Major Disruption At London Euston (1st - 3rd Dec 2017)

[gavin]

All lines reopen services begging to move to/from Euston

 

[yorkie]

I want to travel today on the WCML. My intention is to buy an off peak open return with a NSE.

I shall now wait til 6:00pm, because of the current situation.

However, by 6:00pm if it's still "bad", will I be allowed to travel on Monday morning instead, during the peak morning period with a NSE card?

Obviously, on a Sunday there are no time restrictions (or minimum fare restrictions).

However, will barrier staff let me through on a Monday morning?!

It sounds like you do not already have a ticket and would be buying one on Monday morning? If so, this could be problematical. I would speak to the train operator as soon as possible. I think it's a moot point now though, as lines are reopening.

 

[amateur]

I plan to travel at 5pm or 6pm today, as lines are reopening.So it is a moot point!

 

[Deepgreen]

Just an observation - there has been much debate about the relative merits and reliability of OHLE and third rail. Some say that third rail is as unreliable as OHLE, if not more so, but, recently, there seem to have been a relatively huge number of OHLE damage incidents, and very few third rail ones (weather issues excepted). There have been a few third rail displacements over the last few years, but my impression is that OHLE damage by trains has been far more prevalent (and far slower to repair).

 

[ah-media]

The 1224 ex Hemel (1158 Bletchley to Euston) left at 1248 and was the first train stopping on the WCML south of Northampton.

The nice staff at Hemel told us not to worry about tickets... Let's hope they feel the same way when I get to Euston!

 

[Finghall]

These constant problems with OHL on both the West and East Coast main lines must surely raise a question mark over the idea that OHL is the only way forward. Unless effective alternative and usable routes are wired (which they generally aren't except in the West Midlands) every time there is a problem everything grinds to a halt - that is no way to run a railway.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Just an observation - here has been much debate about the relative merits and reliability of OHLE and third rail. Some say that third rail is as unreliable as OHLE, if not more so, but, recently, there seem to have been a relatively huge number of OHLE damage incidents, and very few third rail ones (weather issues excepted). There have been a few third rail displacements over the last few years, but my impression is that OHLE damage by trains has been far more prevalent (and far slower to repair).

Is the length of this damage unusual or to be expected given line speeds at the location before the ADD kicks in and drops the pan?

 

[LU_timetabler]

Why is getting the right information to passengers so difficult when things like this happen?
I arrived at Euston at about 16.00 on Friday, hoping to get LM fast to Harrow, then pick up LO north to home.
Seeing LM's being cancelled and Overhead line damage I went to the LO platform to get the next out from there. There was no announcement of delay or cancellation or diversion (stopping short) to any LO services. The 16.17 didn't show up, but the 16.37 did - there was no announcement until we pulled in to Queen's Park where the train was terminated to go back to Euston as a shuttle service. There were no on train announcements until Queen's Park and no announcements at all at Euston about what was going with the LO service. It was plainly obvious my only possible routing was Met to Harrow-on-the-Hill, bus to Harrow & Wealdstone and LO shuttle north of Harrow & Wealdstone, but they could have told me this at Euston, instead of my going to Queen's Park and then having to Bakerloo back to Baker Street.
Then they adopted the ridiculous explanation of the LO disruption as signal failure, which is plainly an outright lie, as it was debris from the WCML de-wiring.
I have to call into question the appalling lack of accurate communication at Euston to LO customers.
It would not have taken me until 19.00 to get home, if I had been properly informed of the situation at Euston some time between 16.00 and 16.35.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Are the up and down fasts closed atm? On OTT it's showing "ITEM" on the Up Fast at Wembley Central and "-11-" on the Up Fast. There's also "-11-" showing on the Up Fast in the Willesden Junction area

 

[Lrd]

Are the up and down fasts closed atm? On OTT it's showing "ITEM" on the Up Fast at Wembley Central and "-11-" on the Up Fast. There's also "-11-" showing on the Up Fast in the Willesden Junction area

Virgin are saying on twitter that only some lines have reopened

 

[Alan McMillan]

Good question LU timetabler but given the incident didn't happen until after 15:30 (15:23 ex Euston was train involved), it would take a while for facts to be established, organise trains etc and for the service to settle down. As it happened, your suggested route wouldn't have helped you. According to RTT, the first northbound LO train from H&W wasn't until around 20:00!

 

[Bald Rick]

Just an observation - here has been much debate about the relative merits and reliability of OHLE and third rail. Some say that third rail is as unreliable as OHLE, if not more so, but, recently, there seem to have been a relatively huge number of OHLE damage incidents, and very few third rail ones (weather issues excepted). There have been a few third rail displacements over the last few years, but my impression is that OHLE damage by trains has been far more prevalent (and far slower to repair).

Yes there has much debate, on this forum at least. Probably best not to reopen it. However what I will say is that in the past I have been responsible for building, maintaining, renewing and operating railways of both systems. There is no doubt that whilst OLE is more expensive to construct (but not that much on a whole system basis), OLE is definitely more reliable (there are daily problems with the third rail), causes far fewer faults with other parts of the infrastructure (particularly signalling*), results in cheaper maintenance costs, is less disruptive during most external events (cold weather, flooding, trespass, objects on the line) and is more efficient in terms of electricity use. And it is safer. No doubt in my mind that OLE is the better system. And it's not just me, pretty much every new electrified 'heavy' railway in the world is built with OLE.

* for example a fair proportion of faults on the DC network described as 'signalling problems' have their root cause as the third rail system.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Virgin are saying on twitter that only some lines have reopened

Looks like possibly NRE have got the wrong info as they say that all lines have reopened

https://twitter.com/nationalrailenq/status/937294850919227392

#WatfordJunction - All lines have reopened to and from London Euston following over 500 metres of damage to the overhead wires between London Euston and Watford Junction.

4:18 am - 3 Dec 2017

 

[Chris M]

Just an observation - here has been much debate about the relative merits and reliability of OHLE and third rail. Some say that third rail is as unreliable as OHLE, if not more so, but, recently, there seem to have been a relatively huge number of OHLE damage incidents, and very few third rail ones (weather issues excepted). There have been a few third rail displacements over the last few years, but my impression is that OHLE damage by trains has been far more prevalent (and far slower to repair).

It's not quite as simple as one being better than the other for disruption as the two systems are susceptible to different sorts of faults. As just one example, third rail copes much better than OHLE in high winds but OHLE wins hands down in snow.

 

[Alan McMillan]

Fast lines still closed meaning we have a two track railway as far as Bourne End Jn. Not as bad as a weekday as LM only run 4 tph on a Sunday. At the moment the Tring terminators are cancelled taking it down to 3.

 

[Bald Rick]

Fast lines still closed meaning we have a two track railway as far as Bourne End Jn. Not as bad as a weekday as LM only run 4 tph on a Sunday. At the moment the Tring terminators are cancelled taking it down to 3.

Fast lines open now. 1H11 / 1A19 will be first through. I expect 1H11 will be put through at caution to check everything works.

 

[Alan McMillan]

Just as I say that we have 1A19 on the up fast approaching Watford Jn!

 

[SpacePhoenix]

What is "ITEM" short for?

 

[GB]

What is "ITEM" short for?

It’s not short for anything. It’s in reference to the weekly operating notice where each possession (or equivalent) is referred to as an item (+ chronological number). Effectively an item of work.

 

[TUC]

Good question LU timetabler but given the incident didn't happen until after 15:30 (15:23 ex Euston was train involved), it would take a while for facts to be established, organise trains etc and for the service to settle down. As it happened, your suggested route wouldn't have helped you. According to RTT, the first northbound LO train from H&W wasn't until around 20:00!

But in these situations surely it's at least of some reassurance for staff to advise that they are aware of the disruption and are seeking to find out further information. It reassures passengers that staff are aware of the situation, reduces the sense of isolation and helps enhance patience whilst waiting for it to be resolved.

 

[QueensCurve]

Yes, but the pantograph on 5G29 needs further expert attention before the unit can be dragged.

Presumably damage to the [rear?] pantograph means that the forward one could not be used to take the train forward. Could it perhaps have been used to prevent the train becoming cold and dark?

Looks like chaos! Wondering if there is a separate issue between Bourne end and Ledburn junctions as even class 4 freights and class 2 passenger services are being put on the fast between these two. Makes no sense why they took the north junction out.

I noticed that, on Friday evening, some of the up workings were being put on the slow line at Leburn Junction. Was this a measure to prevent conflicting movements at Bourne End? If so it seems sensible.

They were specially made - stored at obvious places - like Watford / MK / Northampton and staff trained on them (with refreshers of course) ....others have them now like Thameslink.

The first use , ironically , was when some scroats set fire one late evening to Northampton station toilets , off home they went gleefully no doubt , only for an isolation to bring their train to a stand for isolation reasons - so a rescue DMU x 2 was sent off to recover the passengers with the ramps. Information and description of the miscreants available - so these louts were cross transferred to the DMU and handcuffed by the BTP. A fine case study of wrong ones , getting done , when they thought it was a safe run home.

The photo above appears to show the standard wheelchair ramp in use. Was it developed for inter-train transfers and then used for wheelchairs as a later thought?

Also adding to the problem at the opposite end, there are currently major disruptions at Manchester Piccadilly

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...nchester-piccadilly-trains-cancelled-13984709

Although typical local newspaper exaggerations "Passengers travelling to and from the station are reporting numerous train cancellations" where as RTT doesn't show anything as being cancelled

Now reported as...

BTP officers attended Manchester Piccadilly Station on Friday 1st December 2017 after a report of a person coming into contact with overhead electrical lines and suffering injuries consistent with electrocution.

Officers from BTP attended the incident, along with North West Fire and Ambulance which was reported to police at 22:53 and is currently being treated as non-suspicious.

Paramedics also attended but the person was pronounced dead at the scene.

A file will be prepared for the coroner.

Since that would appear to have been a misadventure it presumably does not contribute to our 1/300/y electrocution risk from OHLE.

Yes, Mrs S's journey hit that too. She was just over an hour late in Manchester, good trip to Preston on the shortened Blackpool service, neat connection to a Barrow train (Arnside suits us as well as Oxenholme) then 70mins late out of Lancaster. I had seen 1Z99 going Preston to Carnforth North Junction but didn't have the gumption to drive to Lancaster instantly.

Is 1Z99 a standard designation for a rescue locomotive?

These constant problems with OHL on both the West and East Coast main lines must surely raise a question mark over the idea that OHL is the only way forward. Unless effective alternative and usable routes are wired (which they generally aren't except in the West Midlands) every time there is a problem everything grinds to a halt - that is no way to run a railway.

High voltage OHLE remains the standard for electrical efficiency, high power delivery and high speed running.

 

[uww11x]

#VTUPDATE Ticket acceptance with all other operators has now ended.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Excellent job Network Rail for doing the fix on time.

Terrible job to LM for basically withdrawing all service (including services that could have been operated) with no replacement. I hope they are royally penalised for this. Clearly they no longer give a monkey's with only a week to go!

 

[pitdiver]

Out of curiosity and to open a can of worms. I wonder what the travelling public would have thought had this happened on the 24th December in the afternoon or even the 23rd which is often busier. I'm glad I don't work with the travelling public anymore.

 

[amateur]

I'm glad I don't work with the travelling public anymore.

What was your previous occupation?!

 

[pitdiver]

What was your previous occupation?!

Station Supervisor with LUL. Then Coach Station Manager with National Express.

 

[cjmillsnun]

Excellent job Network Rail for doing the fix on time.

Terrible job to LM for basically withdrawing all service (including services that could have been operated) with no replacement. I hope they are royally penalised for this. Clearly they no longer give a monkey's with only a week to go!

They could've been asked to do this by NR and then struggled to get stock to allow bustitution. We don't know unfortunately.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They could've been asked to do this by NR and then struggled to get stock to allow bustitution. We don't know unfortunately.

One way to engender understanding from your customers is to be honest with them rather than just telling them to naff off.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

The BBC is still banging on in news bulletins about the disruption at Euston some 5 hours after services restarted.
They even have a correspondent at Euston saying everything is pretty much normal.
Must be a slow news day.

 

[Mike395]

The BBC is still banging on in news bulletins about the disruption at Euston some 5 hours after services restarted.
They even have a correspondent at Euston saying everything is pretty much normal.
Must be a slow news day.

I noticed that - with not even a passing mention to the current ongoing issue with virtually nothing in or out of Paddington...