New fleet of class 60s for DBS

[Railway]

http://rail-news.com/2011/01/18/db-schenker-to-create-new-fleet-of-class-60s-2/

 

[Nym]

It isn't april 1st is it?

Or are they seeing sense and getting all this done while we only have Euro IIIb to deal with?

 

[Hydro]

I wonder what makes them "Super"? Actual upgrades or just a status of "No longer rotting in Toton"?


Maybe DBS have been eyeing up Freightliners 70's and getting nervous. "We need more power Cap'n!"

 

[truckman060473]

when it says "a super 60 has been released into operations" are they referring to 60011 in its new DBS red coat, because some people reckoned it had merely been repainted and not overhauled?

 

[Old Timer]

The problem is that certain oil flows particularly are too heavy for the Class 66s, which is why we especially still see 60s on the Immingham / Robeston to Westerleigh, and the Immingham to Port Clarence.

In addition 60s are the choice for some of the Immingham to Scunthorpe steel flows.

When they tried 66s on the Robeston, the train stalled and they ended up having to double up the traction.

There are also times when the Immingham to Kingsbury flows need a 60 because of the need to convey additional wagons.

 

[Aictos]

What sort of work is DBS looking at to make the Class 60s into Super Class 60s?

 

[142094]

Single 66s have been seen on the Jarrow - Lindsey tanks, although apparently double 66s are needed. Has been 60s for the past week or two which is good to see.

 

[YorkshireBear]

one of the two newly repainted ones has been fully overhauled if not both, im prety sure the tata steel one has

 

[Kingfisher200262]

Let this be a salutary lesson to anyone thinking they might like to take a "modern" diesel loco into preservation at any point.... if the numbers are right, each loco has cost over £450k to overhaul, and that's based on in-house labour.

Still, park a loco in a siding for three or four years and what can you expect?

 

[37402]

Single 66s have been seen on the Jarrow - Lindsey tanks, although apparently double 66s are needed. Has been 60s for the past week or two which is good to see.

Class 60 haulage was a pre-requisite to enable the Jarrow to be increased to load 30. Permitted to be a Class 66 only in emergency circumstances or when the load is reduced.

 

[142094]

Class 60 haulage was a pre-requisite to enable the Jarrow to be increased to load 30. Permitted to be a Class 66 only in emergency circumstances or when the load is reduced.

It has definately been a single 66 out of Tyne Yard going south on a few occasions, has been reported by a DB driver who works out of Tyne Yard. However this is very rare, normally it is doubled up 66s. The terminal at Jarrow is small so all the workings going north are split at Tyne Yard anyway, with two workings from Tyne Yard to Jarrow per day.

 

[daikilo]

Let this be a salutary lesson to anyone thinking they might like to take a "modern" diesel loco into preservation at any point.... if the numbers are right, each loco has cost over £450k to overhaul, and that's based on in-house labour.

Still, park a loco in a siding for three or four years and what can you expect?

Half a million quid? That's 120 quid/working day over 15 yrs. Guess what, maybe the additional load revenue generates it, and more. Well done Brush. Glad to see DBSchenker can see beyond a two-year payback.

 

[Ferret]

when it says "a super 60 has been released into operations" are they referring to 60011 in its new DBS red coat, because some people reckoned it had merely been repainted and not overhauled?

Yeah, that's the loco they are referring to. I think 60007 is the first to be properly overhauled, and that's still in Toytown!

Blatant plug of 60011 in it's nice new colours at - http://www.ferret.fotopic.net/p68747011.html

 

[truckman060473]

I was in Cardiff today, and at 19.50, DBS red 60011 passed with Murco tanks to Margam yard, and the train had approached slow from the east, and accelerated through Cardiff Central station. There was no characteristic deep rumble of a tug engine on this train which happens when it is slowed when the road isn't clear. wonder what's been done to it!?

 

[37402]

It has definately been a single 66 out of Tyne Yard going south on a few occasions, has been reported by a DB driver who works out of Tyne Yard. However this is very rare, normally it is doubled up 66s. The terminal at Jarrow is small so all the workings going north are split at Tyne Yard anyway, with two workings from Tyne Yard to Jarrow per day.

Yes, because D43 is empty therefore within load for a single 66.
It's N03 that is the problem...if its loaded to 30 cars, it is a requirement to have a 60 (or equivalent i.e. 2x66).

 

[Kingfisher200262]

Half a million quid? That's 120 quid/working day over 15 yrs. Guess what, maybe the additional load revenue generates it, and more. Well done Brush. Glad to see DBSchenker can see beyond a two-year payback.

Agreed and in the commercial world, it's money well spent (although I probably would have gone even further and found an alternative to the notoriously quirky Mirrlees engines, which have always been the Achilles heel of the '60s.

I was simply pointing out that this is well beyond the means of most privateers in the preserved railway world and that as locos and other rolling stock become more and more complicated, it will be more and more difficult for them to find their way into preservation.

 

[Bill EWS]

The Class 60's were my second most favourite loco to work on. They had bags of power and very comfortable cabs that were also very quiet. The ride quality was also very good. It's been sad seeing them being run-down and neglected. This is good news and it is nice to know that some of them will still be around for some time yet.

I hope that the cabs have been improved as they were getting very grubby. The driver's seats were also well worn and I would hope they have been refurbished or replaced.

 

[fgwrich]

I was in Cardiff today, and at 19.50, DBS red 60011 passed with Murco tanks to Margam yard, and the train had approached slow from the east, and accelerated through Cardiff Central station. There was no characteristic deep rumble of a tug engine on this train which happens when it is slowed when the road isn't clear. wonder what's been done to it!?

Crikey, im guessing that a thorough and proper engine overhaul has at last been carried out then! A complete strip down and rebuild job by the sounds of it...Makes a change for DB/EWS!

 

[142094]

Yes, because D43 is empty therefore within load for a single 66.
It's N03 that is the problem...if its loaded to 30 cars, it is a requirement to have a 60 (or equivalent i.e. 2x66).

Sorry, I thought that you were saying in your previous post that all of zthe Jarrow workings had to be 2x66s.

 

[tbtc]

I was simply pointing out that this is well beyond the means of most privateers in the preserved railway world and that as locos and other rolling stock become more and more complicated, it will be more and more difficult for them to find their way into preservation.

This is the problem with a lot of enthusiasts projects (be it train, bus...). People club together to buy the train, without appreciating that the real cost is the ongoing maintenance and upkeep... finding the money to preserve one is only the first battle.

 

[route:oxford]

Without being unkind... Would anyone really want to preserve one?

They are designed to be lugging workhorses, have an RA of 7, can manage 60mph and no heating supply.

When something is preserved, it still needs to earn its keep - so unless a preserved line happens to provide an income generating spur to a super-quarry or other heavy indusry and fancies supplying the traction - they are pretty much going to be a static exhibit.

 

[Royston Vasey]

Without being unkind... Would anyone really want to preserve one?

They are designed to be lugging workhorses, have an RA of 7, can manage 60mph and no heating supply.

When something is preserved, it still needs to earn its keep - so unless a preserved line happens to provide an income generating spur to a super-quarry or other heavy indusry and fancies supplying the traction - they are pretty much going to be a static exhibit.

I think you'd be surprised! The class 56s don't differ so much from 60s in that respect and have proven popular on preserved lines' diesel galas. Train speeds are limited to 25/40 mph on preserved lines anyway. In terms of railtours, you can always stick another loco or a genny van on the back for ETS anyway, like a steam tour. Admittedly ralitours would be harder to assign routes, pathing and timing to.

You'll probably find that as young enthusiasts of the 90s grow up, the allure of a preserved 60 will increase, just as the children and teenagers of the 80s will now want to see the locos like the 56s they grew up spotting. I am a child of the 80s and would enjoy being hauled by a 56, which I grew up seeing a lot of around the north east as a child. The attraction is perhaps even enhanced by the novelty of haulage from a freight loco (rather than just another 37 or 47 which was commonplace until a few years ago anyway)

 

[sprinterguy]

Without being unkind... Would anyone really want to preserve one?

Well, they do have their very own Preservation Group, so there is clearly plenty of intent to have a 60 preserved.

 

[Kneedown]

The Class 60's were my second most favourite loco to work on. They had bags of power and very comfortable cabs that were also very quiet. The ride quality was also very good. It's been sad seeing them being run-down and neglected. This is good news and it is nice to know that some of them will still be around for some time yet.

I hope that the cabs have been improved as they were getting very grubby. The driver's seats were also well worn and I would hope they have been refurbished or replaced.

I have to echo what Bill says. When i was at Toton i had a big soft spot for the 60's. They were pretty reliable, comfortable, and would pull absolutely anything, anywhere. They made easy work of the 3000ton Langley tanks, and were the only loco that could actually get 42HAA's to the rapid loader at Bentinck Colliery without exceeding the 5mph limit. The loader was on top of a steep gradient, round a sharp left hand bend, on a slimy slippery rail. If you had a pair of 20's, a 56 or 58 you had to take a run up at 10-15mph (and pray you didn't derail!) or you'd never make it. When the 60's came along it was a breeze!

Great to see em having a new lease of life. It's depressing seeing the lines of them rotting away at Toton.

 

[37402]

Crikey, im guessing that a thorough and proper engine overhaul has at last been carried out then! A complete strip down and rebuild job by the sounds of it...Makes a change for DB/EWS!

Nothing has been done to 60011 apart from a bit of bodywork, attention from a paintbrush and fixing an oil leak. 60007 is to be the first full overhaul.

 

[Crossforth]

I probably won't see them very often, as I don't see them very often at the mo, being in Leeds

 

[Kingfisher200262]

Without being unkind... Would anyone really want to preserve one?

They are designed to be lugging workhorses, have an RA of 7, can manage 60mph and no heating supply.

When something is preserved, it still needs to earn its keep - so unless a preserved line happens to provide an income generating spur to a super-quarry or other heavy indusry and fancies supplying the traction - they are pretty much going to be a static exhibit.

Drawing a steam parallel, there are plenty of preserved Stanier 8F locos in preservation, including two that have recently been repatriated from Turkey. Not the most appropriate loco for passenger services, when the are plenty of, for example Merchant Navy Class locos that are sitting in preserved railways rotting away because nobody can gather together the funds to restore them.

I do take your point however, and you're right. But the 60 was an important milestone in railway history as the last locomotive order from BR prior to privatisation, so I think it is right that one is preserved, even if DB applies some philanthropic tendencies and gives one to the National Collection.

 

[jopsuk]

I'd like a time machine and a huge, huge site so that the National Collection can house at least one (ideally two- one static, one working order) of every class ever to run in the UK- including prototypes, and even major sub classes and "iconic" coaching sets.

 

[tbtc]

I'd like a time machine and a huge, huge site so that the National Collection can house at least one (ideally two- one static, one working order) of every class ever to run in the UK- including prototypes, and even major sub classes and "iconic" coaching sets.

Its impossible to satisfy all enthusiasts. Even if you preserved every single train you'd still have people like me complaining that a certain train was preserved in BR blue rather than Large Logo/ Railfreight Distribution etc etc

 

[Peter Mugridge]

It appears that all 20 of the 60s recently offered for sale by DBS have been withdrawn from sale and that some of those are amongst the examples being assessed for the "Super 60" overhauls.