Further Restrictions Announced by Johnson (22/09)

[DB]

If they do try to ban household mixing in any indoor setting I can see it being widely ignored. Winter is coming, people cannot meet up outside much, and many are already utterly sick of the current level of restrictions, without even more being added.

 

[bramling]

If they do try to ban household mixing in any indoor setting I can see it being widely ignored. Winter is coming, people cannot meet up outside much, and many are already utterly sick of the current level of restrictions, without even more being added.

It will simply mean many will ignore it, which in turn will lead to more snitching. So cohesion goes even further down the toilet than it already has, and making civil disobedience more and more likely.

 

[island]

In all seriousness, how does Laura K know about this stuff? Maybe Cummings-esque "leaks" are acceptable in normal times, but in times like this it's more like a security breach.

Off-the-record/background briefings are commonplace in politics

 

[Trackman]

Off-the-record/background briefings are commonplace in politics

And sometimes to soften the blow if it's big news.

 

[adc82140]

It'll be an announcement of the traffic light system, with rationalisation of the rules in the North, complete with the same pub rules that Scotland has introduced.

It won't be any form of stay at home order or travel restriction (beyond "advice") no matter how the Daily Express dress it up.

 

[Bantamzen]

Well if it turns out that us unclean Northerners aren't allowed to go out eating or drinking, then there's not much point in this NHS app anymore, we may as well all delete it?

 

[Crossover]

Well if it turns out that us unclean Northerners aren't allowed to go out eating or drinking, then there's not much point in this NHS app anymore, we may as well all delete it?

Well, it would take the pressure off Excel a little bit

 

[yorksrob]

Yes, this system is very likely to be announced. But it's not clear what the 'red' will mean. Let's hope our backbench MPs - and more to the point the opposition (who are incredibly inept right now) - actually have the cajones to stand up to some of the more hard line ideas.

I wouldn't bank on the opposition. Worse than the Tories in all this.

 

[Andyh82]

It'll be an announcement of the traffic light system, with rationalisation of the rules in the North, complete with the same pub rules that Scotland has introduced.

It won't be any form of stay at home order or travel restriction (beyond "advice") no matter how the Daily Express dress it up.

And it’s also the Express not Laura who has billed it an ‘address to the nation’ to make it sound even more dramatic

In reality it’ll be a press conference, he’s already said they will start appearing semi regularly

He’ll no doubt be watching on how much of a negative response the Scotland measures get

 

[NorthOxonian]

I wouldn't bank on the opposition. Worse than the Tories in all this.

Keir Starmer has begun to make noises at PMQs that he doesn't like the direction of travel. Is this what he genuinely believes, what he will do to make himself popular, or just meaningless words? Probably a bit of all three, but his approach is certainly worse watching.

The way the other opposition parties behave will also be interesting - the Lib Dems entirely opposed the renewal of the Coronavirus Act, as did the Greens (though on technicalities). They aren't a large minority but they can be vocal.

 

[yorksrob]

Keir Starmer has begun to make noises at PMQs that he doesn't like the direction of travel. Is this what he genuinely believes, what he will do to make himself popular, or just meaningless words? Probably a bit of all three, but his approach is certainly worse watching.

The way the other opposition parties behave will also be interesting - the Lib Dems entirely opposed the renewal of the Coronavirus Act, as did the Greens (though on technicalities). They aren't a large minority but they can be vocal.

If true, Kier Starmer would need to rein in his regional colleagues. Although to be fair, Andy Burnham has been more critical of the imposition of lockdown measures in recent weeks.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If true, Kier Starmer would need to rein in his regional colleagues. Although to be fair, Andy Burnham has been more critical of the imposition of lockdown measures in recent weeks.

I think what Burnham opposes is lockdown without funding for the affected businesses. I reckon he'd support full lockdown if furlough was continued.

 

[yorksrob]

I think what Burnham opposes is lockdown without funding for the affected businesses. I reckon he'd support full lockdown if furlough was continued.

There is that danger. But at least with some support, the hospitality industry might return some day.

 

[bramling]

I wouldn't bank on the opposition. Worse than the Tories in all this.

I’m sensing there has been a bit of a shift from the left side of the political spectrum. Firstly we’ve seen Sturgeon openly talking about the economy (I thought she looked very under the weather today, the whole thing is clearly starting to seriously get to her now).

But quite a few left-of-centre commentators are starting to ask questions now, whereas until now it’s fair to say the general view has been “lives before money”. It won’t take too much longer for the Kevin Maguires of this world to be on a not massively different trajectory to Peter Hitchens.

Perhaps this is partly because many of these restrictions seem to be affecting northern areas (I think I’m right in saying the only place in southern England which has had local restrictions has been Luton?), and perhaps there’s also an increasing realisation that - bluntly - the economic impacts are likely to disproportionately fall on poorer people than your stereotypical Home Counties work-from-homer with a garden.

If all the above manages to merge with the already agitating Conservative backbenchers (remember there’s now two different strands of agitation there - growing nerves about the restrictions, and a growing dissatisfaction of Johnson’s leadership ability), this could start to turn the tide.

Alternatively we could see civil disobedience, perhaps spurred by job losses, or perhaps a high profile incident like police shutting down a child’s birthday party, or perhaps masks mandated outdoors.

This time last year who would have thought we’d be here now...

 

[C J Snarzell]

Tonight's news about Boris Johnson's two week mini lockdown is another blow yet again to the licencing industry.

Earlier today, Green King announced the closure of 79 pubs with 5000 job loses. It is a real kick in the teeth yet again to the hospitality industry.

Boris Johnson seems to be turning more into a dictator now rather than a elected leader. Maybe, I've missed the point here, but if Boris closes the pubs, people will then revert to partying indoors and ignore any household rules. The police won't enforce anything because they are far too overwhelmed already.

All Boris is doing is putting yet more nails in the coffin lid and increasing the unemployment levels further. He is not solving anything here - yet again its all about the virus with huge problems being created elsewhere and basically ignored.

My dad said today - 2020 is the year we fought a virus, 2021 is the year we will fight a new greater depression not seen since the 1930s. This could have been avoided if the government had made better decisions to protect our economy and not be 100% focused on this virus.

Tonights news implies BJ is plunging us all deeper into an abyss that we will probably not resurface from for years to come.

CJ

 

[Howardh]

The pubs provide vital tax income to keep ths schools and hospitals running.
They want to shut the pubs down because they think it's causing the increase in cases - despite the lack of statistics to back this up.
If pubs shut, schools, colleges and workplaces will remain open, the breeding ground for coronavirus, and the kids simply take it home with them, unknowingly and unwittingly.
So the case numbers and hospitalisations will increase and increase until somone high up twigs that it's not the hospitality industry after all.
So all that (a) tax revenue lost and (b) money spent on furlough has been totally wasted.

But hey, why should I care? I will travel to *open* parts of the country if the restriction on travel is "advice"; and if I don't travel I'll stay at home with a four-pack, and drink far more than I would if the pubs are open.
Then get diabetes, swollen liver, require hospital treatment, maybe an operation, early alzhiemer's, stress on public services.......

Luckily; the majority of readers in the comments in the Daily Mail - the Tory Membership Card - are up in arms. never tought I'd thank Daily Mail readers for saving my sanity.

 

[bramling]

The pubs provide vital tax income to keep ths schools and hospitals running.
They want to shut the pubs down because they think it's causing the increase in cases - despite the lack of statistics to back this up.
If pubs shut, schools, colleges and workplaces will remain open, the breeding ground for coronavirus, and the kids simply take it home with them, unknowingly and unwittingly.
So the case numbers and hospitalisations will increase and increase until somone high up twigs that it's not the hospitality industry after all.
So all that (a) tax revenue lost and (b) money spent on furlough has been totally wasted.

But hey, why should I care? I will travel to *open* parts of the country if the restriction on travel is "advice"; and if I don't travel I'll stay at home with a four-pack, and drink far more than I would if the pubs are open.
Then get diabetes, swollen liver, require hospital treatment, maybe an operation, early alzhiemer's, stress on public services.......

Luckily; the majority of readers in the comments in the Daily Mail - the Tory Membership Card - are up in arms. never tought I'd thank Daily Mail readers for saving my sanity.

There is a certain irony that it could be the ERG which kills off Johnson!

But, seriously, the tide is turning fast now. The media is changing tune fast, the newspapers already have, and in particular the left too.

 

[DustyBin]

Tonight's news about Boris Johnson's two week mini lockdown is another blow yet again to the licencing industry.

Earlier today, Green King announced the closure of 79 pubs with 5000 job loses. It is a real kick in the teeth yet again to the hospitality industry.

Boris Johnson seems to be turning more into a dictator now rather than a elected leader. Maybe, I've missed the point here, but if Boris closes the pubs, people will then revert to partying indoors and ignore any household rules. The police won't enforce anything because they are far too overwhelmed already.

All Boris is doing is putting yet more nails in the coffin lid and increasing the unemployment levels further. He is not solving anything here - yet again its all about the virus with huge problems being created elsewhere and basically ignored.

My dad said today - 2020 is the year we fought a virus, 2021 is the year we will fight a new greater depression not seen since the 1930s. This could have been avoided if the government had made better decisions to protect our economy and not be 100% focused on this virus.

Tonights news implies BJ is plunging us all deeper into an abyss that we will probably not resurface from for years to come.

CJ

The Greene King announcement is one of the two I said were coming a few days ago (sorry I can’t remember which thread it was). I believe it’s 800 jobs, still horrific though. I can’t overstate the problems facing the hospitality industry. The initial requirements regarding social distancing and providing a ‘Covid secure’ (I hate that term!) environment weren't actually too disastrous, and a significant number of businesses actually saw trade increase as a result of people quite liking things such as table service. However, subsequent measures, specifically the 10pm curfew and requirement to wear a mask when not seated, as well as the enhanced local restrictions have been devastating. The hospitality industry is very very close to becoming non-viable. Even if you’ve no interest in pubs, and don’t like eating out, this should be of concern if only due to the importance of the sector to the wider economy. Transmission of the virus within hospitality settings is believed to account for no more than 5% of the total incidentally.....

 

[STINT47]

If I was a newly elected Tory MP in the north's so called red wall I would be getting seriously worried now.

Far from leveling up, the gap between north and south is getting wider. Many areas have had local lockdowns for over two months and the jobs market is collapsing, which all takes a toll on physical and mental health.

If you then compare it to southern areas and many will feel that whilst we are all in the storm of covid we are not all in the same ship.

Tory MP's should take note when voting on restrictions or the north will turn red again

 

[BJames]

If they do try to ban household mixing in any indoor setting I can see it being widely ignored. Winter is coming, people cannot meet up outside much, and many are already utterly sick of the current level of restrictions, without even more being added.

I will be honest and say that I do not intend to follow this restriction (which I am anticipating to come into my area tomorrow or the following day - the "guidance" at the moment is to not mix). To be frank, our household has just had coronavirus as have half of the student area. And before anyone says "but that's selfish" or "that's not fair" - I refer you to the study that came out yesterday from Harvard/Oxford professors suggesting herd immunity amongst students. That's what will happen in our student area yet they will still expect us to follow the same rules to "stop the spread of the virus" that there is no risk we will spread!

 

[Bantamzen]

Well, it would take the pressure off Excel a little bit

Ha ha! I hadn't thought of that, although the bad person inside of me is now wondering about scanning loads of QR codes everyday to help swell those CSV files and give Excel hell!

Luckily; the majority of readers in the comments in the Daily Mail - the Tory Membership Card - are up in arms. never tought I'd thank Daily Mail readers for saving my sanity.

I found myself agreeing with Piers Morgan yesterday when he challenged ministers on the need to care for both covid & non-covid patients instead of throwing all resources at the former.

The Greene King announcement is one of the two I said were coming a few days ago (sorry I can’t remember which thread it was). I believe it’s 800 jobs, still horrific though. I can’t overstate the problems facing the hospitality industry. The initial requirements regarding social distancing and providing a ‘Covid secure’ (I hate that term!) environment weren't actually too disastrous, and a significant number of businesses actually saw trade increase as a result of people quite liking things such as table service. However, subsequent measures, specifically the 10pm curfew and requirement to wear a mask when not seated, as well as the enhanced local restrictions have been devastating. The hospitality industry is very very close to becoming non-viable. Even if you’ve no interest in pubs, and don’t like eating out, this should be of concern if only due to the importance of the sector to the wider economy. Transmission of the virus within hospitality settings is believed to account for no more than 5% of the total incidentally.....

I've now visited quite a few pubs and restaurants since reopening, and initially they seemed to be improving in numbers. But as soon as the first new set of restrictions kicked back in for the North of England, it was quite noticeable how numbers started to fall away. One of my locals (a Greene King BTW) relies a lot on people just fancying a pint, or people coming off the moors after a walk for some lunch and a pint. But with reduced indoor capacity, it literally can be "full" with just a dozen or so people now if they were all on their own. So locals have started to abandon it in droves, and with the worsening weather casual walker numbers are falling off. Basically they are stuck between a rock and a hard place, they are unable to proper cater of the locals popping by for a chat or to watch the racing, but are seeing the remainder of their customer base simply not going out any more. And I'm sure other pubs will be seeing exactly the same, hell I've been to four Whetherspoons in the area in the last few weeks and all of them were much quieter than they usually would be & far from full, and this despite all the offers they are chucking out at them all.

Some might argue that these pubs will have to adapt, but for many that's just not possible. For example whilst they have increased outside seating capacity, and provided a canopy & heaters, we are talking about a pub at the start of some extensive moorland, which is pretty exposed to the elements. And whilst we Yorkshire folk are a hardy breed, even we don't fancy a few hours sat in howling gales and freezing temperatures for any longer than we have to. As for the idea of take-outs, well there is a Co-op located directly behind open from 7 to 10 every day save Sunday, so yeah that'll work.

You make a very good point at the end there too, even for people who don't go to pubs or eat out often, these kinds of measures should be of concern. Not only do pubs offer a socialisation network, they employ local people, they are the end of a complex chain of businesses that supply them, who may also in some cases employ local people, and of course they generate tax revenue that helps support our essential services. If this all starts to collapse, a lot more jobs will be lost, livelihoods destroyed, and less money will flow which could and most probably would have a knock-on effect on the NHS.

 

[C J Snarzell]

Even the BBC seems to be turning against Boris and the government now. The fact the BBC have relocated alot of their operations from London to Manchester, at least re-enforces to the Beeb the issue of the great divide between North & South. Auntie are starting to realise the impact BJ actions are having and they too are now taking a defiant attitude.

 

[DustyBin]

All very predictable unfortunately:

Boris Johnson to impose tougher lockdown measures on north next week

Manchester, Liverpool and Newcastle - three cities which have continued to see infection rises despite local lockdowns - will all be plunged into the Tier Three lockdown, reports The Sun.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Ten million people living in the North of England are to be hit with tougher lockdown restrictions, including the closure of pubs and restaurants, from Monday in a bid to bring spiralling coronavirus infection figures under control, according to reports.

At what point will people say enough is enough? A month ago I wasn’t particularly worried about losing my job but I am now, this is becoming an all-out assault on the hospitality sector and economy in general. I’m sure there are those who think I’m being selfish, but like millions of people in the same position (or worse) I need an income to pay bills and actually enjoy life. What on earth are they playing at?

 

[Andyh82]

The BBC are just trying to push the story along, it doesn’t matter in which way, they’ve just exhausted the story of universities

They will push for a change one day and then when it gets announced run a story pushing the other way the day after

 

[C J Snarzell]

All very predictable unfortunately:

Boris Johnson to impose tougher lockdown measures on north next week

Manchester, Liverpool and Newcastle - three cities which have continued to see infection rises despite local lockdowns - will all be plunged into the Tier Three lockdown, reports The Sun.

www.dailymail.co.uk

At what point will people say enough is enough? A month ago I wasn’t particularly worried about losing my job but I am now, this is becoming an all-out assault on the hospitality sector and economy in general. I’m sure there are those who think I’m being selfish, but like millions of people in the same position (or worse) I need an income to pay bills and actually enjoy life. What on earth are they playing at?

All I will say is - its all revolving around spiralling infection rates NOT death rates.

This is where I fail to understand the government madness.

The whole agenda of lockdown in March was to avoid deaths - save lives, but very few people now are dying of this disease.

If you get the virus, you maybe have a few days of feeling under the weather before getting back on the saddle again.

I simply cannot understand the rational here anymore. If few people are dying of this now - just what is the issue?

CJ

 

[kristiang85]

I found myself agreeing with Piers Morgan yesterday when he challenged ministers on the need to care for both covid & non-covid patients instead of throwing all resources at the former.

Piers Morgan has been one of the most irritatingly vocal advocates for stringent lockdown and anti COVID measures - so if he's changed his tune (and he's a stubborn git at the best of times), then the tide really is turning.

 

[Bantamzen]

Piers Morgan has been one of the most irritatingly vocal advocates for stringent lockdown and anti COVID measures - so if he's changed his tune (and he's a stubborn git at the best of times), then the tide really is turning.

He was still generally shouting in favour, but he does at least seem to have come to the realisation that lockdowns do actually have an effect on his viewers / readers, so maybe he is instigating a tactical retreat?

 

[Furrball]

...
You make a very good point at the end there too, even for people who don't go to pubs or eat out often, these kinds of measures should be of concern. Not only do pubs offer a socialisation network, they employ local people, they are the end of a complex chain of businesses that supply them, who may also in some cases employ local people, and of course they generate tax revenue that helps support our essential services. If this all starts to collapse, a lot more jobs will be lost, livelihoods destroyed, and less money will flow which could and most probably would have a knock-on effect on the NHS.

EXACTLY!

Thousands of people involved in the production, distribution and general supply chain + millions of pounds of stock that will be destroyed

 

[Solent&Wessex]

But hey, why should I care? I will travel to *open* parts of the country if the restriction on travel is "advice"; and if I don't travel I'll stay at home with a four-pack, and drink far more than I would if the pubs are open.
Then get diabetes, swollen liver, require hospital treatment, maybe an operation, early alzhiemer's, stress on public services.......

Luckily; the majority of readers in the comments in the Daily Mail - the Tory Membership Card - are up in arms. never tought I'd thank Daily Mail readers for saving my sanity.

The BBC is now reporting on the TV that the new restrictions are likely to include a ban on travel and overnight stays away from home in certain areas.

Not saying whether this is likely in only "Tier 3" areas or more widely.

 

[Howardh]

Last night I was in one of the more down-trodden pubs in the centre of Bolton. The minute I walked in I was asked to put a mask on, was invited to have my name/number taken, chose a seat and they came to me with my beer and card reader. There was one group close together, but I know them as a group of mates anyway, and when they spoke to me they wore masks and kept distant.

If I wanted to catch CV, I think the only way to get it from that pub would eb to lick the carpet!! But they will eb forced to close despite doing everything right. And the net result will be...cases still on the up.