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Caledonian Sleeper Mk5 Discussion

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theblackwatch

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There's no way the new stock will be in traffic in April, or anytime 1st half for that matter. There's loads of acceptance testing to do and it's not reached these shores yet.

They've altered the ticketing to avoid pain down the line when they are running a split fleet.

I've been thinking similar, given how time is marching on and we don't even have any vehicles in the UK yet. I've noticed this on the CS website:
Booking Information: A reservation system error is preventing bookings for dates past May 2018. We anticipate a fix in the coming days.

The cynic in me wonders if this is really related to the introduction of the new stock and the problem is related to managing bookings when the type of rolling stock is unknown.
 
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Bletchleyite

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The cynic in me wonders if this is really related to the introduction of the new stock and the problem is related to managing bookings when the type of rolling stock is unknown.

I'm not, to be honest, sure why they handle bookings like they do. For cabins they could just take bookings for single and shared (stopping when they run out of rooms rather than a specific number of each) and allocate berths on the day in the manner that they do in India, with a kind of "check in" to find yours out (on the platform at the busy main termini, on board at intermediate stops where it's quiet, could be done at the lounge cars).
 

TimboM

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The cynic in me wonders if this is really related to the introduction of the new stock and the problem is related to managing bookings when the type of rolling stock is unknown.
I doubt it is, as what they've done to manage the transition is now moved the bookings to be in line with the new stock configurations/options (from late Feb I think) and they will then be 'adapting' the old stock to match these in the interim (e.g. will have composite first/second coaches now, rather than separate).

So as far as the booking system is concerned, it doesn't matter whether new or old stock will be operating a particular service down the line as it's still selling the same types/numbers of berths. I think the main additional change that will happen when it's known new stock is in place will be the opening up of the top-end options (suites).

That said, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a connection between the recent changes to the options/booking system and the problems with booking beyond May 2018 as that's often the case with IT - change one thing at one end and something goes wrong at the other...
 

BRX

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The new stock will have lower capacity than the current, right?

So presumably for services where the new stock might be used they can't sell the whole capacity of the Mk3s. Of course the sensible solution would seem to be to release those final spaces, if indeed it turns out the old stock will still be in service, closer to the date. But of course whether their system can deal with that is another question.
 

TimboM

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Doesn't Spring arrive around the end of June in the far north of Scotland?
The "end of Spring" this year in Scotland will officially be the first night at least one Mk5 rake is in operation on the Sleeper, whatever date that will be... ;)
 

TimboM

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The new stock will have lower capacity than the current, right?

So presumably for services where the new stock might be used they can't sell the whole capacity of the Mk3s. Of course the sensible solution would seem to be to release those final spaces, if indeed it turns out the old stock will still be in service, closer to the date. But of course whether their system can deal with that is another question.
At the current time I believe the "extra" berths in the old stock are still be used/sold. However, I have seen some unconfirmed suggestions (wibble, or perhaps not?) that as the new stock/transition period nears they will lock certain berths out of use to replicate the capacity of the new stock.

When it's getting very close to roll-out and in transition (with some Mk5 and some old stock) I think this approach would be needed anyway, as they probably won't know for definite until a few days/week or so out whether it's old or new stock, and they wouldn't want to sell berths based on old stock capacity and then end up having a new rake working it and telling some excited guests delighted they're on the Mk5s that in fact there isn't actually the room for them. On the flipside, you'd think from a pure business perspective if they've sold based on "new" capacity but it's old stock then it would make sense to use the 'spare' berths and sell them last minute, or as upgrades to seats...?

That said, part of running as per the new format will be for the Sleeper Hosts to get used to the new make-up of each coach (including the composite aspect) so it may not be quite as simple as "we have a spare berth, let's sell it to someone last minute..."
 

USRailFan

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Will these new sleeping cars have shower (either in the comperaments or in one of the car ends)? Or will the UK still be one of the few European countries (together with Norway and possibly Finland) whose domestic night trains do not offer shower faciltiies?
 

TimboM

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Will these new sleeping cars have shower (either in the comperaments or in one of the car ends)? Or will the UK still be one of the few European countries (together with Norway and possibly Finland) whose domestic night trains do not offer shower faciltiies?
The Suites will have double beds + en suite toilet + shower
The Club Rooms will have single beds + en suite toilet + shower
The Classic Rooms will be as they are now - wash basin, but shared toilet facilities (and no access to an on-board shower I don't believe)

Anyhow, have a peruse for yourself here:
http://newtrains.sleeper.scot/
 

TimboM

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New stock to arrive at Polmadie Tuesday morning
Paths are as follows - subject to all the usual caveats:

Dollands Moor - Wembley: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/R67084/2018/01/15/advanced
Wembley - Polmadie: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/R67085/2018/01/15/advanced

The delivery to Polmadie is being managed on behalf of CAF by Rail Adventure (European specialist rail logistics company) who are using ROG within the UK - so other than the 92 to get them through the tunnel this is likely to be hauled by ROG traction, not GBRf.
 

TimboM

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Are they already at Dollands awaiting Monday's move or still at Frethun?
They're still at Frethun. Due to be in Dollands Moor in time for the that move as linked above to Wembley.

Confirmed elsewhere that DB will bring them through first thing Monday morning - Class 92 hauled of cause :D
 
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TimboM

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I think the later batches are due to dock at Tees. So I've been told.
Correct - only the "test rake" (the 5 coaches that went to Velim) is coming via the tunnel - the rest will be shipped. Paths are already in (and have been for some time) from Tees Dock to Polmadie. In addition, after the recent WTT update in mid-December, there are also paths from Ayr docks to Polmadie, so a possible alternative route for some/all of the remaining 70 coaches.
 

TimboM

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Do the rest of the coaches need to go via Velim for testing, or was it just the initial 5?
Just the initial 5. The other 70 go direct to Polmadie for testing from there on the WCML to Lancaster and also the West Highland Line. (You can see the Lancaster/Carnforth test paths in if you take a look at Polmadie listings on RTT for any given day.)
 

Peter Mugridge

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Just realised... two hours from Ashford to Olympia... it should be possible to photograph them at both locations shouldn't it? Just dash up to London on a 395...?
 

jyte

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Just realised... two hours from Ashford to Olympia... it should be possible to photograph them at both locations shouldn't it? Just dash up to London on a 395...?
Should be. Google maps says 1hr30 to 1hr40 through international and then picaddily/district/overground from there.
 

Peter Mugridge

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Should be. Google maps says 1hr30 to 1hr40 through international and then picaddily/district/overground from there.

Impromptu forum meet with cameras at the ready tomorrow, anyone...?

It's supposed to have stopped raining by then.....
 

marks87

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I'd expect a bit of a media fanfare from CS about the arrival of the new coaches, probably once they reach Polmadie. Photos of the 5 coaches behind a CS-liveried 92 and various people in suits posing in front...that sort of thing.
 

TimboM

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I'd expect a bit of a media fanfare from CS about the arrival of the new coaches, probably once they reach Polmadie. Photos of the 5 coaches behind a CS-liveried 92 and various people in suits posing in front...that sort of thing.
If the locos stay in their current rotations, the only CS-liveried loco at Polmadie for a photo shoot will be 86101!
 

Peter Mugridge

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The move was a few minutes early through Ashford... I can see my margin to get to Olympia first shrinking!
 

BRX

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Here they are - passing me here in South London just a little while ago.

 

marks87

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Fantastic video. Great to see them finally in the UK.

Obviously barrier/translator vehicles are required because of the Dellners, but what are the flat wagons for?
 
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