Derailment at Kirkby (Merseyside) - 13/03/2021

[PeterStoba]

Just to confirm, no trains have reached Kirkby today, as mentioned earlier. The two freight movements were unaffected.

 

[Wezz]

Yes they'd almost certainly be D&A tested, as they would for any serious incident such as a spad, collision, derailment etc - it could be argued this incident was all three of those if you take the buffer stop to be a red aspect/end of movement authority.

If mechanical or electrical failure was suspected as the cause then the units would hopefully have been pulled from service for checks & repairs if necessary.

Let's just say enough is known to allow that decision to have been made.

021 has been pulled from service and is being examined at Birkenhead.

 

[hwl]

I can't imagine what the passengers must have thought when they saw that!

The leading coach at Kirkby was empty of passengers so I believe.

That is my understanding too...

 

[Llama]

021 has been pulled from service and is being examined at Birkenhead.

Yes, and rightly so. Plus, regardless of whether any fault is suspected or not, any traction unit or rolling stock that's been involved a collision would have to be inspected.

 

[38Cto15E]

In the past did not some terminal stations have rails which were covered with a zig zag type weld to assist stopping?

 

[Bletchleyite]

In the past did not some terminal stations have rails which were covered with a zig zag type weld to assist stopping?

Those are I believe to improve track circuit contact on rusty rails, not to aid stopping. I half recall Ormskirk had a sand drag at one point but I doubt it does much.

 

[Crossover]

In the past did not some terminal stations have rails which were covered with a zig zag type weld to assist stopping?

I believe "wiggly wire" is not for adhesion, but to ensure on lightly used tracks that detection on the signalling system is not lost

 

[weastebusdepot]

I also look in on some of Reach plc's other web sites Cornwall Live / Devon Live and they are also of poor quality.

Manchester Evening News is another title that was a trusted news source until Reach plc bought it a little over a decade ago. Now the stories carry a similar level of factual accuracy as Newsthump.

As for Tripcocks, although they are only used in the tunnel section, they remain active all the time. I was told that they are just the right height that it's not uncommon for a stray football kicked onto the railway to bring a train to an emergency stop. Hence the guards are trained how to reset if the rear one is activated (a manual process of opening a hatch and yanking a chain).

 

[mr_moo]

I believe "wiggly wire" is not for adhesion, but to ensure on lightly used tracks that detection on the signalling system is not lost

Yep - Exactly. Nothing to do with deceleration. Indeed it reduces the contact between wheel and rail and thus may have a very slight detrimental effect on braking performance. It's to concentrate the loads on the rail into a smaller area and thus break through any rust that may have formed, thus ensuring track circuits function reliably. Redundant where axle counters have taken over and was annoying to maintain, and made the rails more difficult to inspect too. Only used where needed!

 

[MarkyT]

I believe "wiggly wire" is not for adhesion, but to ensure on lightly used tracks that detection on the signalling system is not lost

Sometimes used to ensure reliable track circuit operation at emergency crossovers.

 

[mr_moo]

It's called a "eutectic strip". Full explanation here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/reason-for-wavy-line-on-track.66575/

 

[OneThirtyEight]

Those are I believe to improve track circuit contact on rusty rails, not to aid stopping. I half recall Ormskirk had a sand drag at one point but I doubt it does much.

An ECS ended up in the sand drag last year or the year before; first service of the morning. Braking as normal and it just went out from under him; guard and driver both put the emergency in. They rebuilt the sand drag.

 

[samrammstein]

37800 has gone to Liverpool Lime Street this evening, she's heading out to Kirkby in the morning to assist apparently.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/09722/2021-03-15/detailed

 

[yorkie]

A video has surfaced, found on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/KWTransportVids/status/1371550707124428801

Well then.. It appears 507006’s Kirkby Derailment footage has been found,...

....the unit was going at quite a bit of speed....

 

[Bletchleyite]

Crikey, that's a bit quick!

 

[M60lad]

What route will 37800 take to get to Kirkby tomorrow? I only ask as I'm not to sure whether there's a link to Kirkdale from Liverpool High Level and Edge Hill.

 

[Grumpy Git]

................. did you say we're non-stop to Wigan?

 

[ScotRail158725]

What route will 37800 take to get to Kirkby tomorrow? I only ask as I'm not to sure whether there's a link to Kirkdale from Liverpool High Level and Edge Hill.

Only route i see is left before Wavertree technology park, round the line that goes round Liverpool under Kirkdale depot and joins the South line then reverse down to Sandhills then back up to Kirkby that way

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Buffer stop light(s) appear to have been illuminated prior to being impacted in the video clip posted just now by @yorkie in the weblink accessible via post #254.

Train comes to a stop about three carriage lengths beyond where the buffer stop previously was (!)

Can anyone estimate an approximate "impact speed" based on the time taken for one or more carriages to pass a fixed point on the platform (assuming the footage hasn't been speeded up)?

Amazing that no-one was too badly injured by this.

 

[The Planner]

That video won't be up there long based on the fact the BTP are asking if they have permission....

 

[M60lad]

Tweet/Video already been took down, just checked.

 

[Bletchleyite]

That video won't be up there long based on the fact the BTP are asking if they have permission....

Precisely what permission does one need to publish a video taken from a public place (it's from a road bridge, isn't it?) And "outdoor leisure" is permitted now, which would include videography. So I don't see anything at all to get them on.

Appears it's leaked CCTV, apologies to the BTP in this instance.

 

[plugwash]

Only route i see is left before Wavertree technology park, round the line that goes round Liverpool under Kirkdale depot and joins the South line then reverse down to Sandhills then back up to Kirkby that way

The other option would presumably be to reverse at southport and sandhills, this would avoid the need to take a diesel loco into the tunnels.

 

[ainsworth74]

That video won't be up there long based on the fact the BTP are asking if they have permission....

Aaand it's gone!

 

[Grumpy Git]

The other option would presumably be to reverse at southport and sandhills, this would avoid the need to take a diesel loco into the tunnels.

Be great to hear a 37 going through Cressington though.

 

[stuart100100]

Precisely what permission does one need to publish a video taken from a public place (it's from a road bridge, isn't it?) And "outdoor leisure" is permitted now, which would include videography. So I don't see anything at all to get them on.

Sounds like another case of the Police exceeding their authority because they happen not to like something. They seem to be developing quite an aptitude for that at the moment.

Looked more like CCTV footage

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Can anyone estimate an approximate "impact speed" based on the time taken for one or more carriages to pass a fixed point on the platform (assuming the footage hasn't been speeded up)?

My calculation as follows...

Three carriage lengths = 3 x 20 metres = 60 metres.

If they pass a fixed point in 5 seconds, that's 12 x 60 = 720 metres a minute.

Or approximately 43 kph, which is about 26 mph.

All approximately, of course.

 

[Trackman]

Crikey, that's a bit quick!

It is, if that is real-time which I guess it is.
Makes me think if the passengers were forewarned as I guess many of them would be heading towards the doors.

Tweet/Video already been took down, just checked.

I still had my twitter window open, managed to save the video.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Looked more like CCTV footage

Ah, I assumed someone had filmed it on their phone. If it was leaked CCTV the BTP probably have a point. There indeed doesn't seem to be anywhere it could have been filmed from manually that would have given the perspective shown.

 

[Bertie the bus]

Ah, I assumed someone had filmed it on their phone. If it was leaked CCTV the BTP probably have a point. There indeed doesn't seem to be anywhere it could have been filmed from manually that would have given the perspective shown.

Definitely CCTV. The camera didn't move at all and it's fair to say most people would have made some movement if they had witnessed that.