Northern Pacer Withdrawals - Info?

[Neptune]

As a matter of interest, if you can drive a 142, can you drive a 144 without additional training?

No due to the completely different cab layouts.

 

[_toommm_]

No due to the completely different cab layouts.

I believe that was the rationale behind keeping the 142s specifically longer as they're signed by more crews.

 

[175mph]

Or South Yorkshire, as that's where the 144s will be kept into the New Year, and beyond.

Does this mean I'll still be able to ride a pacer train on the Scunthorpe to Doncaster 'stopper' services a little while into next year?

 

[Llama]

There are a few differences to various systems between 142/144 units and a conversion course is needed from 142-144 because they are a separate class of unit. There are a couple of extra warning lights/switches in the cab whose function needs explaining. The layout of the cabs and all the equipment therein is the biggest physical difference between the units. The fire system is slightly different as is the pneumatic system, the miniature circuit breakers protect some different things and their effects on certain systems when tripped differ. The end lighting is wired up differently (not possible to use marker lights only on a 144 affecting depot working regs) and the middle car has a couple of equipment cupboards which need explaining and understanding - one contains miniature circuit breakers, the other contains mainly air-system equipment (parking brake application cock, brake cylinder gauge, low main air protection system).

 

[IamTrainsYT]

Do we recon there will be any more pacer scrap moves before the new year ? Can't see any paths in for next week yet maybe Kingsbury and Newport are shut for Xmas now

Monday there will be a holbeck to gascoigne Wood, nothing for scrap I don’t think

 

[ABB125]

Good evening,

Apologies if this has been asked before, but what routes in the Cheshire Day Ranger area (see map below) are still pacer-operated, and will be on Monday 30th DEC?

Map

Off the top of my head, I'm thinking:

• CLC stoppers
• Manchester-Rose Hill/New Mills (Central)
• Manchester-Chester (via Altrincham)
• Manchester-Buxton

Are there any diagrams on the Leeds-Chester service?

Many thanks (and apologies if there is a better thread for this information).

 

[trainmania100]

Monday there will be a holbeck to gascoigne Wood, nothing for scrap I don’t think

Cheers, guessing 021, 026 and 060 on the move
https://live.rail-record.co.uk/train?c=K06016&d=23/12/2019

 

[1D53]

Good evening,

Apologies if this has been asked before, but what routes in the Cheshire Day Ranger area (see map below) are still pacer-operated, and will be on Monday 30th DEC?

Map

Off the top of my head, I'm thinking:

• CLC stoppers
• Manchester-Rose Hill/New Mills (Central)
• Manchester-Chester (via Altrincham)
• Manchester-Buxton

Are there any diagrams on the Leeds-Chester service?

Many thanks (and apologies if there is a better thread for this information).

In that area pretty just Marple/Rose Hill.

 

[darylyates17]

Are any 144s likely to be around Leeds tomorrow? I want to ride on one before they go I will hopefully nip to Cardiff in the new year too to get a 143 before they go.

 

[IamTrainsYT]

In that area pretty just Marple/Rose Hill.

The new mills central trains are also 142s although now they have become 2 coaches they tend to be sprinters now

 

[IamTrainsYT]

Are any 144s likely to be around Leeds tomorrow? I want to ride on one before they go I will hopefully nip to Cardiff in the new year too to get a 143 before they go.

There should be lots

 

[J-2739]

Northern have said that the hope valley line will be the last place for pacers (in February)

Maybe for the 142s, but won't they still clutch onto the 144s a little longer?

Does this mean I'll still be able to ride a pacer train on the Scunthorpe to Doncaster 'stopper' services a little while into next year?

I'm not sure of that. Class 144s are used on this route, are they not? If so, then you might have a chance, but I'm don't know when Northern are ridding themselves of the last of the 144s.

Are any 144s likely to be around Leeds tomorrow? I want to ride on one before they go I will hopefully nip to Cardiff in the new year too to get a 143 before they go.

Still plenty.

 

[ABB125]

In that area pretty just Marple/Rose Hill.

The new mills central trains are also 142s although now they have become 2 coaches they tend to be sprinters now

Thanks both.
What now runs the CLC stoppers?

 

[johnnychips]

Thanks @Llama for your explanation of the differences between 142s and 144s.

 

[childwallblues]

I don't know what WNXX stands for or means, but it's another online railway forum that has existed since before RailUK, apparently. You have to be a member to see threads / posts, and registering is free but you have to wait to be "approved"). Also, threads seem to be locked after not very long from what I saw. If I understand rightly, it also has some sort of publication which I believe requires a (paid...?) subscription.

There is a £10 per year subscription and it is well worth it.

 

[Llama]

Thanks @Llama for your explanation of the differences between 142s and 144s.

Under the solebar 142s and 144s appear virtually identical at first sight, the only main difference being that the toilet water header tank is in the ceiling on a 144 whereas on a 142 it is under the solebar and hence needs a main res pressure feed to force the water up to the WC - there are a couple of filler points on a 142 and a TWIC (toilet water isolation cock) for isolating the air feed.

 

[_toommm_]

Good evening,

Apologies if this has been asked before, but what routes in the Cheshire Day Ranger area (see map below) are still pacer-operated, and will be on Monday 30th DEC?

Map

Off the top of my head, I'm thinking:

• CLC stoppers
• Manchester-Rose Hill/New Mills (Central)
• Manchester-Chester (via Altrincham)
• Manchester-Buxton

Are there any diagrams on the Leeds-Chester service?

Many thanks (and apologies if there is a better thread for this information).

Pacers are banned from Buxton due to the steep gradients. It's solid 150/156 territory. Chester services are increasingly becoming Sprinters but it is a fair game whether you are subjected to the Random Unit Allocater or not...

 

[superkev]

Cheers, guessing 021, 026 and 060 on the move
https://live.rail-record.co.uk/train?c=K06016&d=23/12/2019

I thought those units 021, 026, 060 where at Hull Botanic gdns. Have they moved to Holbeck. They would pass Gascoigne on the way.
K

 

[trainmania100]

I thought those units 021, 026, 060 where at Hull Botanic gdns. Have they moved to Holbeck. They would pass Gascoigne on the way.
K

Yeah I thought that too, someone said to me those three so I'd assumed I was a bit out of the loop and they'd moved since I last heard lol

 

[ABB125]

Pacers are banned from Buxton due to the steep gradients. It's solid 150/156 territory. Chester services are increasingly becoming Sprinters but it is a fair game whether you are subjected to the Random Unit Allocater or not...

Thanks. I'll make sure I ask closer to the day to find out for definite what will be pacer operated.

 

[superkev]

I see today's (mon) Holbeck to Gascoigne wood is on its way.
Anyone confirm unnt numbers.
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K06016/2019-12-23/detailed
K

 

[IamTrainsYT]

I see today's (mon) Holbeck to Gascoigne wood is on its way.
Anyone confirm unnt numbers.
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K06016/2019-12-23/detailed
K

From the driver himself: 60, 26, 21

 

[NorthernSpirit]

Good evening,

Apologies if this has been asked before, but what routes in the Cheshire Day Ranger area (see map below) are still pacer-operated, and will be on Monday 30th DEC?

Map

Off the top of my head, I'm thinking:

• CLC stoppers
• Manchester-Rose Hill/New Mills (Central)
• Manchester-Chester (via Altrincham)
• Manchester-Buxton

Are there any diagrams on the Leeds-Chester service?

Many thanks (and apologies if there is a better thread for this information).

In reponse to the Leeds to Chester service, from what I've seen when waiting in Halifax recently these are mostly operated by classes 150, 156 and 195.

The last time I saw any Pacer workings were before the December 2019 timetable change which saw the Huddersfield to Leeds via Bradford services being operated mostly by a mixture of class 142's and 144's, the service is now a Huddersfield to Bradford service which is operated solely by class 153's meaning that my part of Yorkshire which was one unindated by Pacers is now scarce of them. However saying that a 142 may operate on the Wigan to Leeds service but that is now extremely rare as mostly operated by classes 150, 156 and 158.

 

[NorthernSpirit]

Shocked to see, according to Northern Spirits fleet list status how quickly these have been retired. Looks like Cardiff could be the last haven for Pacer fans alike.

The list is getting a lot more colourful by the day especially with Northern's class 142's. I still expect to see some 142's (and some 143's) broken up for spares though so that whatever examples are preserved (e.g. 142001, 142029*, 143603 and 144003 so far) can still be kept running even if it does become the case of heritage railways buying parts from other heritage lines.

I do reckon that by April / May 2020, the only 142's in traffic will be the Transport for Wales examples which upon them retiring from service will be listed as withdrawn, then either to scrapped, converted to other use or preserved depending on what action is taken.

One thing I will suggest is if anyone wants to see a Pacer on their nearest heritage railway, contact them and ask if they can preserve a few examples.


* Is this unit actually going to be running "in service" or is it going to be a static exhibit? Either way at least another 142 is preserved.

 

[superkev]

From the driver himself: 60, 26, 21

Thanks

 

[IamTrainsYT]

* Is this unit actually going to be running "in service" or is it going to be a static exhibit? Either way at least another 142 is preserved.

The railway have said that they have started driver training so I don’t think it is going as a static exhibit, another one will also be going there

 

[NorthernSpirit]

The railway have said that they have started driver training so I don’t think it is going as a static exhibit, another one will also be going there.

That's great to hear, I wonder what the unit number of the second Pacer will be? The more preserved the better. Imagine if the Bluebell Railway took a couple on.

 

[boeing737229]

I meant the seating layout, no luggage racks fitted etc... Paint and flooring is window dressing that can be reversed.

Aye literally all they need to do is strip the FGW paint off the interior panelling, revealing the original beige, orange and 'caramel' colours (ceiling panels/window surrounds, end bulkheads, and lower wall panels, respectively)

 

[Skymonster]

Wibble now suggesting Chasewater is having two Pacers - 142029 is already half there and 142030 is the other being suggested by the rumour machine.

 

[Neptune]

In reponse to the Leeds to Chester service, from what I've seen when waiting in Halifax recently these are mostly operated by classes 150, 156 and 195.

The last time I saw any Pacer workings were before the December 2019 timetable change which saw the Huddersfield to Leeds via Bradford services being operated mostly by a mixture of class 142's and 144's, the service is now a Huddersfield to Bradford service which is operated solely by class 153's meaning that my part of Yorkshire which was one unindated by Pacers is now scarce of them. However saying that a 142 may operate on the Wigan to Leeds service but that is now extremely rare as mostly operated by classes 150, 156 and 158.

144006 was on one of the Bradford - Huddersfield diagrams today vice a 153.

Leeds - Chester (interworked with the Leeds - Man Vic fast) is diagrammed for 195’s and the odd 158. No 156’s now diagrammed into Leeds although they are still appearing.