Refund for Taxi?

[Legolash2o]

Hi all, I went to the cinema to see a great film. All good. After the film, I noticed that every single train to my home town was cancelled.

I spoke to two LNER assistants behind a counter but they couldn't do anything. My only choice of getting home was paying a £35 taxi fare or stay over in a hotel and buy a new ticket in the morning. My ticket was an off-peak day return.

Am I able to claim the cost of the taxi as they essentially left me stranded with no other means of getting home?

Thank you in advance.

 

[_toommm_]

Where was it you were trying to travel to and from and at what time? Did you ask them about replacement transport in whatever form it may be?

 

[hkstudent]

Hi all, I went to the cinema to see a great film. All good. After the film, I noticed that every single train to my home town was cancelled.

I spoke to two LNER assistants behind a counter but they couldn't do anything. My only choice of getting home was paying a £35 taxi fare or stay over in a hotel and buy a new ticket in the morning. My ticket was an off-peak day return.

Am I able to claim the cost of the taxi as they essentially left me stranded with no other means of getting home?

Thank you in advance.

Firstly, the staff at the station offered exceptionally poor advice, not knowing the customer's right in getting alternative transport to be arranged by the railway to the ticketed destination or being arranged an overnight accommodation.

In your case, you may need to write to the customer service, claiming for a delay repay for your ticket, respective to your delayed hours, and also request to refund the taxi fare as the staff be unwilling to provide alternative transport to your destination and being told to arrange your own taxi.

There are many threads in this forum discussed about stranded passengers right (and loads of disputes)

 

[AlterEgo]

Firstly, the staff at the station offered exceptionally poor advice, not knowing the customer's right in getting alternative transport to be arranged by the railway to the ticketed destination or being arranged an overnight accommodation.

In your case, you may need to write to the customer service, claiming for a delay repay for your ticket, respective to your delayed hours, and also request to refund the taxi fare as the staff be unwilling to provide alternative transport to your destination and being told to arrange your own taxi.

There are many threads in this forum discussed about stranded passengers right (and loads of disputes)

This journey is not eligible for delay repay as the customer didn’t travel. A pro-rata refund from the retailer is what’s due.

 

[hkstudent]

This journey is not eligible for delay repay as the customer didn’t travel. A pro-rata refund from the retailer is what’s due.

It would be easier to do two in one, with contacting LNER for both the delay and the taxi fare.
If they are done separately, the claim for taxi would be very hard to be achieved.

 

[AlterEgo]

It would be easier to do two in one, with contacting LNER for both the delay and the taxi fare.
If they are done separately, the claim for taxi would be very hard to be achieved.

The OP isn’t entitled to delay repay, because they didn’t travel, and they shouldn’t ask for it because that can lead to trouble.

The OP should refund the unused part of ticket from the point of sale as is their right, and should contact LNER separately with a receipt (hopefully!) for the taxi fare.

 

[hkstudent]

The OP isn’t entitled to delay repay, because they didn’t travel, and they shouldn’t ask for it because that can lead to trouble.

The OP should refund the unused part of ticket from the point of sale as is their right, and should contact LNER separately with a receipt (hopefully!) for the taxi fare.

The problem is: By refunding the ticket, OP may also lose the right for claiming disruption related expenses as the contract no longer exist.
Claiming delay repay in customer service plus taxi receipt is actually the simplest solution for OP and also on the LNER side as the whole story can add up easily.
As long as the claim is also mentioned with "the journey abandoned due to all trains cancelled and left stranded at the station", there will be no false information be provided, it's just about an invalid delay repay claim submitted (if LNER takes abandoned journey as not eligible, which in practice, many TOCs just pay up delay repay for abandoned journeys due to cancellations.

 

[robbeech]

It would be easier to do two in one, with contacting LNER for both the delay and the taxi fare.
If they are done separately, the claim for taxi would be very hard to be achieved.

It may well be ‘easier’ (or it may not be) but it is generally the wrong process and as we have seen recently the railway is being horrifically hard on these genuine cases as a side effect of cracking down on fraudulent claims.

As an extreme but plausible result of wrongly claiming delay repay a passenger may be accused of fraud and made to pay back everything they’ve ever claimed, an admin fee that can total into the thousands or face going to court.

Its therefore crucial that we only offer the correct advice, which we can’t do without more details.



In my opinion contacting the operator here should be your first job. We don’t know the full situation as you haven’t mentioned the journey details and when you bought your ticket so there may be a scenario where you would not have been entitled, however it sounds as if you’ve been (unsurprisingly) misled in favour of reduced costs to the railway which is rife at the moment.

See what LNER say, you have 28 days to obtain a refund. If LNER pay your taxi fare then then there’s a definite argument to suggest that your ticket was used to travel and as such delay repay may apply based on your actual arrival time against the proposed arrival time. This is why it’s important to contact them first before deciding whether a refund from your point of purchase is in order.

 

[IanXC]

All the above assumes the journey intended was on an LNER service.

If it was not, then assuming the OP was at the station in time for a cancelled service by another operator to their intended destination, then it is still LNER's problem for (seemingly) not even getting in touch with the relevant TOC to enquire about alternatives.

Definitely one to go to LNER with I feel. (Not that that excludes the possibility of having to go elsewhere later.)

 

[Wallsendmag]

We're assuming it ws a LNER journey the OP was making remember LNER are not the sole operator at any of the stations they serve. This could well have been a problem with another operators services that they had no power to obtain alternative transport for.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

We're assuming it ws a LNER journey the OP was making remember LNER are not the sole operator at any of the stations they serve. This could well have been a problem with another operators services that they had no power to obtain alternative transport for.

Thought that such a scenario was specifically covered in the NRCoT. Is this not/no longer the case?

28. WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THINGS GO WRONG?
28.2. Where disruption prevents you from completing the journey for which your Ticket is valid and is being used, any Train Company will, where it reasonably can, provide you with alternative means of travel to your destination, or if necessary, provide overnight accommodation for you.

 

[Legolash2o]

Thanks for the replies everyone, appreciated.

I was just going to take the next train home and didn't check who it was with. Looking now, each cancelled train was a mixture of operators (staff/driver issues).

I did look at the Trainline for a refund but with a £2.50 admin charge, I would have only got £2-3 back

 

[Haywain]

Thanks for the replies everyone, appreciated.

I was just going to take the next train home and didn't check who it was with. Looking now, each cancelled train was a mixture of operators (staff/driver issues).

I did look at the Trainline for a refund but with a £2.50 admin charge, I would have only got £2-3 back

Which station was this, and where were you travelling to?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Dec 2021 ==

We're assuming it ws a LNER journey the OP was making remember LNER are not the sole operator at any of the stations they serve. This could well have been a problem with another operators services that they had no power to obtain alternative transport for.

If there were no further services to the OP's destination as a result of unplanned cancellations and a valid ticket was held, LNER staff should have assisted.

 

[yorkie]

Thanks for the replies everyone, appreciated.

I was just going to take the next train home and didn't check who it was with. Looking now, each cancelled train was a mixture of operators (staff/driver issues).

I did look at the Trainline for a refund but with a £2.50 admin charge, I would have only got £2-3 back

What journey was it? Where from/to, what time?

If LNER manage the station, they should have arranged alternative transport.

Trainline are not allowed to charge an admin fee for a refund where a train was cancelled, but what your actual course of action should be is unclear as it would be useful to know more information about the journey first.

Did you contact the train operator (if that wasn't LNER themselves) and if so, what did they say?

Was there any sign of any other passengers in a similar position?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Dec 2021 ==

Thought that such a scenario was specifically covered in the NRCoT. Is this not/no longer the case?

It is the case; if LNER operate the station concerned then LNER are obliged to help. Sorting out the bill is then an internal rail industry matter, and not of the customers' concern.

 

[Legolash2o]

It was Darlington to Northallerton after 19:30.

I spoke to a LNER person behind the counter and after looking at their computer asked me to see the person inside the Travel Centre. They suggested going to Thornaby and then back down to Northallerton but the 2nd leg of the journey was cancelled. They then said about the 10pm train but I checked and the Northallerton stop was cancelled.

I've not emailed/contact them after yet as I came here first for the best approach and their online chat was closed. With the cost of the ticket, I'm more fussed about the taxi fare.

 

[AlterEgo]

Was this yesterday, or on another date?

 

[Legolash2o]

Was this yesterday, or on another date?

It was yesterday

 

[hkstudent]

It was yesterday

I have checked RecentTrainTimes, and sadly, there are trains running at 21:48 and 23:20, 3 hours after OP's incident.
LNER or TPE may decline OP's stranded claim.

 

[Legolash2o]

Nooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm sure the 21:48 said Northallerton was cancelled.

I wonder why the app or the staff didn't mentioned the later one - even after I said "I'll guess I'll have to get a taxi" and told me where the taxi rank was. Bit unreasonable to expect anyone to sit at a station for 4 hours, especially when arriving home at near midnight.

 

[Starmill]

If you were advised that there were no trains running it does not matter if they were later reinstated for the purposes of your delay.

 

[Haywain]

If you were advised that there were no trains running it does not matter if they were later reinstated for the purposes of your delay.

It appears that the OP drew those conclusion from their own investigation.

 

[yorkie]

I would write to LNER about this as it sounds like you were either given incorrect information about the lack of trains or incorrectly not assisted if there had been a genuine belief there was no alternative.

LNER should refund you, not Trainline.

It may be worth asking LNER if they will consider giving you a complimentary scratch card; I know of people who have been compensated in this manner. But perhaps don't ask for it in the first instance, but push for that if they do not offer adequate compensation after an initial contact.

If this happens again, my advice is to:

• ask the staff to confirm if there are really no trains and no alternative and state that you believe they should be providing a taxi; and/or:
• post a thread on this forum if possible and seek our advice.
• If you are on Twitter, it can be worth tweeting the relevant train company (if you cannot do this, a forum member may be able to do this for you. For example I got a good result from EMR a few months ago and managed to avoid the customer being delayed, which avoided a Delay Repay claim:

https://twitter.com/EastMidRailway/status/1421159682639597574

Hey there. I've just spoken to Supervisor at Crewe. If you're able to make yourself known to a member of staff there then they will be able to endorse your ticket to travel via either Stockport/Manchester to Sheffield. This will be a quicker route for you. ^PM

 

[Wallsendmag]

I would write to LNER about this as it sounds like you were either given incorrect information about the lack of trains or incorrectly not assisted if there had been a genuine belief there was no alternative.

LNER should refund you, not Trainline.

It may be worth asking LNER if they will consider giving you a complimentary scratch card; I know of people who have been compensated in this manner. But perhaps don't ask for it in the first instance, but push for that if they do not offer adequate compensation after an initial contact.

If this happens again, my advice is to:

• ask the staff to confirm if there are really no trains and no alternative and state that you believe they should be providing a taxi; and/or:
• post a thread on this forum if possible and seek our advice.
• If you are on Twitter, it can be worth tweeting the relevant train company (if you cannot do this, a forum member may be able to do this for you. For example I got a good result from EMR a few months ago and managed to avoid the customer being delayed, which avoided a Delay Repay claim:

https://twitter.com/EastMidRailway/status/1421159682639597574

We don't do Scratchcards so I wouldn't bother mentioning that by name

 

[Legolash2o]

It appears that the OP drew those conclusion from their own investigation.

In the end I did as it looked like they couldn't suggest anything. If I took their Thornaby suggestion for example, then I'd be stuck further away from home when I got to Thornaby, as the train from there to Northallerton was cancelled.

They where polite and everything so couldn't blame the staff members and didn't get angry but everything on the app said cancelled so I had to make a choice. No one can predict that multiple TOCS will have staffing issues at the same time

Just in a queue for the online chat. Not the end of the world if they can't refund the fare, worth trying.

 

[Starmill]

In the end I did as it looked like they couldn't suggest anything. If I took their Thornaby suggestion for example, then I'd be stuck further away from home when I got to Thornaby, as the train from there to Northallerton was cancelled.

They where polite and everything so couldn't blame the staff members and didn't get angry but everything on the app said cancelled so I had to make a choice. No one can predict that multiple TOCS will have staffing issues at the same time

Just in a queue for the online chat. Not the end of the world if they can't refund the fare, worth trying.

If you're certain that the train was shown as cancelled by an official source then that's still adequate. The trouble is that there seems to have been some doubt about the matter from your account.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Dec 2021 ==

It appears that the OP drew those conclusion from their own investigation.

I confess I am slightly confused about what exactly was said. If advice was given to change trains at Thornaby surely the OP would have pointed out that the train was cancelled from Thornaby to Northallerton and the member of staff would thwn suggest something else?

 

[Legolash2o]

I confess I am slightly confused about what exactly was said. If advice was given to change trains at Thornaby surely the OP would have pointed out that the train was cancelled from Thornaby to Northallerton and the member of staff would thwn suggest something else?

I did tell them that. They then suggested a slightly later one but after checking the Trainline app showed the Northallerton stop was cancelled which I also politely mentioned.

I was looking at the app and every row said the train was cancelled except:

• The one via Thornaby where it said the 2nd leg was cancelled. I looked further and it was the Northallerton one.
• One where I clicked on it and it had a CANX next to Northallerton. The train ran but wasn't stopping at Northallerton anymore.

Strangely now that I'm looking at the realtimetrains a 21:48 it seemed to run anyway, unless they re-instated it? I have a message to my partner saying I could get that one but then later a message saying that was cancelled as well. I just remember every row on the app saying cancelled, apart from the two above.

Now I'm doubting myself...

 

[yorkie]

Another thing to add to my previous list is to take screenshots.

Of course none of this should be necessary but sometimes mistakes happen, and sometimes poor service is provided. It's difficult to know what happened in this case. Hope you get it sorted though! Please do let us know how it gets resolved.

 

[Starmill]

Trains can be reinstated at short notice. It's relatively rare but not unheard of.

 

[Legolash2o]

Another thing to add to my previous list is to take screenshots.

Of course none of this should be necessary but sometimes mistakes happen, and sometimes poor service is provided. It's difficult to know what happened in this case. Hope you get it sorted though! Please do let us know how it gets resolved.

Thankfully, it rarely happens but I will next time. I was in a bit of a panic mode figuring out how to get home.

They said to email their customer email address. If they can't sort it out it's not the end of the world as it happens. No ones fault.

 

[robbeech]

We're assuming it ws a LNER journey the OP was making remember LNER are not the sole operator at any of the stations they serve. This could well have been a problem with another operators services that they had no power to obtain alternative transport for.

That doesn’t absolve ANY operator from the responsibility set out in 28.2 of the NRCOT

Thought that such a scenario was specifically covered in the NRCoT. Is this not/no longer the case?

It still is, although more and more operators are ignoring this as they’ve seen how easy (and financially rewarding) it is to get away with it.


There’s a disappointing but unsurprising about of hand wiping in this thread isn’t there.