works won't directly benefit Redhill line passengers (unless you are connecting), as our trains end up on narrow, cluttered Platforms 1&2.

Upcoming key dates

• Platforms 5 and 6 reopen to public Tuesday 3 January 2023
• New concourse opens 2023.

Upgrading Gatwick Airport station - Network Rail

We’re upgrading Gatwick Airport station to provide more reliable journeys and improve the experience for those who travel to the airport by train

www.networkrail.co.uk

I thought part of the point of the Gatwick works was to add an 8th platform?

I don't think it was (not in the final plans at least), I think the main points were to improve accessibility and customer experience, both of which, Gatwick lacks.

 

[zwk500]

If you stand on P7 it’s very clear where P8 would be, and the permanent way-sized gap. It was envisaged as an island I recall.

Could you point out where the space is?

Passengers urged to plan ahead of improvement works at Gatwick Airport station and South London over the Late May Bank Holiday

Network Rail carrying out upgrade projects to improve railway for passengers Those looking to travel by train over the Late May Bank Holiday are urged to plan their journeys in advance and travel at quieter times where possible

www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk

The gap between the platform access and the building abutting the pick up/drop off roads is nowhere near big enough.

I thought part of the point of the Gatwick works was to add an 8th platform?

Wasn't ever part of the formal plans AFAIK.

 

[Bikeman78]

So - looking at that video - didn't London-Hove trains stop at Preston Park in those days?

Nope, non stop from Haywards Heath to Hove. Can't recall when that changed. Early 2000s I think. I see that they stop all stations from Burgess Hill to Hove now.

 

[cle]

Could you point out where the space is?

Passengers urged to plan ahead of improvement works at Gatwick Airport station and South London over the Late May Bank Holiday

Network Rail carrying out upgrade projects to improve railway for passengers Those looking to travel by train over the Late May Bank Holiday are urged to plan their journeys in advance and travel at quieter times where possible

www.networkrailmediacentre.co.uk

The gap between the platform access and the building abutting the pick up/drop off roads is nowhere near big enough.

Wasn't ever part of the formal plans AFAIK.

If you’ve used p7, it’s very clear.

This is speculation. If you wish to speculate please create a separate thread.

Chill out. This project was announced way back when as a new island for P 7 and 8, so it’s very relevant to how the project evolved. And how the escalator placement likely precludes it now.

Whereas the entirety of your post was scolding, not even a cursory point about the topic. Add value.

 

[zwk500]

If you’ve used p7, it’s very clear.

Your line goes straight through a building....

 

[WizCastro197]

Your line goes straight through a building....

Does it? The white things are elevated. Ah I understand, past the screenshotted location?

 

[zwk500]

Does it? The white things are elevated. Ah I understand, past the screenshotted location?

As shown from my originally linked image (which was conveniently ignored to produce the Google Maps screenshot).

 

[infobleep]

View attachment 127483
If you’ve used p7, it’s very clear.


Chill out. This project was announced way back when as a new island for P 7 and 8, so it’s very relevant to how the project evolved. And how the escalator placement likely precludes it now.

Whereas the entirety of your post was scolding, not even a cursory point about the topic. Add value.

I was sent a private message about speculation on this thread by one of the forum moderators. As I have been banned from this site before, for a week or so, I decided I should make it clear here in case they don't like the fact speculation is continuing in this thread, having warned me about it.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Jan 2023 ==

The Network Rail page says the concourse will open later this year, I do look forward to seeing it, however the works won't directly benefit Redhill line passengers (unless you are connecting), as our trains end up on narrow, cluttered Platforms 1&2.

Upgrading Gatwick Airport station - Network Rail

We’re upgrading Gatwick Airport station to provide more reliable journeys and improve the experience for those who travel to the airport by train

www.networkrail.co.uk

I don't think it was (not in the final plans at least), I think the main points were to improve accessibility and customer experience, both of which, Gatwick lacks.

Up 30 services a train can now run 5 minutes faster. Does this cover trains via Redhill and the quarry line or just one or the other?

 

[WizCastro197]

Up 30 services a train can now run 5 minutes faster. Does this cover trains via Redhill and the quarry line or just one or the other?

Apologies, I wasn’t talking about service times, but I should’ve been more clearer. I was discussing how Redhill line passengers won’t feel any boost in customer experience nor accessibility, as platforms 1&2 were not altered at all, and those buildings still clutter the platforms, leaving the platform awfully narrow, apart from certain areas, which are hard to access as the narrowness obstructs any passage there.

The network rail page, says only 30 trains a day will actually benefit from the 5 minutes, judging how all Redhill line services exclusively use platforms 1&2 (apart from Sundays) I can imagine these don’t benefit from the 5 minute speed up.

Whilst you were there, were you able to to take any pictures? I can’t seem to find any on the internet, and it certainly seems as you said on your opening post, that the whole reopening is very discrete.

 

[infobleep]

Apologies, I wasn’t talking about service times, but I should’ve been more clearer. I was discussing how Redhill line passengers won’t feel any boost in customer experience nor accessibility, as platforms 1&2 were not altered at all, and those buildings still clutter the platforms, leaving the platform awfully narrow.

The network rail page, says only 30 trains a day will actually benefit from the 5 minutes, judging how all Redhill line services exclusively use platforms 1&2 (apart from Sundays) I can imagine these don’t benefit from the 5 minute speed up.

Whilst you were there, were you able to to take any pictures? I can’t seem to find any on the internet, and it certainly seems as you said on your opening post, that the whole reopening is very discrete.

I have no photos but I did take some videos as I walked from platform 7 to platforms 5 & 6.

Some trains from Redhill also use platform 3. This is usually trains to Horsham but some trains, such as the Monday to Friday 19:20 arrival from Reading and the 19:29 to Reading use platform 3. I accept not many.

I will be passing again at some point in the next few weeks so will try and get some photos, time permitting.

 

[cle]

Those are newer buildings, if there are obstacles at the extremity now, it doesn’t detract from my point that standing on P7, there is a perfect, almost deliberate gap for the eighth track and it’s easy to imagine it there. Again as I said, I think that has passed. And yes the other things are elevated.

Infobleep - it can be a bit delicate, to the detriment of regular human discourse. Makes one wonder about IRL conversations I’d otherwise enjoy. But I don’t think we’re in speculative territory. I also don’t think you’d be held responsible if I or another were going off topic, it’s not your fault or your responsible to police.

 

[WizCastro197]

I have no photos but I did take some videos as I walked from platform 7 to platforms 5 & 6.

. This is usually trains to Horsham but some trains, such as the Monday to Friday 19:20 arrival from Reading and the 19:29 to Reading use platform 3. I accept not many.

I will be passing again at some point in the next few weeks so will try and get some photos, time permitting.

I had forgotten about the down services to Horsham. I have also forgotten whether Platforms 3&4 have had any works at all?

 

[zwk500]

I had forgotten about the down services to Horsham. I have also forgotten whether Platforms 3&4 have had any works at all?

I believe the plan is to close each island in turn, so 3/4 will be next and then 1/2. But that may have been shelved given everything that's happened.

 

[dastocks]

This project was announced way back when as a new island for P 7 and 8, so it’s very relevant to how the project evolved. And how the escalator placement likely precludes it now.

If this was true we should be able to find the announcement online, especially as the project was sponsored in part by the DfT and was subject to planning approval from Crawley Borough Council. Perhaps you could provide some links?

 

[infobleep]

Those are newer buildings, if there are obstacles at the extremity now, it doesn’t detract from my point that standing on P7, there is a perfect, almost deliberate gap for the eighth track and it’s easy to imagine it there. Again as I said, I think that has passed. And yes the other things are elevated.

Infobleep - it can be a bit delicate, to the detriment of regular human discourse. Makes one wonder about IRL conversations I’d otherwise enjoy. But I don’t think we’re in speculative territory. I also don’t think you’d be held responsible if I or another were going off topic, it’s not your fault or your responsible to police.

Well the private message was sent to me so someone felt the need.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 22 Jan 2023 ==

I had forgotten about the down services to Horsham. I have also forgotten whether Platforms 3&4 have had any works at all.

No works that I am aware of.

I find it quite handy comings from a train on platform 4 and joining one going north from platform 3.

Of course, I rarely allow the official 10-minute connection. I take a risk snd it mostly pays off.

So I save more time than I would lose if I kept sticking to the official connection time between trains.

 

[WizCastro197]

Here all, I have created a thread on the more speculative side of things, about how to improve the station further past the final plans and the unneeded supposed Platform 8.

Gatwick Airport Upgrade: Further ideas to improve and eighth platform.

With the nearing completion of the Gatwick Airport station upgrade and the reopening of Platforms 5&6, it would be interesting to see your ideas about how to further improve the station, aside from the final plans. For example, it would have been interesting to see Platforms 1&2 be redone in a...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[Deepgreen]

its ridiculous that a destination like Brighton isn't served from C.Jcn. Opportunity market from SW London must be vast.

Absolutely - CJ is universally recognised as a fundamental element of most services' patterns and to exclude Brighton is staggering.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 22 Jan 2023 ==

A lot of teh younger generation don't own cars in the London area and are quite happy to pay the fares but won't if the service is naff.

There is no point to GX anymore so its about time it was just another Southern service with a call a C.Jcn on the Brightons don't bother on the Gatwick terminators. Stansted Express all call at Tottenham Hale as its a good source of traffic as C.Jcn would be for Brighton.

Quite.