Is the Cornwall Metro a good idea?

[Gloster]

Instead of short a passing loop on the existing Newquay branch, has anyone ever thought about rebuilding the Indian Queens - St Dennis line to act as a mega passing loop for Roche, Bugle and Luxulyan?

Consider this: You could have a 2-hourly clockface service departing Newquay which would “call” at the request stops all the way to Par as it does now. But rather than terminating there, it reverses and continues on to St Austell before heading back to Newquay non-stop via the fully-rebuilt St Dennis Line. In the opposite hour, another service on a 2-hourly rota departs Newquay and does the same route in reverse. My diagram attached below shows how it could be done.

That was the main part of the mid-1980s proposal: rebuild the line from Burngullow Junction to St Dennis Junction, including adding one or two stations. Roche, Bugle and Luxulyan would be closed, as would the line between Goonbarrow and St Dennis Junctions.

 

[PTR 444]

That was the main part of the mid-1980s proposal: rebuild the line from Burngullow Junction to St Dennis Junction, including adding one or two stations. Roche, Bugle and Luxulyan would be closed, as would the line between Goonbarrow and St Dennis Junctions.

Except my proposal would not close the line or stations between St Dennis Junction and Par. Rather both lines would co-exist with one acting as the passing loop for the other, allowing hourly clockface departures from Newquay and a faster journey to St Austell every other hour.

 

[irish_rail]

Except my proposal would not close the line or stations between St Dennis Junction and Par. Rather both lines would co-exist with one acting as the passing loop for the other, allowing hourly clockface departures from Newquay and a faster journey to St Austell every other hour.

Sadly the money won't ever be forthcoming for projects such as this. Leaving the European Union has likely dented any chance Cornwall would have had of obtaining such funding.

 

[Gloster]

It looks like the Newquay-Falmouth project has been approved as part of the £2.1 billion ‘levelling up‘ grants. As yet details on The Grauniad and BBC websites are vague, so links and quotes do not further illuminate.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

It looks like the Newquay-Falmouth project has been approved as part of the £2.1 billion ‘levelling up‘ grants. As yet details on The Grauniad and BBC websites are vague, so links and quotes do not further illuminate.

They are probably going by the information the Government has provided. The official announcement links to a spreadsheet listing the projects, and all that says is:

Nearly £50 million to create a direct train service linking Newquay, St Austell, Truro, and Falmouth alongside better walking and cycling access to stations

So I guess that's all the information we have to go on so far, unless anyone can find out the details on the original application for funding (which presumably must exist somewhere)

 

[Snow1964]

Going ahead,

• A £50 million grant will help create a new direct train service, linking 4 of Cornwall’s largest urban areas: Newquay, St Austell, Truro, and Falmouth/Penryn. This will level up access to jobs, skills, education, and amenities in one of the most economically disadvantaged areas in the UK.

Perhaps these needs to be moved from speculative now

Landmark Levelling Up Fund to spark transformational change across the UK

More than 100 projects awarded share of £2.1 billion from Round 2 of government’s flagship Levelling Up Fund to create jobs and boost the economy

www.gov.uk

 

[Dr Day]

The levelling up funding is presumably for one-off capital expenditure only. Is there any commitment for any actual additional services? I would imagine they would require ongoing subsidy.

 

[sor]

Some more detail would be nice - “infrastructure at Roche“ does not mean much, and anyone who has tried to use the station will know that there’s quite a major issue with it which means it gets little use - there’s no pedestrian friendly access from the village itself as the pavement stops at the village boundary, and until the bypass is built this involves walking along an incredibly busy road with many HGVs.

I’ve certainly never used it for that reason, far easier to get a bus or drive to St Austell or Bodmin Parkway

 

[dk1]

Always good to see investment & improvements. Be interesting to see how this progresses.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

It seems reasonable to assume the £50M is to pay for infrastructure improvements to allow an hourly Falmouth-Truro-Par-Newquay service? (Actually, less than £50M since part of that money is for better walking/cycling access to stations). Does anyone have any idea what that required infrastructure might be? Or to put it another way, what are the current infrastructure barriers that prevent running such a service today?

£50M isn't going to buy a lot, so it can't be anything very large.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

It seems reasonable to assume the £50M is to pay for infrastructure improvements to allow an hourly Falmouth-Truro-Par-Newquay service? (Actually, less than £50M since part of that money is for better walking/cycling access to stations). Does anyone have any idea what that required infrastructure might be? Or to put it another way, what are the current infrastructure barriers that prevent running such a service today?

£50M isn't going to buy a lot, so it can't be anything very large.

Extra crossing loop needed on the Newquay branch

 

[D Williams]

Mid Cornwall Metro secures £50m in Levelling Up funding​

Following yesterday’s major Levelling Up funding announcement, the government has pledged an almost £50m grant to improve the railways linking Newquay, St Austell, Truro and Falmouth in Cornwall.
This financial aid to improve Cornwall Rail links represents the only successful bid out of four that were submitted to the Levelling up funding. The improvement scheme will be helmed by a partnership with Great Western Railway and Network Rail.
Total costs for this scheme’s delivery are estimated at £56.8 million, seeing a partial funding amount of £2.71 million from Cornwall council, with the outstanding balance being provided through other funders.
The Mid Cornwall Metro will serve the community through the provision of hourly trains on the route, serving the four largest towns in Cornwall. Works will see the installation of longer platforms at two Falmouth stations to take three-car trains, accompanied by a second platform at Newquay and a new crossing place on the Newquay branch at Tregoss Moor.
Benefits from this Metro service will include:

• Hourly direct service connecting Newquay, Par, St Austell, Truro, Penryn and Falmouth.
• Doubling of services from Newquay to Par – an extra 700,000 seats per year both ways.
• All year local services; Local and long-distance services operating concurrently along the Newquay branch.
• Summer mid-week, additional daily Newquay to London services.
• Increased frequency of mainline rail services between Par, St Austell and Truro.
• Improved accessibility and interchange at Par Station.
• Potential 25% increased capacity between Truro and Falmouth.

 

[class26]

Extra crossing loop needed on the Newquay branch

isn`t there also a second platform at Newquay going in ?

 

[HamworthyGoods]

isn`t there also a second platform at Newquay going in ?

Yes, that’s to allow the existing summer London services to run in addition to the hourly Falmouth services.

 

[Gloster]

It is to be hoped that they will do what they can to increase line speeds and avoid things like stopping for token exchange. A very rough calculation is that Newquay-St Austell will only be about five minutes faster by train than bus on current timings, and (from a possibly erroneous recollection) then you have at least that to walk to the town centre. Truro is at least twenty minutes faster by bus and I think the centre is even further from the station.

 

[Bartsimho]

Instead of short a passing loop on the existing Newquay branch, has anyone ever thought about rebuilding the Indian Queens - St Dennis line to act as a mega passing loop for Roche, Bugle and Luxulyan?

Consider this: You could have a 2-hourly clockface service departing Newquay which would “call” at the request stops all the way to Par as it does now. But rather than terminating there, it reverses and continues on to St Austell before heading back to Newquay non-stop via the fully-rebuilt St Dennis Line. In the opposite hour, another service on a 2-hourly rota departs Newquay and does the same route in reverse. My diagram attached below shows how it could be done.

The issue with that section of line is that is goes through Goss Moor which is now a National Nature Reserve and was declared part of a Site of Special Scientific interest due to rare Plant and Animal species. They diverted the A30 around it and it's now a no-touch zone effectively

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I can't imagine that many people from Newquay will travel further than St Austell because it's such an indirect route to go beyond there. In fact I can imagine most trains seeing an almost complete turnover of passengers at St Austell.

On the other hand, I'd expect an hourly service to Newquay will (despite slow line-speeds) be a lot more attractive than the current irregular service, and 3tph Truro-St Austell should also be useful. The question is, whether this all will be outweighed by the likely loss of reliability on the Falmouth branch, which, being single track, can't really afford to import delays from the main line.

 

[sor]

The issue with that section of line is that is goes through Goss Moor which is now a National Nature Reserve and was declared part of a Site of Special Scientific interest due to rare Plant and Animal species. They diverted the A30 around it and it's now a no-touch zone effectively

That A30 bypass took far longer to build than it needed to be for that same reason. A new rail line would have the same issue.

(this is the site of the locally infamous rail bridge that would have a lorry slam into it a few times a year, no matter how many height restriction signs they put up)

It is to be hoped that they will do what they can to increase line speeds and avoid things like stopping for token exchange. A very rough calculation is that Newquay-St Austell will only be about five minutes faster by train than bus on current timings, and (from a possibly erroneous recollection) then you have at least that to walk to the town centre. Truro is at least twenty minutes faster by bus and I think the centre is even further from the station.

St Austell “bus station” is right outside the railway station, so it’s the same distance (and it‘s a brief walk into the town centre proper, nothing like at Truro)

 

[Gloster]

St Austell “bus station” is right outside the railway station, so it’s the same distance (and it‘s a brief walk into the town centre proper, nothing like at Truro)

But the bus appears to pass through the centre, Trinity and South Streets (I think), so the times will be nearly equal.

 

[4-SUB 4732]

I like the idea of it, however I do think avoiding Par and having the Metro hourly service run across a small piece of new track between St Blazey and the main line to directly run to St Austell would have been better, and remove what seems to me to be a glaring operational risk with the reversals at Par.

 

[CptCharlee]

Wonder if Newquay to Plymouth services would prove popular providing a link east. If the 2nd platform gives capacity for London services a Plymouth service could be used in off season. Could be opportunity to expand that Metro in the future.

This is fantastic news for Newquay hopefully this proves to be a winner and we end up with a well used inter cornwall service that is used frequently for short hops. I guess alot of the usage would be Falmouth-St Austell, Newquay- St Austell etc.

 

[Gloster]

I like the idea of it, however I do think avoiding Par and having the Metro hourly service run across a small piece of new track between St Blazey and the main line to directly run to St Austell would have been better, and remove what seems to me to be a glaring operational risk with the reversals at Par.

See #13 and 25.

 

[cle]

Wonder if Newquay to Plymouth services would prove popular providing a link east. If the 2nd platform gives capacity for London services a Plymouth service could be used in off season. Could be opportunity to expand that Metro in the future.

This is fantastic news for Newquay hopefully this proves to be a winner and we end up with a well used inter cornwall service that is used frequently for short hops. I guess alot of the usage would be Falmouth-St Austell, Newquay- St Austell etc.

Exactly, it's all about the critical mass of new journey pairs adding up. Who is going from Exmouth to Paignton - but that works very well. Admittedly St Austell and Truro are not Exeter, but they're the only real thing for miles.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

I'm all for enhancing the capacity on the Newquay Branch to accomodate long-distance services and local trains connecting to the main-line, but it is hard to see the benefits of through running to Truro and Falmouth, and easy to see the operational disbenefits. Very few punters are going to use it from Newquay to Truro when the rail distance via Par is nearly 40 miles; by road it is just over 13. The rail journey time will be around 85-90mins; by car 30mins and by (slow) bus 57mins. I'm sure the fabled 'electric bus', so often proposed for Tavistock on this board, would be somewhat quicker. St. Austell isn't much better either; the rail distance via Par is nearly 26 miles; by road 16.5.

As has been mentioned, the real 'levelling-up' agenda (oops - we're not allowed to say that now) would be to upgrade the Parkandillack line to passenger standards and reinstate the missing link to St. Dennis Jcn. The existing line to Goonbarrow Jcn could be abandoned, and Goonbarrow Jcn to St. Blazey retained just for the (dwindling) clay traffic. I don't buy the supposed SSI problem for Goss Moor - the reinstated line would be on the very edge of the moor and is a former right of way - unlike the original A30 scheme for a four-lane highway right across it. The rail distance from Newquay to St. Austell by this route is about 17 miles, and actually goes, you know, where the punters want to go. There could also be intermediate stations for the (deprived) clay villages, and there is room at St. Austell for a third platform on the site of the old Motorail facilities.

I'm old enough to remember in the 1970s when the Newquay trains were briefly extended to Bodmin Road (as it was then) , in attempt to cut out some intermediate stops and speed up services on the Cornish Main Line. It was quickly abandoned as the train miles accumulated - I hope I'm wrong, but I can see the same happening with this metro scheme as it fails to draw in the passengers.

 

[MarkyT]

The concept really just bolts together two branch services with a mainline section in between. The predominant new direct journey benefits will be linking St Austel to both Falmouth and Newquay.

As has been mentioned, the real 'levelling-up' agenda (oops - we're not allowed to say that now) would be to upgrade the Parkandillack line to passenger standards and reinstate the missing link to St. Dennis Jcn. The existing line to Goonbarrow Jcn could be abandoned, and Goonbarrow Jcn to St. Blazey retained just for the (dwindling) clay traffic. I don't buy the supposed SSI problem for Goss Moor - the reinstated line would be on the very edge of the moor and is a former right of way - unlike the original A30 scheme for a four-lane highway right across it. The rail distance from Newquay to St. Austell by this route is about 17 miles, and actually goes, you know, where the punters want to go.

I agree that would be more useful for more people. Longer distance trains going to Newquay would also have the commercial benefit of serving St Austell. A new station at Trewoon could improve the interchange Between the Newquay branch and Truro if a quick connection of the branch train with the mainline stopping train could be timetabled. A single island platform arrangement between the up and down lines might be possible to make this a simple cross-platform change in both directions.

There could also be intermediate stations for the (deprived) clay villages, and there is room at St. Austell for a third platform on the site of the old Motorail facilities.

A reversing facility might be created using the old sidings reconnected and the trailing crossover at the London end. Alternatively, the branch train might go on to Par to reverse.