Not sure what is stopping them to be honest - a colleague flew out recently for a number of weeks out of the country (was just subject to a negative test before flying)
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Lockdown in England from Thursday 5 November until Wednesday 2 December
- Thread starter big_rig
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
Restaurants and cafes were allowed to sell for takeaway from day 1 of the first lockdown, it's just that not many did. See 4 (a) (i) of the original regulations, with the right to travel to access such businesses then covered by 6 (2) (a) as supported by the College of Policing guidance to officers: "food could include hot food from takeaways" (the original PDF has been deleted but those are screenshots from it). My local Pret a Manger had certainly reopened by early April despite no relevant changes to the law. I do agree it's more explicit this time with an explicit exemption but would argue that is more related to public attitudes.
Another factor last time is that takeaways etc needed time to set up distancing arrangements etc in their preparation / cooking areas.
bramling
Veteran Member
It’s patently obvious many people aren’t complying. To be fair at the start of the March lockdown there was more stuff closed, for example garden centres.
Yet according to a poll in my local paper, something like 67% (I forget the exact figure but it was along those lines) not only support restrictions, but think there should be *more*.
There seems to be quite a disconnect between what people claim should be happening, and what they’re actually themselves doing. Or, more cynically, lockdown is a good thing as long as it applies to *others*!
I wonder how many of these lockdown ehthusiasts would be surprised if their actions are pointed out to them as not really complying, either with the spirit or letter of the law? Quite a few, I suspect!
As you say, while people might say they are in favour of it, it's quite clear from the actions of a large part of the population that a lot more than 67% are not really going along with it in practice.
bramling
Veteran Member
I do think that a fair part of the 67% figure is the work-from-homes, who have a real vested interest in wanting this to last as long as possible. I’m not sure this applies to the furlough types so much now as surely they must be realising how damaging this may be to them?
The rest would presumably be made up partly of people who don’t want to admit to being a granny killer, which then leaves a subset who actually do properly buy-in to restrictions. Once the first two groups are taken out of the equation it must leave considerably less than 67%.
I certainly would have to try quite hard to find people in my work who are supportive of all this, though there’s some who are a bit sick of the above hypocrisy and would like to see the 67% actually abide by what they seem to want to foist on to others...
When asked what those restrictions should be, a fairly large number respond that schools should be closed. This is an incredibly divisive issue and unless there are bodies piling up in the streets it is absolutely a non-starter and no political party is supporting it, except a subset of the far-left.
As for things like open-air recreation, meeting a friend outdoors and a linked household for people living alone, I think people forget that permitting things actually improves overall compliance. If these things were prohibited people would lose respect for the rules and stop complying with the lot of them.
There is a very small group of people who think we should ban exercise entirely which is astonishing to me. There is another view that exercise should only be permitted to and from one's place of residence, alongside threats of closing parks, which is fine if you live in the countryside (or maybe even Central London) but truly miserable for anyone who lives without nearby access to large green space. It can be done but the amount of exercise people take would fall dramatically.
That seems to be happening anyway!
A colleague took a phone call from his daughter's school this morning to say that she was being sent home and would have to isolate for a fortnight, for the second time in a month. She'll have had four days' schooling in five weeks.
Ian Cunningham
Member
The SNP MPs did not take part in that vote - there were 95 abstentions in total
SNP MPs at Westminster do not vote on issues that are not relevant to Scotland, a lockdown in England being a good example..
That's in regards to arrangements at Christmas and a potential easing of restrictions for some period over Christmas. The general restrictions remain devolved matters (as do those for Christmas if a deal cannot be struck).
Sturgeon's main aim in life is independence and she is trying to use the pandemic to increase the chances of that.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
This will be people who don't take any exercise, the same as the people who are not social who are always shouting for pubs to be shut.
== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==
She could not care less as long as she gets her beloved independence.
Last edited:
Just to remind everyone that this thread is about the English lockdown, and the discussion around restrictions in Scotland is here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/new-scottish-covid-19-restrictions-07-10-2020.209983/
I'm probably not typical but comparing nearly three weeks from 5th November to the weeks before if I did not know about the change from the tier system to Lockdown 2 it would not be blatantly obvious. Where I live was tier 1, but almost certainly would have moved to tier 2, and where I work was tier 2.
There has been no drop in traffic, indeed w/c 9th November seemed busier. For my weekly shop supermarkets were essentially the same, last week perhaps busier. The few non food / convenience shops e.g. hairdresser and beautician I drive past having the shutters down is one difference and the gym / fitness centre adjacent to where I work closed is another. All the companies we work with and deliveries from suppliers are unchanged. My car service including collection & delivery booked before the lockdown was announced went ahead unchanged.
My colleagues have generally said the shops that were open are busier so potentially more risk of transmission compared to if people had been spread around more shops. Also some individual rather than chain closed shops being creative with almost instant click/text/phone-and-collect. Rather different to spring where generally people were minimising shopping and many non-essential were items almost impossible to buy except mail order.
Calling this Lockdown 0.5 or even 0.25 would be more appropriate. Christmas will distort the figures but I question if overall much has been gained particularly against if like the area where I live others had moved up a tier. As to losses it will have pushed some retail, personal services and hospitality businesses over the point of no return.
There has been no drop in traffic, indeed w/c 9th November seemed busier. For my weekly shop supermarkets were essentially the same, last week perhaps busier. The few non food / convenience shops e.g. hairdresser and beautician I drive past having the shutters down is one difference and the gym / fitness centre adjacent to where I work closed is another. All the companies we work with and deliveries from suppliers are unchanged. My car service including collection & delivery booked before the lockdown was announced went ahead unchanged.
My colleagues have generally said the shops that were open are busier so potentially more risk of transmission compared to if people had been spread around more shops. Also some individual rather than chain closed shops being creative with almost instant click/text/phone-and-collect. Rather different to spring where generally people were minimising shopping and many non-essential were items almost impossible to buy except mail order.
Calling this Lockdown 0.5 or even 0.25 would be more appropriate. Christmas will distort the figures but I question if overall much has been gained particularly against if like the area where I live others had moved up a tier. As to losses it will have pushed some retail, personal services and hospitality businesses over the point of no return.
A very common psychological situation in this country; its seen in elections time and time again and also when people lament the media for publishing scandals, then newspaper sales showing a sustained rise. And an extension of the NIMBY culture.
Many are in favour of some abstract policy until they're personally affected.
Merle Haggard
Established Member
Their policy must have changed then, because I have a distinct recollection that the S.N.P. voted in favour of Tuition Fees in England.
They voted against actually. But that is all in the past as Parliament approved procedures in 2015 barring Scottish and NI MPs from voting on solely English & Welsh matters. Likewise English MPs are not allowed to vote on devolved matters. The Speaker is the arbiter.
Merle Haggard
Established Member
Thank you, I had relied on (I thought, adult) media reporting at the time, which had even gone so far as to suggest that the motive was to manipulate the Barnett formula favourably to Scotland. I also hadn't realised that a form of English Votes for English Laws legislation had, eventually, been introduced - the reverse (English MPs on devolved matters), I thought, dated back to devolution. Media reporting of politics is unreliable and patchy.
TheyWorkForUs is an interesting website, and looking at the voting record of Rt. Hon. I. Blackford (the SNP leader in the HoC) suggests that this might not always apply, at least in respect of Welsh-only devolution matters - perhaps the justification is the subject having a tangential relationship to Scottish devolution.
However, although interesting and informative, now well off topic...
I travelled into two Tier 3 areas just before the current lockdown started, on the Saturday before, I spent the afternoon shopping in Leicester, then on the day before lockdown I visited Meadowhall and Sheffield City Centre. On both occasions, apart from mask wearing, it was pretty much business as usual, the fact that Sheffield had just been elevated to Tier 3 was not obvious in the slightest.
When this lockdown ends next week, I expect just about everyone will carry on as before, I certainly intend to.
When this lockdown ends next week, I expect just about everyone will carry on as before, I certainly intend to.
_toommm_
Established Member
I went through Sheffield today and it was like any Wednesday afternoon. I used the new X57 from Sheffield to Manchester and it was nice to see people still using public transport for exercise.
- Status