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Chiltern Evergreen 3 Announcment - Friday

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Voyager 2093

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They are getting 4x172s for Gerrards X/Wycombe terminators.

Yeah they are getting 172s this year (has anyone noticed that there have been no production photos of the 172 even though they are supposed to be constructed this year strange?)

The 172s will also be used on the Aylesbury Line too aswell as the Bicester Line. They will mainly be used on Metro services that 165s normally operate on this will be done in order to release more 165s to form longer formations ect.
 
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the sniper

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(has anyone noticed that there have been no production photos of the 172 even though they are supposed to be constructed this year strange?)

Yes, I have also found it odd. I'm also surprised that there haven't been any official artist impression shot's of the 172/2 or 172/3, the LM ones with the end gangways.
 

robert2000

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Like I have said about 20 times, Electrify the line, use it as a diversionary route for the WCML aswell,

but then people will say that wsmr are not efficiant because they would be running 75% or therebouts under the wires on their journeys.
 

Pumbaa

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Yeah they are getting 172s this year (has anyone noticed that there have been no production photos of the 172 even though they are supposed to be constructed this year strange?)

The first unit is now near completion, and will commence testing shortly before mass construction begins.
 

The Planner

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The 172s will also be used on the Aylesbury Line too aswell as the Bicester Line. They will mainly be used on Metro services that 165s normally operate on this will be done in order to release more 165s to form longer formations ect.

172 arent going to Aylesbury and Bicester from what ive heard.
 

Voyager 2093

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They will be going to Aylesbury and Bicester this is because 168s regularly work to Bicester and Aylesbury and are more needed on the Birmingham Line for economic and obvious reasons such as the passenger numbers in comparisson to the length and capacity of the 168, so the introduction of the 172s will allow this to happen.

But only time will tell.
 

The Planner

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Time will tell, but from what Ive seen so far of Evergreen 3 proposals, 172s dont go further than Wycombe....
 

RPM

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BTW Chiltern were supposed to get loco hauled stock using some redundant 67s and MK3s dont know if its died down or not. Apparently they were suposed to be hauling London to Banbury Shuttles.

As far as I know this is still in the pipeline. I understand the mark 3s are being fitted with power operated external doors as part of the refurbishment. The original intention was to fit out the DVTs as passenger vehicles but I assume this was dropped seeing as the first DVT has appeared without this modification. They are to be used on London - Birmingham services, not London - Banbury.
 

Chafford1

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From the Birmingham Post:

Moor Street station expansion and faster trains to London announced

Jan 14 2010 by Christina Savvas, Birmingham Post


A dramatic expansion of Moor Street station will give Birmingham a second major rail terminal with high-quality and faster trains to London, Transport Secretary Lord Adonis has announced.

The £250 million investment will create the first new rail link from the capital to any major British city for over 100 years.

Journey times to London on the Chiltern line will be cut by a fifth to one hour 40 minutes, giving passengers a real choice between services from Moor Street and Virgin Trains services from New Street, which have been criticised for being too expensive.

The ambitious project to entice motorists onto trains was unveiled by Transport Secretary Lord Adonis and Chiltern Railways chairman Adrian Shooter.

Lord Adonis said the £250 million upgrade would “transform” links between Birmingham and London.

He announced the improvements during a visit to Birmingham to meet business leaders and city council leader Mike Whitby.

Lord Adonis said: “I am announcing the extension of the Chiltern franchise in return for £250 million of investment, which Chiltern will put in to transform the line.

“It will ensure journey times to London are cut to one hour 40 minutes.

“This is very good news for Birmingham passengers and businesses, giving them a greatly enhanced service through the Chilterns and on to London and Marylebone. And it comes on top of the upgrade of the West Coast Main Line.

“These two projects taken together have transformed the quality of transport links between London and Birmingham.

“Part of the package is a big expansion of Birmingham Moor Street, which will now be the most significant second hub for trains from Birmingham to London.”

The upgrade, which is scheduled for completion in December, will be supported by a £13.5 million project to open extra platforms, doubling capacity at Moor Street, where new ticketing technology will also be introduced.

There will be new trains with better acceleration, and new carriages.

Chiltern Railways, which holds the franchise to run services from Moor Street to Marylebone station in London, agreed to pay for the improvements after striking a deal with the Department for Transport.

Its franchise has been extended for seven and a half years, which means it will now run trains until at least 2021 if it provides a good service.

Although Chiltern already runs trains to London, the long journey time has meant they can be seen as a second-class option compared to Virgin’s services from New Street to London Euston, which use modern Pendolino trains on the West Coast Main Line.

Chiltern Railways chairman Adrian Shooter, said: “Evergreen 3 is the biggest passenger rail project for several generations not to call on the taxpayer for support. Working closely with Network Rail, we are going to create a new main line railway for the people of Oxfordshire and the Midlands.

“This deal demonstrates that real improvements to rail services can be paid for without public subsidy by attracting people out of their cars and onto trains.”

Robin Gisby from Network Rail, said: “This is a great scheme that will deliver huge benefits to hundreds of thousands of passengers.”

The new investment will give Birmingham two high quality services at major stations, added Lord Adonis.

The Moor Street expansion also raises questions about plans to bring high speed rail services into the city - providing a third option for passengers commuting to London.

New Street does not have the capacity to cope with new high speed services, even once a £600 million refurbishment is completed. It means another city centre station is likely to be used, and Moor Street could be the obvious choice.

Lord Adonis would not comment on whether Moor Street would also be used for high speed rail services. The detailed proposals would be published in March, he said.

“The Government is looking at a number of options for how High Speed Rail can access Birmingham.”
 

gingerheid

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This is what could be happening all over the country if the government hadn't bottled it after handing out at one proper 2nd generation franchise and started trying to grab cash :(
 

Chafford1

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Network Rail are quoting a fastest time of 92 mins for Marylebone - Snow Hill on their website.
 

The Planner

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Network Rail are quoting a fastest time of 92 mins for Marylebone - Snow Hill on their website.

With what stopping pattern ?! The Banbury quote is about right with no stops inbetween. Marylebone - Snow Hill in 92 means a Banbury, Leamington and Moor St only, nothing else would work.
 

Chafford1

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The Planner

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No there wouldnt, Wembley wont be included on any of the fast trains. It will only be on the stoppers.
 

Voyager 2093

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Is that good?

And yes SWT Driver London to Birmingham on the Chiltern Mainline compared to the West Coast Mainline's is good considering the fact that the maximum speed of a 168 is 110mph compared to the 390 top speed of 140mph.

Also DMUs as we all know take longer to accelerate than EMUs.

Also the amount of stopping diagrams on the Chiltern Mainline that interfere with this service or stop this service and the amount of daily freight on the Chiltern Mainline from Northolt to Calvert.

Another thing to consider is the fact TThe Chiltern Mainline is operated along two tracks compared to The West Coast Mainline's 4 tracks.

Regards
Jamaal the Chiltern fan!:D
 

Chafford1

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And yes SWT Driver London to Birmingham on the Chiltern Mainline compared to the West Coast Mainline's is good considering the fact that the maximum speed of a 168 is 110mph compared to the 390 top speed of 140mph.

Also DMUs as we all know take longer to accelerate than EMUs.

Also the amount of stopping diagrams on the Chiltern Mainline that interfere with this service or stop this service and the amount of daily freight on the Chiltern Mainline from Northolt to Calvert.

Another thing to consider is the fact TThe Chiltern Mainline is operated along two tracks compared to The West Coast Mainline's 4 tracks.

Regards
Jamaal the Chiltern fan!:D

The line speed comparison (from 2011) should be 100mph and 125mph respectively.
 

Voyager 2093

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No a 168 can do 110mph mate a Chiltern driver told me this while I was having a cab ride up to Aylesbury however the ATP will kick in.

390s are capable of 140mph but the max speed they currently operate at is 125mph.
 

Voyager 2093

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Yes I understand that I was just reffering the top speed of the train, not the tracks. What im trying to say is a 168 can do 110mph however they are not allowed above 100mph due to tracks, diagrams and limits on the Chiltern Mainline.
 

The Planner

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As pointed out on another thread, here are the times - the 92 minutes are peak hour trains:

Mark 3 locomotive hauled carriages as well!

Aaaaah that makes a bit more sense, 92 from Birmingham not Snow Hill, that will mean Moor St then. The MkIII idea like I have said before has never gone away, they were just waiting for this lot to kick in.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Ha ! what a great quote on the NR site for this :

"Evergreen 3 is the first new rail link to be built from London to a major British city built since the Bicester cut-off created the modern Chiltern Railways route in 1910. The channel tunnel rail link, opened in 2007, will include services to Canterbury but was built for international trains to Paris and Brussels"

I presume they mean the tiny bit of track for the Bicester chord, otherwise that is a superb bit of spin.
 

route:oxford

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Any train with a maximum PERMITTED speed of 100 can do 110 because they are tested to maximum PERMITTED plus 10%, so a 390 can actually do 154mph!

So the 67+MkIII will happily manage 137.5mph too...

Is the factory of safety percentage for the track also 10%?
 

royaloak

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Are people really that thick or are you taking the ****, since when has a mark 3 COACH been a locomotive or a multiple unit?

I said-

They are tested to maximum permitted speed plus 10%

If the words are too long for you I will put it in SIMPLE terms for you!
 

barrykas

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So the 67+MkIII will happily manage 137.5mph too...

Is the factory of safety percentage for the track also 10%?

Whilst the 67s are rated for 125, the DVTs are limited to 110. Can't remember whether the Mk3s are rated for 110 or 125 off the top of my head though.

Cheers,

Barry
 
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