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Great British Railways: Thoughts, predictions, speculation

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JonathanH

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Well, they want Scotland for Scots Rule.
Maybe a good idea to create a Scottish Transport Police then...
There has been consideration of creating a Scottish Transport Police. One of the problems however is that the force would simply be too small and have to be amalgamated into the normal Scottish police.

There is a consultation here (which I can't easily copy out).
 
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davetheguard

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Bring back NSE?

National System England.

Chis Green called his painters & said:
"I want all my trains to be red".
But they waited in vain for the scheduled train
So they painted the lamp posts instead.
 

hkstudent

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There has been consideration of creating a Scottish Transport Police. One of the problems however is that the force would simply be too small and have to be amalgamated into the normal Scottish police.

There is a consultation here.
Oh dear, they have really tried that...
That's a fun one...
 

corsaVXR

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Powers will include forcing through amendments to the timetable to space out services and prevent unnecessary duplication on routes such as the east coast mainline, where multiple operators compete for the same passengers.
So preventing competition then? Got it.
 

CBlue

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The Northumbria, Mercia, Anglia, Essex, Kent, Sussex, Cymru, Kernow, Alba & Wessex Joint Railway?

NMAEKSCKA&WJR for short.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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It reads to me like Network Rail will grow to absorb the day-to-day management functions of DfT (franchise management), and the commercial arm of the TOCs (ticketing).
The question really is who lets new contracts, and on what basis. Who will decide fare levels, and increases?
ORR as the regulator might still have to be separate but might also lose some powers to the new body (which might still be called Network Rail).
Complicated by the need to continue the freight and open access TOCs, also the Scottish and Welsh devolved TOCs, and new entrants.

I suspect rebranding is low on the change agenda, and much of the TOC branding is likely to stay, at least in the short term.
The once-declared policy was to align TOCs with NR Routes/Regions, but that gets harder where main lines (WCML/ECML) overlap with TOCs like Northern and XC, not to mention "cross-border" services.
I doubt the name "Avanti" is going to disappear if they are negotiating a 10-year contract with First/Trenitalia.
LNER, if it remains as now, might find itself up for new bids again (on a concession basis).
And how (if?) will they integrate Northern and TPE?
 

Railwaysceptic

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Surely a transport advisor needs to know something about transport?! Hopefully he's moved on from his fanatical driverless trains ideas that would cost the taxpayer an absolute fortune to implement and concentrate on genuinely improving the UK rail network for all those who use it.
He knows a bit about cycle lanes. When Boris Johnson was Mayor of London, Mr. Gilligan was the main impetus behind the policy of making London's roads unfit for purpose.
 
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Nicholas Lewis

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It reads to me like Network Rail will grow to absorb the day-to-day management functions of DfT (franchise management), and the commercial arm of the TOCs (ticketing).
The question really is who lets new contracts, and on what basis. Who will decide fare levels, and increases?
ORR as the regulator might still have to be separate but might also lose some powers to the new body (which might still be called Network Rail).
Complicated by the need to continue the freight and open access TOCs, also the Scottish and Welsh devolved TOCs, and new entrants.

I suspect rebranding is low on the change agenda, and much of the TOC branding is likely to stay, at least in the short term.
The once-declared policy was to align TOCs with NR Routes/Regions, but that gets harder where main lines (WCML/ECML) overlap with TOCs like Northern and XC, not to mention "cross-border" services.
I doubt the name "Avanti" is going to disappear if they are negotiating a 10-year contract with First/Trenitalia.
LNER, if it remains as now, might find itself up for new bids again (on a concession basis).
And how (if?) will they integrate Northern and TPE?
TOC branding needs to go unless its funded by a locally devolved organisation like MerseyRail. London Overground is what it says part of London Transport / TfL it just happens to be operated by Arriva. Whatever people think about London Buses at least its common identity common ticketing nobody needs or should have to concern themselves with who operates it.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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While looking for more press stories about the impending railway reorganisation, I came across this:

The Railways Act 1921 (c. 55),[1] also known as the Grouping Act, was an Act of Parliament enacted by the British government and intended to stem the losses being made by many of the country's 120 railway companies, move the railways away from internal competition and retain some of the benefits which the country had derived from a government-controlled railway during and after the Great War of 1914–1918. The provisions of the Act took effect from the start of 1923.
Railways Act 1921 - Wikipedia

How apposite that the aims of the 1921 Grouping Act seem very similar to what we face exactly a century later...
 
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The Planner

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Will be interesting to see if there is a more noticeable gap planned between capital delivery/maintainer and the Ops/Strategy/Commercial side. Builders vs office if you like.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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There's a new piece in the Sunday Times today, on flexible season tickets.
But it's behind a paywall, like yesterday's Times article, and I am unable to quote it.
In the visible bit, it says the new organisation is to be called "Great British Railways" (no doubt to match our Great British Pounds).
It also displays the old BR lion-and-wheel symbol (which predated the double arrow of the 1960s).
Again, it might all be fiction, and in any case it appears to be written from the viewpoint of a harassed commuter.
Flexible rail tickets won’t add value for travellers | News | The Sunday Times (thetimes.co.uk)
 

Nicholas Lewis

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While looking for more press stories about the impending railway reorganisation, I can across this:


Railways Act 1921 - Wikipedia

How apposite that the aims of the 1921 Grouping Act seem very similar to what we face exactly a century later...
Oh thats excellent just need to digitise the document and do find and replace 1921 with 2021 job done!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

There's a new piece in the Sunday Times today, on flexible season tickets.
But it's behind a paywall, like yesterday's Times article.
In the visible bit, it says the new organisation is to be called "Great British Railways" (no doubt to match our Great British Pounds).
It also displays the old BR lion-and-wheel symbol (which predated the double arrow of the 1960s).
Again, it might all be fiction, and in any case written from the viewpoint of a harassed commuter.
Flexible rail tickets won’t add value for travellers | News | The Sunday Times (thetimes.co.uk)
must have consulted Portillo!
 

Djgr

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Let's hope the new organisation can take over all of the abandoned catering operations on stations, so that it can provide fa(y)re to travellers.
 

MotCO

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There's a new piece in the Sunday Times today, on flexible season tickets.
But it's behind a paywall, like yesterday's Times article, and I am unable to quote it.
In the visible bit, it says the new organisation is to be called "Great British Railways" (no doubt to match our Great British Pounds).
It also displays the old BR lion-and-wheel symbol (which predated the double arrow of the 1960s).
Again, it might all be fiction, and in any case it appears to be written from the viewpoint of a harassed commuter.
Flexible rail tickets won’t add value for travellers | News | The Sunday Times (thetimes.co.uk)

There is an article today in the Sunday Telegraph:

"Ministers to announce biggest shake-up of the railways since privatisation

As the railways adjust to changing working patterns, 'carnet' tickets will be offered to commuters who come to the office for one or two day

Ministers are set to announce the biggest shake-up of the railways since privatisation on the three-year anniversary of a bungled timetable overhaul that provoked nationwide fury among commuters.
Flexible season tickets will be formally unveiled as Grant Shapps, the Transport Secretary, lays the groundwork for a series of radical changes on Thursday.
As the railways adjust to changing working patterns, French-style "carnet" tickets will be offered to commuters who come to the office for one or two days a week.
Mr Shapps is also expected to signal the end of orange and green tickets with investment in “digital” ticketing that could be stored on mobile phones or smart cards.
The rail industry attempted the biggest timetable change in a generation on May 20, 2018. But the overhaul spectacularly backfired, leading to widespread disruption and hundreds of cancellations every day.


Regulators later said following an investigation that “no-one took charge”. Chris Grayling, Mr Shapps predecessor, said in the wake of the crisis:
“I don’t run the railways”
Mr Grayling commissioned a “root and branch” review four months after the timetable chaos. After a long delay - in part a result of the Covid pandemic - the review will be published this week to kickstart a slew of reforms.
Led by Keith Williams, the former British Airways boss, but now dubbed the “Williams-Shapps Review”, a decision to axe rail franchising will be rubber-stamped.
Rail operators will be paid a fee by taxpayers to run services with the Government collecting fares instead. Mr Shapps previously announced the end of franchising last September, prompting accusations that he was nationalising the railways by stealth.
An independent body dubbed the “Fat Controller” - named after the cantankerous station manager who starred alongside Thomas the Tank Engine in Reverend Wilbert Awdry’s The Railway Series - will also be formally unveiled.
The body will oversee the operation of the railways in order to keep Government officials at arms length from day-to-day decisions. It is expected to be led by Network Rail bosses Andrew Haines and Sir Peter Hendy, the organisation’s chairman and one of Boris Johnson’s key advisers.
The role that the private sector will play will be closely monitored by the rail industry amid fears that the proposed changes will stifle competition and lack incentives.
Rail bosses are worried that more radical changes could be watered down. “This could be a really big story or a complete catastrophe,” said one senior industry figure. “It all depends on the execution.”
Andrew Gilligan, the Prime Minister’s transport adviser, is understood to have rewritten large parts of the review in recent weeks.
The review has led to mounting tensions between the Department for Transport and the Treasury after a number of initial proposals were rejected because they were too expensive.
The coronavirus pandemic forced the Government to move rail operators onto emergency contracts that are similar to those being proposed by Mr Williams. Because taxpayers are exposed to “revenue risk”, the Government subsidy increases when passenger numbers are low.
The cost of propping up the railways and bailouts to London mayor Sadiq Khan to keep the Tube and bus services running topped £11bn, according to figures released by the Department for Transport last week.
 

YorksLad12

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That's always been a fly in the ointment, particularly going from somewhere more transport savvy like West Yorkshire, into the motor counties of East and North Yorkshire.

Some of these issues could be ameliorated by a National railcard type scheme.
Pedant's note: neither east nor north Yorkshire have or had PTEs, not being former Metropolitan counties.

Apart from that I absolutely agree that fares reform is important (and getting a bit off-topic). An Anytime Day Single from Leeds to Sheffield is £18.40; Leeds to York (half the time/distance) is £17. Sheffield is in a PTE area; York isn't.
 

furnessvale

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If track and (passenger) trains are to become parts of the same organisation, I worry that freight will revert to the cinderella position it was in under BR.
 

JaJaWa

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There's a new piece in the Sunday Times today, on flexible season tickets.
But it's behind a paywall, like yesterday's Times article, and I am unable to quote it.
In the visible bit, it says the new organisation is to be called "Great British Railways" (no doubt to match our Great British Pounds).
It also displays the old BR lion-and-wheel symbol (which predated the double arrow of the 1960s).
Again, it might all be fiction, and in any case it appears to be written from the viewpoint of a harassed commuter.
Flexible rail tickets won’t add value for travellers | News | The Sunday Times (thetimes.co.uk)

See below:
Flexible rail tickets won’t add value for travellers

May 16 2021, The Sunday Times
-methode-sundaytimes-prod-web-bin-3c32b636-b5a2-11eb-8f2a-87b6de480dfc.jpg
British Railways, as it was before it was privatised
ALAMY

Flexible season tickets to tempt people back on the railways next month will be no cheaper for many commuters than buying normal season tickets or paying for daily travel at full fare rates.

Grant Shapps, the transport secretary, is set to announce the launch of a new type of ticket for the era of hybrid working after June 21. Commuters will be offered a carnet of eight return journeys per month, with the option of buying more.

It will be one of the most eye-catching initiatives to coincide with the return of the railways to state control almost 30 years after they were privatised, with a new taxpayer-funded organisation called Great British Railways.

Track, timetables, ticketing and pricing will be run by Sir Peter Hendy, the chairman of Network Rail. He will be joined at the new arms-length body by Andrew Haines, his present chief executive.

Shapps has chosen a third way for the railways after the failure of both full-blown nationalisation, under British Rail, and privatisation. Since the start of the pandemic in March last year, taxpayers have been subsidising the network at a rate of about £800 million a month.

Control of the network and all the financial risk associated with running it will be assumed by the government and underwritten by the taxpayer. A white paper, to be published this week, will require train operating companies to sign concession agreements, committing them to meet targets for punctuality and cleanliness. This mirrors the set-up on the London Overground network, which ministers judge to have been a success.

The new flexi-season ticket system, which will be unveiled on Thursday, aims to adapt the railways to new forms of hybrid working by providing commuters with an extra option between paying for an unlimited travel season ticket or having to buy a separate ticket for every journey.

But costs are unlikely to fall for long-distance commutes because season-ticket holders currently pay for less than two days a week at full fare rates, leaving no room for a further significant discount.

For example, the price of a Bristol-London walk-up full fare peak return is £230, and a seven-day season ticket is £352, while Winchester-London is £76.80 for a daily full fare and £139.50 for a weekly. Weekly season ticket holders travelling from Coventry and Stowmarket to London, as well as from Newark to Newcastle, also pay for less than two days at full fare rates.

But for short to medium commutes, the flexi-season is likely to offer savings for those travelling two or three days a week. The biggest savings are likely to be on routes where weekly season ticket holders effectively pay for more than three days at full fare rates. This includes Stockport-Manchester, where the daily full fare is £6.70 and the weekly £24.20; Doncaster-Leeds where the daily costs £17.60 and the weekly £63.70, and Gloucester-Bristol, at £19 and £79.60.

In the home counties, there will also be attractive savings on the Woking-London line, where the daily costs £23.50 and the weekly £88.20, and Chelmsford-London, at £31.40 and £107.90.

Sir Michael Holden, former chairman of East Coast, said: “Abandoning fare reform is a huge missed opportunity, and will derail efforts to build back leisure and business customers.

“These things can be done either in the public or the private sector and can be made to work both ways. However, we risk losing the flair that the private sector can bring if used in the right way.”

The Department for Transport did not respond to a request for comment.

Additional reporting: Tom Calver
Source: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/flexible-rail-tickets-wont-add-value-for-travellers-8wjtb9ss8
 
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Annetts key

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Are heavy, slow freight services really a more profitable use of the capacity on our railways such that it would be worth shifting the balance? Given the intensive use of many parts of the network, you’d only get more freight on by cutting passenger services which won’t be popular.

For the parts of the network where no passenger trains run, the freight pays most, if not all of the cost of operating and maintaining the lines, plus the costs of renewals and improvements/expansion. Plus in some locations they pay Network Rail to operate and maintain some of the infrastructure on their private lines.

The arrangements between the freight operaters and Network Rail must be beneficial to both parties, because often the freight companies are reluctant to release train paths.

If track and (passenger) trains are to become parts of the same organisation, I worry that freight will revert to the cinderella position it was in under BR.
I remember sometime around the late 1980s when in the middle of the night, fourteen freight trains travelled through Bristol Parkway, following one another on the same line.

The biggest problems have been, and still are, fitting the freight trains in between passenger trains during the day, without disrupting the (normally faster) passenger trains or overly extending the time it takes for freight trains to travel between origin and destination (a ‘parked’ freight train in a loop or siding does not make any money). And the maintenance, renewals and projects parts of Network Rail (or their contractors) needing to do the work at night during the no booked passenger service period, but this being the exact same time period when it’s the best time to run lots of long distance freight trains...
 

Purple Orange

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As per the thread title, has “Great British Railways” been named as the new name for this body, or is it just an idea on the forum?
 

TT-ONR-NRN

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If you've been following Network Rail's chairman Sir Peter Hendy on Twitter over the past year, you'll be aware this is a throwback to BR in more ways than one... in terms of design he has even personally pushed for
  • a return of the BR "double arrows" symbol
  • black-on-white signage
  • and commissioned a new version of the "Rail Alphabet" typeface
This is even stated in the latest Network Rail design guidelines, which state that the BR symbol should replace the Network Rail symbol for public use.

Source: https://files.whatdotheyknow.com/request/request_for_updated_wayfinding_m/NR_GN_CIV_300_01.pdf
Looks horrifically dated
 

py_megapixel

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As per the thread title, has “Great British Railways” been named as the new name for this body, or is it just an idea on the forum?
I'm not sure, but I really hope it's the latter, just forum wibble. There's something so horribly arrogant about describing a country as broken as this one as "great".

Yes, I know it's the name of the island - but I've never heard anyone unironically describe themself as "Great British", and most previous nationalised industries have just been named "British X" or "National X", so the inclusion of "Great" here just seems stuck-up.
 
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