379 001 unveiled TODAY!

[fgwrich]

By the same logic you'd want more luggage for all Pendolinos because some of them serve Birmingham Airport.

Or Perhaps you'd like SWT To fit Luggage Racks to their 444 & 450 Fleet to, Just because that services Sotton Airport, With Bournemouth not too far away from Bournemouth aswell?

As for the units themselves...Dull Livery (least i won't be around for much longer) - With a BLACK Roof? Theyd better keep the Air Con working then!

Interior - Looks rather cramped with those wonderfully comfortable high back(Horrible!) seats used in Chilterns 165s,LOROLs 172s and Southerns Units...

Im intrigued by the purpose of the light fitted into the front cowling...Is that the light for Pigeons & Pheasants then?

http://thetottenhamflyer.fotopic.net/p67670946.html

http://thetottenhamflyer.fotopic.net/p67670951.html

Overall impressions...Another unexiting Electrostar family with a rather uninspiring livery & exterior...but at least itll provide Cambridge with more seats i suppose...But at the same time, For an Airport 'express'? Unit - Has rather dismally small luggage racks by the looks of your picture - far right on the interior picture! ->
http://thetottenhamflyer.fotopic.net/p67670950.html

Space for a Briefcase me thinks...but not a full blown, family on holiday suitcase...

 

[tbtc]

Or Perhaps you'd like SWT To fit Luggage Racks to their 444 & 450 Fleet to, Just because that services Sotton Airport, With Bournemouth not too far away from Bournemouth aswell?

Or fit luggage racks to the Middlebrough Pacers for the "one a week" train that stops at Teesside Airport?

 

[Crossforth]

I assume the 317s will remain with NXEA (or whoever runs the franchise in the near future)?

 

[swt_passenger]

I assume the 317s will remain with NXEA (or whoever runs the franchise in the near future)?

Correct - there is no outflow of units planned from NXEA. The introduction of the 17 x 321s and the 30 x 379s provides the '188 EMU vehicles' allocated by the DfT for the Greater Anglia network's HLOS capacity improvements, this was announced in the rolling stock plan of Jan 2008.

2. The One franchise would take on lease class 321 units cascaded from London Midland. In addition, the franchise would order new EMU vehicles for services on the West Anglia route to Stansted airport, in turn releasing Class 317 vehicles to provide more coaches on other services

All the displaced units such as Stansted 317s will be used on other suitable NXEA routes for service strengthening, this has been the intention all along, despite fairly regular attempts to confuse the situation in various rail forums...

 

[87015]

Correct - there is no outflow of units planned from NXEA. The introduction of the 17 x 321s and the 30 x 379s provides the '188 EMU vehicles' allocated by the DfT for the Greater Anglia network's HLOS capacity improvements, this was announced in the rolling stock plan of Jan 2008.

Has that been signed off by the DfT now then, as it wasn't a month ago?
The original GE/WA HLOS plans are long gone. Extra 317s not a great deal of good for WA as they are not being SDO fitted and the platform extensions are postponed indefinitely.

 

[O L Leigh]

Doesn't matter, as there are still plenty of WA services running as 4 cars when they really should be 8's. Top of the list are surely the Stratfords.

O L Leigh

 

[tbtc]

Doesn't matter, as there are still plenty of WA services running as 4 cars when they really should be 8's. Top of the list are surely the Stratfords.

O L Leigh

Is the Stratford - Stansted service that busy?

An interesting move, as it doesn't serve central London, so I didn't know what loadings were like on it

 

[O L Leigh]

They are in the peaks.

O L Leigh

 

[jon0844]

Given Bombardier's track record, I hope the train wasn't badly damaged when it went through the paper 'ribbon' in that video.

 

[Tottenham Flyer]

Doesn't matter, as there are still plenty of WA services running as 4 cars when they really should be 8's. Top of the list are surely the Stratfords.

O L Leigh

There are also a couple of Cambridge services at the start of the peak (1628 & 1643 that need to be 8) and the 1658 and 1858 Kings Lynn services that are also 4 cars that need to be 8.

As O L Leigh says, the Stratfords need to be 8 coaches too - definiately in the morning going to Stratford, and coming out of Stratford in the evening peak.

Then not forgetting all the other inner West Anglia services - there's still a few 4 coach services on the Enfield Town, Chingford and Cheshunt services.

 

[swt_passenger]

Has that been signed off by the DfT now then, as it wasn't a month ago?
The original GE/WA HLOS plans are long gone. Extra 317s not a great deal of good for WA as they are not being SDO fitted and the platform extensions are postponed indefinitely.

The fact that all the displaced units were staying with NXEA was confirmed by DfT well before the election.

I don't think anything has ever been officially published that went back on that decision. Yes, HLOS increases may be completely up in the air all over the rest of the country, but the numbers originally allocated to NXEA/Greater Anglia haven't changed.

The September 2010 update to the CP4 enhancement plan (published by NR last week) still shows 12 car operation of WA services, using 317s and 'new stock', in time for the Dec 2011 timetable.

Maybe they just haven't been keeping you fully updated with their plans...

 

[Tottenham Flyer]

I had heard from a driver (and please do not quote me on this) that fitting SDO to the 317's was going to cost in the region of £70,000 per unit, therefore that plan going straight out of the window.

 

[Goldfish62]

Interior - Looks rather cramped with those wonderfully comfortable high back(Horrible!) seats used in Chilterns 165s,LOROLs 172s and Southerns Units...

But I actually like the interior colour scheme, although I agree that the actual seats are awful. But it has proper 1st Class, with the same seats as FGW/GNER, unlike the apology for 1st Class in the Southern and SET Electrostars.

 

[Chris125]

... unlike the apology for 1st Class in the Southern and SET Electrostars.

Thats hardly fair - the quality of seating or ambience is irrelevant given the short distances involved and when you consider its competing with either having to stand or being squeezed into an overcrowded carriage. Cambridge/Stansted is a different market to the 3rd rail commuter belt.

Chris

 

[Goldfish62]

Thats hardly fair - the quality of seating or ambience is irrelevant given the short distances involved and when you consider its competing with either having to stand or being squeezed into an overcrowded carriage. Cambridge/Stansted is a different market to the 3rd rail commuter belt.

Chris

It's perfectly fair - you can't claim that journeys up to 2 hours are short. Moreover, people who pay to travel first class don't expect exactly the same seats as in standard class. How on earth can you claim that the quality of seating or ambience is irrelevant?

 

[First class]

I think Merseyrail have missed a good opportunity to tag on an order for 378/379s, (or some hybrid AC-DC unit).

I get the feeling Merseyrail are pretending this problem doesn't exist...

They will now have to get an entirely new production line open (at great expense) to design and build a completely new type of train.

 

[jopsuk]

378s would be more suitable than 379s for 507/508 replacement- though perhaps with an interior a bit more like the 376 (ie with transverse seating, whilst still high-density).

 

[387star]

I heard Southern 377 First Class sells because it guarantees a seat rather than the product being any different.

 

[87015]

The September 2010 update to the CP4 enhancement plan (published by NR last week) still shows 12 car operation of WA services, using 317s and 'new stock', in time for the Dec 2011 timetable.

I'll take said document (presuming I'm thinking of the same 100+ page job) with a pinch of salt as it still talks about 321s going to c2c though.

Seems a bit of a waste that they have to take the 379s half way across Europe and back again to test them though!

 

[90019]

Seems a bit of a waste that they have to take the 379s half way across Europe and back again to test them though!

But what was it they were testing there?
I'd like to know that before commenting that it should've been done here, for all we know, it may have been something that couldn't be done in the UK for whatever reason.

 

[Snapper]

Here's some more internal shots:

http://www.paulbigland.fotopic.net/p67677700.html

http://www.paulbigland.fotopic.net/p67672833.html

http://www.paulbigland.fotopic.net/p67672825.html

http://www.paulbigland.fotopic.net/p67672830.html

 

[ukrob]

I think Merseyrail have missed a good opportunity to tag on an order for 378/379s, (or some hybrid AC-DC unit).

I get the feeling Merseyrail are pretending this problem doesn't exist...

They will now have to get an entirely new production line open (at great expense) to design and build a completely new type of train.

378s would be more suitable than 379s for 507/508 replacement- though perhaps with an interior a bit more like the 376 (ie with transverse seating, whilst still high-density).

My preference would be for all units to be six car with wide gangways ala S Stock and Class 378 with a mixture of seating like the S stock.

Won't happen of course.

 

[Chris125]

It's perfectly fair - you can't claim that journeys up to 2 hours are short. Moreover, people who pay to travel first class don't expect exactly the same seats as in standard class. How on earth can you claim that the quality of seating or ambience is irrelevant?

They might be up to 2 hours but how many people do you see using 1st class for that long? I think ive only ever seen it used by commuters travelling relatively short distances who want to avoid the rush hour scrum, for which it is perfectly adequate. They could have nicer seats, which is always a good thing, but as seating comfort isnt the primary reason most people buy 1st class tickets on commuter trains i dont think it makes much difference.

Chris

 

[swt_passenger]

I'll take said document (presuming I'm thinking of the same 100+ page job) with a pinch of salt as it still talks about 321s going to c2c though.

I'm sure they'll be grateful if you point out the error.

Nevertheless, I've also found that during the NXEA boss's spiel at the 379 launch he also mentions 12 car operation on the WA routes; and that they are the only TOC to have had their HLOS capacity improvements agreed by DfT. It's on youtube somewhere...

 

[507 001]

My preference would be for all units to be six car with wide gangways ala S Stock and Class 378 with a mixture of seating like the S stock.

Won't happen of course.

A mixture of seating isnt necessary on merseyrail, the refurb 507/508's prove that, theres more than enough seating for most journeys.

6 car sets would be nice but again, unnecessary as most serices don't warrant it, only peak services, I would make more sense to have a mixture of 3 & 6 car sets.

Theres still a couple of years left in the 507's/508's, they aren't due off lease till 2013/2014 anyway so merseyrail will be wanting to get as much mileage out of them as possible.

Besides, I highly doubt that the electrostar/turbostar production line will be closed in 2013!

 

[ukrob]

A mixture of seating isnt necessary on merseyrail, the refurb 507/508's prove that, theres more than enough seating for most journeys.

6 car sets would be nice but again, unnecessary as most serices don't warrant it, only peak services, I would make more sense to have a mixture of 3 & 6 car sets.

Theres still a couple of years left in the 507's/508's, they aren't due off lease till 2013/2014 anyway so merseyrail will be wanting to get as much mileage out of them as possible.

Besides, I highly doubt that the electrostar/turbostar production line will be closed in 2013!

Like I said, it would be my preference and I know it will not happen.

I didn't say it would be the best solution

 

[fgwrich]

Given Bombardier's track record, I hope the train wasn't badly damaged when it went through the paper 'ribbon' in that video.

http://www.paulbigland.fotopic.net/p67672818.html

Thatll be 379001 out of use for several months for front end damage then!



http://www.paulbigland.fotopic.net/p67672830.html

I’m surprised with all these rules & regs these days that you can get away with Black buttons - with a silver centre...suppose though the Orange LEDs would make up for it though...

But i wish that in this day and age, designers would stop giving the appearance that the bin is an afterthought - Appearing in almost all the Electrostar’s, with this one being no exception - by sticking out into the vestibule - oh and as for the bin itself, all the finesse of a council park bin!

And why the short stretch of Lino in a sea of carpet? The lino may be seen to look nice but it just stands out as a pointless piece of design where the carpet could have just been fully used...

 

[jon0844]

I agree about the bin, but then I thought that on a lot of trains where bins are quite well hidden or 'part of the train' design, people may not use them because they don't see them.

Joe Public are probably used to those giant, horrid, eyesores - and they might just use them more often.

I am not basing this on any scientific survey, but then neither are they most likely!!

 

[wibble]

379 001 was unveiled today:

Photos here: http://thetottenhamflyer.fotopic.net/c1906590.html

Video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8YJBXAo2mA

Black roof? That's nice and energy efficient! Wouldn't want to be travelling on one of those on a hot sunny day!

 

[Aictos]

I'm sure they'll be grateful if you point out the error.

Nevertheless, I've also found that during the NXEA boss's spiel at the 379 launch he also mentions 12 car operation on the WA routes; and that they are the only TOC to have had their HLOS capacity improvements agreed by DfT. It's on youtube somewhere...

Well he's certainly wrong there in stating NXEA is the only TOC who has their HLOS improvements agreed by the DfT, FCC has also had their HLOS improvements signed off hence more then 6,500 extra seats will be available to passengers from the Dec 2010 timetable, this is on top of the 5,000 extra seats introduced in the May 2010 timetable.

Just thought I leave a correction!