Substantive bus service withdrawals post-Covid

[M@verick]

Assume you're talking about the outstation at Langford Turn - the depot is long gone (Shortmead Street)

The site was a depot between August 1989 and September 1991. It was subsequently downgraded to an outstation despite at one stage having a 22 vehicle PVR. It closed completely in March 2018.

The site was built in 1970 and was originally used by Charles Cook Travel, Charlie sold it to Stagecoach in 1989 so they could vacate the former Eastern National depot in Shortmead Street.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Sep 2022 ==

Stagecoach East might be one of the worst operating companies PERIOD. It seems to have been on an ever increasing spiral of chaos since Andy Campbell left. And that is saying something!

Yes I'd be inclined to agree there. Andy Campbell was a terrible MD but nobody has got to grips with it since he left the company.

 

[higthomas]

Stagecoach East are ending a number of services from 30th October 2022 which includes operation of:

72/73 - Biggleswade-Sandy-Bedford. The origins of this service go back to London General who commenced a motor bus service in 1913. It ceased for the duration of WW1 but restarted with the 'National' after their acquisition of LGOC provincial services in 1921. Subsequently Eastern National and from May 1952 United Counties provided this services. For many years it was the 176 although it switched to 172 in the early 1990s. During 2006 it became the first of the 'Planet' routes M3 during this period before reverting to the 73.

I understand the local authority is looking for a replacement service but that Stagecoach will not be involved in operating it.

The link between Royston and Cambridge is also being curtailed at the same point.

This is being reported at https://www.cambsnews.co.uk/2022/09/18/exclusive-stagecoach-axe-21-cambridgeshire-routes/ AFAICT it also includes every route from Cambridge at a less than half hourly frequency. Savage.

Cancellation of bus services affecting passengers across Cambridgeshire are proposed by Cambus – the operating subsidiary of Stagecoach.

Cambridge Area Bus Users group said the cutbacks were “devastating”.

Twenty-one services are on a list on the Government’s licensing website.

Cambus Ltd operates services in and around Cambridgeshire, Peterborough, and Bedford.

In 2021 it made a pre-tax profit of £2.4m with revenue of £28.8m, but that later figure was down from £53m in 2020.

The company said it had been “adversely impacted by the substantial fall in passenger demand for public transport in response to the Covid-19 pandemic”.

And that is their ongoing problem, with post-Covid ridership down around 70 per cent of pre-Covid usage. Bus pass ridership is also down.

Immediate problem is that post-Covid ridership is around 70% of pre-covid (WFH etc) but bus-pass ridership is also down.

Cambus Ltd, in their annual accounts, offered a clue about their future.

With the continuing uncertainty of Covid-19 and the UK’s recovery, it said it remained “difficult to accurately forecast the precise timing and extent of how our profitability will recover”.

It said it could be sometime before usage recovered and Cambus revealed at the start of the year it was “therefore planning for a number of scenarios”.

 

[Flange Squeal]

Assume you're talking about the outstation at Langford Turn - the depot is long gone (Shortmead Street)

Whereabouts is this location?

 

[A0]

This is being reported at https://www.cambsnews.co.uk/2022/09/18/exclusive-stagecoach-axe-21-cambridgeshire-routes/ AFAICT it also includes every route from Cambridge at a less than half hourly frequency. Savage.

Mentioned in another thread, but here's the update from Stagecoach East affecting Cambridge, Peterborough, Huntingdon / St Ives and Bedford.

East Bus Network

www.stagecoachbus.com

 

[RELL6L]

There's a lot to do to update the listing I prepared and masses of scary new stuff in the last few days.
One area that had largely passed me by is Nottinghamshire, where Buses reports that several services have been saved by the council. The following is a list based on the Nottingham Post and we know how unreliable local papers are - but maybe it is correct. Possibly some of these are evening / Sunday only - hard to imagine the Rushcliffe Mainline or Rainbow 1 were going to be entirely withdrawn. Anyone know any more?

Bus routes saved but 'further commercial decisions' to be made

19 have been saved

www.nottinghampost.com

The 19 funded routes include;

• 141 - Sutton in Ashfield, Skegby, Mansfield, Rainworth, Blidworth, Hucknall, Bestwood, Nottingham
• 6 (Worksop) - Worksop, Gateford, Shireoaks, Rhodesia, Worksop
• 7 (Worksop) - - Worksop, Gateford, Shireoaks, Rhodesia, Worksop
• 1 (Mansfield Miller) - Sutton in Ashfield, Huthwaite
• 1 (Mansfield Miller) - Mansfield Woodhouse, Mansfield,
• 53 - Mansfield, Pleasley, Bolsover, Sheffield
• 90 – Newark, Nottingham
• 37 - Retford, Tuxford, Sutton Trent, Newark
• 90 - Sutton, Kirkby, Selston, Ripley
• Connect in Hucknall Green Line - Hucknall estates
• Connect in Hucknall Blue Line - Hucknall estates
• The Cotgrave - Cotgrave, West Bridgford, Nottingham
• Rushcliffe Mainline - Bingham, Radcliffe, West Bridgford, Nottingham
• Rainbow 1 - Nottingham, Eastwood, Heanor, Ripley or Alfreton
• Rushcliffe Villager - Bingham, Newton, East Bridgford, Shelford, Gunthorpe, Radcliffe, West Bridgford, Nottingham
• 20 (Sunday Service) - Heanor, Ilkeston, Stapleford, Beeston, QMC, Nottingham
• 9 - Loughborough to Nottingham
• 46,47 - Woodborough, Lambley, Mapperley, Nottingham
• 18 - Stapleford, Beeston, Nottingham

 

[MrTurbostar170]

Lots of changes by Stagecoach in East Sussex from the 30th October. Still waiting on details of Dover area services in Kent but a few have been deregistered out there.

A new bus network for East Sussex

New Stagecoach bus service network in East Sussex from Sunday 30 October 2022

www.stagecoachbus.com

A new bus network for East Sussex



Developed in consultation with East Sussex County Council, this new bus network reflects changes in people’s travel habits coming out of the pandemic, as well as the impact of rising costs, lower passenger numbers and a national shortage of driving and engineering staff.



Our timetables are our promise. We need to make sure that we can deliver them reliably and on schedule. This new network plan will help ensure we can keep our promise and continue to provide a regular service to areas where demand is greatest. It will also ensure we have a sustainable network that we hope can grow over the longer-term.

Routes going completely include:

24 Hastings - Silverhill
Every route serving Hawkhurst, the 254, 304/305 and 349 all to either Tunbridge Wells or Hastings.
4 Meads - Eastbourne - DG Hospital
The 5 in Eastbourne will only run between the Harbours and the Town Centre
The 6 in Eastbourne is withdrawn except peak and schoolday journeys
Schoolday 58 in Eastbourne also gone.

Notice how these changes are hidden under "promos and offers" instead of service updates, it's the same with Stagecoach East.

 

[duncombec]

Lots of changes by Stagecoach in East Sussex from the 30th October. Still waiting on details of Dover area services in Kent but a few have been deregistered out there.

A new bus network for East Sussex

New Stagecoach bus service network in East Sussex from Sunday 30 October 2022

www.stagecoachbus.com

Routes going completely include:

24 Hastings - Silverhill
Every route serving Hawkhurst, the 254, 304/305 and 349 all to either Tunbridge Wells or Hastings.
4 Meads - Eastbourne - DG Hospital
The 5 in Eastbourne will only run between the Harbours and the Town Centre
The 6 in Eastbourne is withdrawn except peak and schoolday journeys
Schoolday 58 in Eastbourne also gone.

Notice how these changes are hidden under "promos and offers" instead of service updates, it's the same with Stagecoach East.

These changes are being worked on with East Sussex County Council, who have a series of downloadable documents on their website (as quoted on the Stagecoach page, https://www.eastsussex.gov.uk/roads...vice-changes/bus-service-changes-october-2022 - note they are word documents, so they don't quote easily on the forum) which detail what is likely to happen with sections being withdrawn.

In almost all cases, services are either covered by changes to other routes, or will be tendered by ESCC (which Stagecoach may or may not then win), so as we saw with the 11 in Kent, this may not quite be final.

It is also worth noting that 254/303/305/349 were ESCC tendered for some time, and Stagecoach did quite a lot of work to make them commercial. However, presumably post-pandemic they are no longer commercial, and are thus reverting to tendered status.

 

[RELL6L]

Lots of changes by Stagecoach in East Sussex from the 30th October. Still waiting on details of Dover area services in Kent but a few have been deregistered out there.

A new bus network for East Sussex

New Stagecoach bus service network in East Sussex from Sunday 30 October 2022

www.stagecoachbus.com

Routes going completely include:

24 Hastings - Silverhill
Every route serving Hawkhurst, the 254, 304/305 and 349 all to either Tunbridge Wells or Hastings.
4 Meads - Eastbourne - DG Hospital
The 5 in Eastbourne will only run between the Harbours and the Town Centre
The 6 in Eastbourne is withdrawn except peak and schoolday journeys
Schoolday 58 in Eastbourne also gone.

Notice how these changes are hidden under "promos and offers" instead of service updates, it's the same with Stagecoach East.

Horrendous cuts from Stagecoach! East Sussex seem extremely enlightened compared to others, I hope they are able to find operators to run the services they are looking for at a manageable cost. The 254/304/305 would be a major loss. The norm now seems to be going from a regular service - eg hourly - to nothing, here and Cambridgeshire. And Devon looks like the 155 might be going (too early to be sure). Is this the new Stagecoach owners making their mark?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Whereabouts is this location?

Stagecoach had a parking area abutting the A1



The old United Counties depot was here (I think) - one of the very early disposals of Stagecoach after they bought the firm

 

[londonteacher]

Horrendous cuts from Stagecoach! East Sussex seem extremely enlightened compared to others, I hope they are able to find operators to run the services they are looking for at a manageable cost. The 254/304/305 would be a major loss. The norm now seems to be going from a regular service - eg hourly - to nothing, here and Cambridgeshire. And Devon looks like he 155 might be going (too early to be sure). Is this the new Stagecoach owners making their mark?

Horrendous maybe, but if the numbers of passengers are not high enough to be viable commercially then it is the only option. Local councils could fund them higher but ultimately if the numbers are not there even this pot of money can’t last forever.

 

[ChrisC]

There's a lot to do to update the listing I prepared and masses of scary new stuff in the last few days.
One area that had largely passed me by is Nottinghamshire, where Buses reports that several services have been saved by the council. The following is a list based on the Nottingham Post and we know how unreliable local papers are - but maybe it is correct. Possibly some of these are evening / Sunday only - hard to imagine the Rushcliffe Mainline or Rainbow 1 were going to be entirely withdrawn. Anyone know any more?

Bus routes saved but 'further commercial decisions' to be made

19 have been saved

www.nottinghampost.com

The 19 funded routes include;

• 141 - Sutton in Ashfield, Skegby, Mansfield, Rainworth, Blidworth, Hucknall, Bestwood, Nottingham
• 6 (Worksop) - Worksop, Gateford, Shireoaks, Rhodesia, Worksop
• 7 (Worksop) - - Worksop, Gateford, Shireoaks, Rhodesia, Worksop
• 1 (Mansfield Miller) - Sutton in Ashfield, Huthwaite
• 1 (Mansfield Miller) - Mansfield Woodhouse, Mansfield,
• 53 - Mansfield, Pleasley, Bolsover, Sheffield
• 90 – Newark, Nottingham
• 37 - Retford, Tuxford, Sutton Trent, Newark
• 90 - Sutton, Kirkby, Selston, Ripley
• Connect in Hucknall Green Line - Hucknall estates
• Connect in Hucknall Blue Line - Hucknall estates
• The Cotgrave - Cotgrave, West Bridgford, Nottingham
• Rushcliffe Mainline - Bingham, Radcliffe, West Bridgford, Nottingham
• Rainbow 1 - Nottingham, Eastwood, Heanor, Ripley or Alfreton
• Rushcliffe Villager - Bingham, Newton, East Bridgford, Shelford, Gunthorpe, Radcliffe, West Bridgford, Nottingham
• 20 (Sunday Service) - Heanor, Ilkeston, Stapleford, Beeston, QMC, Nottingham
• 9 - Loughborough to Nottingham
• 46,47 - Woodborough, Lambley, Mapperley, Nottingham
• 18 - Stapleford, Beeston, Nottingham

The 141 route is now in its third week after being saved from withdrawal and is now funded by Nottinghamshire County Council. As has been reported elsewhere it is now operated by Stagecoach instead of Trent Barton. Although it’s still running to the same timetable, it’s not likely to attract many passengers when so many people think it’s no longer running. There are still notices at most bus stops, posted by Trent Barton, giving notice that the 141 bus will be completely withdrawn after 3rd September. If the County Council are funding this surely these notices need removing and new Stagecoach timetables displayed.

 

[Deerfold]

Mentioned in another thread, but here's the update from Stagecoach East affecting Cambridge, Peterborough, Huntingdon / St Ives and Bedford.

East Bus Network

www.stagecoachbus.com

Intalink seem to have got hold of the wrong end of the stick. They're reporting that the frequency of the 9A/B is increasing. Within Hertfordshire it's going from hourly to every 2 hours. When I lived in Hitchin it was half hourly.

 

[A0]

Intalink seem to have got hold of the wrong end of the stick. They're reporting that the frequency of the 9A/B is increasing. Within Hertfordshire it's going from hourly to every 2 hours. When I lived in Hitchin it was half hourly.

TBF those services only have their "final mile" or so in Herts. Once beyond Ickleford they're soon into Beds. And the frequency change is for the whole of the Bedford - Hitchin route with additional services to Shortstown which is just a suburb of Bedford now.

 

[Man of Kent]

Horrendous maybe, but if the numbers of passengers are not high enough to be viable commercially then it is the only option. Local councils could fund them higher but ultimately if the numbers are not there even this pot of money can’t last forever.

Absolutely spot on. Expect more of this across the country.

 

[Silver Cobra]

Intalink seem to have got hold of the wrong end of the stick. They're reporting that the frequency of the 9A/B is increasing. Within Hertfordshire it's going from hourly to every 2 hours. When I lived in Hitchin it was half hourly.

From looking at the proposed timetables, the service is dropping to an hourly alternating between the A and B during the off-peak time (8am to 2pm towards Hitchin and 9:15am to 4pm towards Bedford), while remaining on the current half-hourly alternating in the peaks. They're also running two new additional services at 5am (9A) and 5:30am (9B) from Bedford to Hitchin, which I imagine is putting the two buses normally run to Hitchin as dead mileage into passenger service.

Nevertheless, seeing how badly Stagecoach East are cutting their services is pretty disheartening. Even the likes of the X5 aren't immune to it. Central Bedfordshire Council proposed at the start of the year a campaign to improve bus services in the county, but what East have announced for 30th October is anything but.

 

[Deerfold]

TBF those services only have their "final mile" or so in Herts. Once beyond Ickleford they're soon into Beds. And the frequency change is for the whole of the Bedford - Hitchin route with additional services to Shortstown which is just a suburb of Bedford now.

TBF most of the route is having a drop in frequency of 50% for most of the day, including the section in Hertfordshire.

 

[RT4038]

Nevertheless, seeing how badly Stagecoach East are cutting their services is pretty disheartening. Even the likes of the X5 aren't immune to it. Central Bedfordshire Council proposed at the start of the year a campaign to improve bus services in the county, but what East have announced for 30th October is anything but.

However, as Central Bedfordshire Council and Stagecoach East are not the same organisation (and therefore the actions of one cannot be conflated with the aspirations of another), and the funding which Central Bedfordshire bid for was not granted to them in full, what else is to be done?

 

[Deerfold]

The X10 is heading for the bin very soon anyway so I don’t see them doing anything like that

It's being withdrawn from early October according to information given to Leeds City councillors.

 

[_toommm_]

It's being withdrawn from early October according to information given to Leeds City councillors.

Definitely withdrawn, it’s on the Stagecoach website:

Timetable Changes | Stagecoach Yorkshire

www.stagecoachbus.com

Along with this, Stagecoach is taking over quite a bit of Rotherham which is quite interesting. From the South Yorkshire Transport Forum, it’s been mooted that First cannot currently receive funding in the area as they cannot guarantee that 90% of services will run.

 

[RELL6L]

This is work in progress but, showing a second schedule for recent proposals, these appear to be currently out there, with a few uncertainties. Ignoring services which weren't frequent anyway and also ignoring local services within cities etc - otherwise the list would be endless!

Arriva Yorkshire 405, 408, 409	Selby to Doncaster hourly (405), Pontefract to Doncaster hourly (408/409)	Proposed to withdraw. Some replacements at Doncaster and Pontefract ends but none crossing between South & West Yorkshire
First Huddersfield 308	Huddersfield to Honley (30 mins) to Holmfirth (hourly)	Proposed to withdraw part, details unclear
First Halifax 539	Halifax to Stainland, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
First Halifax 571	Halifax to Bradford via Hipperholme	Proposed to withdraw, being partially replaced by Arriva	West Yorkshire
First Leeds X98, X99	Leeds to Wetherby, half hourly	Being replaced commercially by Transdev	Commercial
First West of England 126	Wells to Weston Super Mare, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
First West of England 178	Bristol to Radstock via Keynsham & villages, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
First West of England X2	Bristol to Yatton, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
First West of England X5	Bristol to Weston via Portishead & Clevedon, hourly	Temporary reprieve announced between Portishead and Worle
Stagecoach East (Bedford) 41	Bedford to Northampton, every 90 minutes	Withdrawn between Northampton and Turvey except 2 peak journeys
Stagecoach East (Bedford) 72, 73	Bedford to Biggleswade, every 30 minutes	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach East (Cambridge) 11	Cambridge, Burwell, Newmarket, Bury St Edmunds, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach East (Cambridge) 12	Cambridge, Newmarket, Soham, Ely, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach East (Cambridge) 30	Huntingdon to Ramsey, 5 journeys	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach East (Cambridge) 35	Huntingdon to Chatteris, 6 journeys	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach East (Cambridge) 39	Ely to March, 6 journeys	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach East (Cambridge) 66	Huntingdon to St Neots, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach East (Cambridge) 915	Cambridge to Royston, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach East (Cambridge) all V services	Various from St Ives and Huntingdon, mainly peaks	Proposed to withdraw
Stagecoach South East (Eastbourne) 4, 5, 6	Much of the outer network of Eastbourne services withdrawn	Proposed to withdraw, East Sussex CC looking to replace like-for-like	East Sussex
Stagecoach South East (Hastings) 254, 304/305	Hastings to Battle to Hawkhurst to Tunbridge Wells, hourly, withdrawn.	Proposed to withdraw, East Sussex CC looking to replace like-for-like	East Sussex
Stagecoach South East (Hastings) 349	Hastings to Staplecross & Hawkhurst, 2 hourly, withdrawn	Proposed to withdraw, East Sussex CC looking to replace like-for-like	East Sussex
Stagecoach South West (Devon) 155	Exeter to Barnstaple via Tiverton and South Molton	Proposed to withdraw, maybe?

 

[Andyh82]

In regards to the above list, the 308 is staying, the 539 is being withdrawn

As is the X26/X27 & 85 in Leeds and the 327/360 in Huddersfield

All Arriva’s commuter express services that run peak times into Leeds from Wakefield district are being withdrawn

and just announced Transdev are withdrawing the CityZap

 

[tomuk]

Update from Shropshire, interim council funding extended until possible award of government funding.

Council to provide further support to save under-threat bus services​

Council to provide further support to save under-threat bus services - Shropshire Council Newsroom

Shropshire Council is to extend its financial support for a number of under-threat bus services until at least March next year.

newsroom.shropshire.gov.uk

The services that have received support since March, and that will continue to receive support, are:

​

• 9 – Wolverhampton to Bridgnorth
• 20 – Radbrook Green
• 21 – Reabrook
• 544/546 – Little Lyth and Pulverbatch
• 738/740 – Ludlow to Knighton
• 552/553 – Shrewsbury to Bishops Castle
• 435 – Shrewsbury to Ludlow
• 125 – Highley to Bridgnorth
• 64 – Market Drayton to Shrewsbury (Saturdays)
• 701 – Ludlow Town
• 745A/B – Pontesbury, Clun, Bishops Castle, Lydbury North area.
• 558 – Montgomery to Shrewsbury

The new timetables will remain in place.

 

[paul1609]

Horrendous maybe, but if the numbers of passengers are not high enough to be viable commercially then it is the only option. Local councils could fund them higher but ultimately if the numbers are not there even this pot of money can’t last forever.

As a guard on the Kent & East Sussex Railway I quite often close the gates accross the 349 at Bodiam station on its most rural leg. On most occasions I see it its empty or with 1 or 2 passengers at best we very rarely see it dropping passengers off to the railway anymore. This is quite in contrast to the precovid situation and I do feel quite sorry for Stagecoach and their drivers but I reckon theres a good chance they will win the tender for the replacement service.

 

[yorksrob]

Arriva services around Wakefield seem to have been slashed fairly recently.

The 188 from Wakefield to Cass (the more windy route) has gone, leaving only the 189, which is direct, but hourly in the evening (the 188 used to complement it on the half hour)

Also, walking past the stands, there were lots of services with a single bus in the morning.

 

[MedwayValiant]

I reckon theres a good chance they will win the tender for the replacement service.

Is a local authority permitted to exclude the operator who is proposing to withdraw a service from tendering for its replacement?

Maybe not East Sussex so much, but I could imagine Cambridgeshire being quite keen to exclude Stagecoach if that is allowed.

 

[RT4038]

Is a local authority permitted to exclude the operator who is proposing to withdraw a service from tendering for its replacement?

Certainly not. If an operator can no longer make a service pay, why shouldn't they be able to tender for subsidy to keep it going? Are you suggesting that the incumbent should hold down pay rates and only part pay for the fuel or something?

 

[londonteacher]

Is a local authority permitted to exclude the operator who is proposing to withdraw a service from tendering for its replacement?

Maybe not East Sussex so much, but I could imagine Cambridgeshire being quite keen to exclude Stagecoach if that is allowed.

Why would they be excluded? Everyone knows passenger numbers are low so a service being withdrawn is hardly a shock.

If the local council can fund the service or a replacement then surely the incumbent with route knowledge and vehicles would be the most sensible choice. Of course other companies should get a chance also, but this is not always possible due to lack of vehicles and or staff.

 

[paul1609]

In truth Stagecoach Southeast have often been the operator that have picked up the pieces on the rural routes on the Kent/ East Sussex border when small independant companies went bust and villages feared they were going to be left with no bus. They have a positive image locally perhaps much better than they seem to enjoy up country.

 

[duncombec]

Is a local authority permitted to exclude the operator who is proposing to withdraw a service from tendering for its replacement?

Maybe not East Sussex so much, but I could imagine Cambridgeshire being quite keen to exclude Stagecoach if that is allowed.

As I pointed out above, the "rural" services were long-term East Sussex (ESCC) tenders anyway, declared largely commercial by Stagecoach in better times (the public holiday service and some early/late journeys are provided with support, presumably de minimis). I can't recall with certainty whether it was as a result of tendering that Arriva lost the sections of the then 4 & 5 south of Hawkhurst (now 304/305) and the 12 between Tenterden and Rye (now 312), or they became tendered as a result.

As such, why would ESCC want to exclude an operator who has shown willingness to help the tendered services budget in recent years? That would surely discourage operators from commercial declarations if/when times become better? It seems strange that an operator can go to a council for a small top up (e.g. de minimis funding), and that seems perfectly OK, yet when the money required either exceeds de minimis limits, or the authority questions the requested sum, or it just wouldn't be enough regardless but the frequency is useful or desired, the bus operator is suddenly some big bag corporate wolf that needs to be excluded from taking work it would actually be quite happy to do, just can't afford to do so.

I know almost nothing about Cambridgeshire, but the same broad ideals apply - perhaps Stagecoach have sought funding and been turned down, for whatever reason? Perhaps these services just aren't being used, and a frequency decrease isn't plausible for other reasons? Consider the 'FOUR HOUR GAP!!!!!' comments - perhaps there is simply no use on Saturday afternoons, except for the last journey, so the cloth has been cut accordingly, but it being seen as a 'gap', rather than provision to match usage? Perhaps Cambridgeshire have a policy common amongst local authorities of not funding services outside of their area (or Cambridgeshire would, but Suffolk wouldn't, and therefore the route had little purpose if it didn't have a useful end point at both ends?)

Why would ESCC or Cambridgeshire be willing to exclude an operator for tendering, only to then find out that potential replacement operators come to more than Stagecoach were asking, or that worse, there are no bids at all?

 

[Typhoon]

As I pointed out above, the "rural" services were long-term East Sussex (ESCC) tenders anyway, declared largely commercial by Stagecoach in better times (the public holiday service and some early/late journeys are provided with support, presumably de minimis). I can't recall with certainty whether it was as a result of tendering that Arriva lost the sections of the then 4 & 5 south of Hawkhurst (now 304/305) and the 12 between Tenterden and Rye (now 312), or they became tendered as a result.

Whether it was the closure of Hawkhurst garage that caused Arriva to give up these services or whether the loss of the services cause the garage to close, I am not too sure. Certainly 312 was operated by Coastal Coaches for sometime and before that Arriva operated that section of the route less frequently than the rest of the 12 (I believe, but am not too sure, as a separate route). The 304/305 were at one stage operated by Countryliner until about 10 years ago. Both were part of the ESCC Rider network to develop and support bus use. Stagecoach only picked up the routes after Countryliner failed and Coastal pulled out or failed..