Putin's dire warning this morning.....
"Whoever would try to stop us and further create threats to our country, to our people, should know that Russia's response will be immediate and lead you to such consequences that you have never faced in your history,"
"We are ready for any outcome."
So is the answer to a bully, to appease him? No. This should be a call for military action by the U.K. and it’s allies.
NATO can yet still go all-in. Whilst initially the free world did not commit with this, I think it’s totally fine to change its mind, in light of Putin’s word - such as “no invasion planned” - being so worthless.
There is no fear against going against Russia now, it’s not like they might start a war or something, they already have.
Personally, playing armchair general a bit, I’d send the troops already in Poland and the Baltic’s straight across their respective borders. Russia would be forced to redeploy its troops which would take the pressure off Ukraine a bit.
If you mean the U.K. and it’s allies (who happen to be NATO members), yes, I agree with what you suggest. But first the allied Air forces should impose a no fly zone over Ukraine, to keep the Russian Air Force out of it.
Russian forces are currently bombing residential areas of Ukraine killing innocent civilians. Anyone who tries to defend them on here is nothing but an appeaser to those committing war crimes
Agree. It is 100% clear who is the warmonger here. It’s Russia under Vladimir Putin.
Russian World Chess Champion Garry Kasparov seems to have the right idea:
Ok, after years of warnings were ignored and hearing "Garry, you were right!" all damn day today, I'll repeat what I said in 2014: Stop telling me I was right and listen to what I'm saying now. My recommendations follow: 1/5
-Support Ukraine militarily, immediately, everything but boots on the ground. All weapons, intel, cyber. -Bankrupt Putin's war machine. Freeze & seize Russia's finances & those of him and his gang. -Kick Russia out of every intl & financial institution. PACE, Interpol, etc 2/5
-Recall all ambassadors from Russia. There is no point in talking. The new unified message is "stop or be isolated completely". -Ban all elements of Putin's global propaganda machine. Turn them off, shut them down, send them home. Stop helping the dictator spread lies & hate. 3/5
-Expose and act against Putin's lackeys in the free world. If Schröder and his ilk continue to work for Putin, bring charges. Ask the owners & advertisers of networks platforming Putin propagandists like Carlson why they allow it. 4/5
-Replace Russian oil & gas. Pressure OPEC, increase production, reopen Keystone. You can't save the planet if you don't save the people on it. -Acknowledge there will be costs, sacrifices. We waited to long, the price is high, but it will only get higher. It's time to fight. 5/5
Cannot ignore the political 5th column of Putinists, from the far right & left in EU to the tankies & Trump & his GOP followers in the US. They may have the right to support a brutal dictator's war in order to criticize Biden, but it's disgusting and anti-American. Do not forget.
Whilst I agree, I don’t think this will be enough, and the effects will not be quick enough to prevent a substantial loss of life.
If Putin's reason is that he fears NATO, then it’s clear that NATO members should take military action against Russia.
I agree. From a NATO perspective the danger of it escalating into a nuclear conflict is too great, and from a Russian perspective it’s suicide. I don’t know what the answer is here to be honest, I’ll say it again though that Putin being toppled from within is probably the best outcome. The fighting looks to be extremely fierce with no shortage of Russian losses and if it becomes a prolonged bloody conflict who knows……
But if NATO members don’t take any military action, it almost certainly will become a long drawn out war. I don’t think if NATO members do take military action against Russia, we will see a nuclear conflict. Putin knows it’s game over if that happens.
I do know how you feel, it certainly wasn’t the news I wanted to wake up to. I don’t think we’re under threat but at the same time the world cannot afford any miscalculations. It’s worth remembering that from a Russian perspective war with the UK let alone the rest of NATO would be catastrophic; they’ll be as keen to avoid any escalation as we are. Putin knows what NATO is capable of which I believe explains his (admittedly rather worrying) sabre rattling over foreign interference.
I know it’s easy to say but try not to worry too much.
I don’t think Russia will fire off any nuclear missiles. But European nations WILL be affected. The cost of fossil fuels will rise further. And hence the cost of food and other consumables will also rise. As well as other products.
I'm pretty sure that Even Putin would baulk at using a nuclear armoury against any NATO countries, knowing the fate that would befall Russia if he did. I would say the reason NATO isn't going into Ukraine is (a) the Ukrainian Government hasn't (yet) asked us to, but more importantly (b) for too long too many Western politicians and Governments have been running scared of 'Stop the War' and similar campaigners, along with too many people taking the attitude of,
anything that isn't inside our country isn't our problem, and we've pretty much lost the will to defend democracy and ourselves
I hope if any good comes out of this awful situation, it'll be that people in the West start realise that if you want to live in a safer World, you do actually have to be willing to fight sometimes.
If the world does not stand up and tell Putin where to shove it, and back that up with military force, Putin or any other leader of a country that is not democratic will take this as a green light that they should be able to get away with furthering their own ideas on invading other countries.
Those comments about 'consequences' for countries who intervene little more than verbal bullying. So even if, he was to be hinting at a nuclear response to the UK for example, whatever he sent would be met in kind due to MAD. With two Trident submarines permanently at sea, that's 80 warheads on their way to Russia. Maybe 120 if three subs were at sea. They may be able to turn the UK into a radioactive theme park but 80x 100kt warheads would render Russia utterly finished as a functional country. Around half of the population would be gone after a few weeks and the rest suffering the after effects. There would be no coming back from that kind of devastation. And that's just if the UK fired back. Putin knows this. Would he want that as his legacy? The man who destroyed Russia?
It's a chilling topic but I genuinely believe MAD will prevent any nuclear escalation.
I agree.
There have been various proxy wars around the world and since the nuclear bombs were dropped on Japan, MAD has worked, in that no one has dared to fire off a nuclear missile or drop a nuclear bomb in anger against another country. And I see no reason for that to change.
Putin obviously wants a legacy. But he wants to live and see his legacy. A nuclear war would literally kill that stone dead.
www.bbc.co.uk
