New South Western franchise: Awarded to First/MTR

[Feathers44]

It's definitely a tad surreal to see SWT carrying travel info for the week beyond their franchise end, but considering the situation it's hardly surprising. During the ongoing works I'd imagine consistent communication to passengers using Waterloo is the most important factor beyond anything else.

Atually, it's exactly what I'd expect (having never gone through a franchise changeover before). From the passenger perspective, the railway will carry on as before. A complete hiatus in information provision just because the owner of the service is changing would be a terrible way to behave and I would have thought would go against some of franchise conditions.

 

[adamello]

Atually, it's exactly what I'd expect (having never gone through a franchise changeover before). From the passenger perspective, the railway will carry on as before. A complete hiatus in information provision just because the owner of the service is changing would be a terrible way to behave and I would have thought would go against some of franchise conditions.

I'd imagine the majority of people would be TUPE'd over therefore, it would still be the same teams responsibilty to provide the information before and after

 

[nlogax]

Atually, it's exactly what I'd expect (having never gone through a franchise changeover before). From the passenger perspective, the railway will carry on as before. A complete hiatus in information provision just because the owner of the service is changing would be a terrible way to behave and I would have thought would go against some of franchise conditions.

Yes, I'm definitely glad to see both companies use this approach. However, common sense seems to be an increasingly rare commodity..to be honest I'm just relieved that logic and reason has prevailed

 

[swt_passenger]

It's definitely a tad surreal to see SWT carrying travel info for the week beyond their franchise end, but considering the situation it's hardly surprising.

Outgoing TOCs always carry on publishing stuff like future engineering works in the normal manner in the run up to the changeover date. How else could it possibly work? I can find engineering work up to about 10 weeks time on SWT's pages.

If it wasn't for the current temporary timetable for the blockade you'd have seen all the printed timetables expiring in December as normal, rather than on the change date. The incoming TOC would then have reprinted them for issue in their own house style.

This isn't the first TOC to change hands, I think there's a risk of over-thinking possible problems.

 

[swt_passenger]

Although saying that, I'm not sure any of the existing material will have the wording "Stagecoach South Western Trains Ltd"

It's normally there in the very small print on the back of stuff like timetable leaflets.

 

[Agent_Squash]

Any idea of the brand as of yet? I note that the full launch is planned for the 4th September - presumably they want to show off a unit at Waterloo?

 

[Chris125]

New Train Operator keen to work with Islanders

Confirmation as per previous reports that First/MTR will soon consult on their plans for Island Line:

A consultation document on the options available for Island Line will be launched towards Late September/Early October. The options have to take into consideration electrical power supply issues and gauging restraints. Following a period of consultation, a plan will be submitted to the Department for Transport in Spring 2018.

Although the exact changes are yet to be finalised, it is thought new trains will be introduced to the Island to replace the 1938 rolling stock currently used.

 

[Swanage98]

Any 1967 LU stock left?

 

[swt_passenger]

Any 1967 LU stock left?

It is not suitable for use on the route. '73 stock ex Piccadilly line has been the consistent plan for a number of years.

 

[Kieran1990]

Been back at home in Surrey this weekend so I have traveled around the network in the Guildford area a fair amount, but no sign of any removal by SWT of their branding on the 450, 444 & 455's. I know it's a soft launch due to Waterloo but would have thought SWT would have started removing the logos and internal branding.
All the best to SWR on their launch!

 

[Kieran1990]

Been back at home in Surrey this weekend so I have traveled around the network in the Guildford area a fair amount, but no sign of any removal by SWT of their branding on the 450, 444 & 455's. I know it's a soft launch due to Waterloo but would have thought SWT would have started removing the logos and internal branding.
All the best to SWR on their launch!

 

[Chris125]

It is not suitable for use on the route. '73 stock ex Piccadilly line has been the consistent plan for a number of years.

I think that plan effectively died when their replacement was pushed back, if it's still 2025 then they wouldn't even be available to this franchise - much more likely First/MTR are considering the practicality of D78s.

 

[Monty]

I think that plan effectively died when their replacement was pushed back, if it's still 2025 then they wouldn't even be available to this franchise - much more likely First/MTR are considering the practicality of D78s.

Pretty sure the D78s are too long for the Ryde tunnel.

 

[Chris125]

Pretty sure the D78s are too long for the Ryde tunnel.

Perhaps, but they aren't much longer than the 73TS and single tracking the tunnel may allow clearances to be eased to some degree.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

I think that plan effectively died when their replacement was pushed back, if it's still 2025 then they wouldn't even be available to this franchise - much more likely First/MTR are considering the practicality of D78s.

If that plan is effectively dead in the water, could a "follow-on" order be tagged onto the end of the LU order for more "1995 LU Northern Line" stock? It seems like it could be the only chance of the Island Line getting new stock during the upcoming First/MTR franchise

 

[Chris125]

If that plan is effectively dead in the water, could a "follow-on" order be tagged onto the end of the LU order for more "1995 LU Northern Line" stock? It seems like it could be the only chance of the Island Line getting new stock during the upcoming First/MTR franchise

I can't imagine a situation where a new fleet made more sense than any other option - it wouldn't just be a follow-on order, but a unique 2 or 3-car, 3rd rail design of just 4-6 units which would no doubt come at a very high cost.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Perhaps, but they aren't much longer than the 73TS and single tracking the tunnel may allow clearances to be eased to some degree.

It's two bores.

 

[spark001uk]

So it looks like the branding is going to be known as 'SWR' then? According to the news on Exterion Media's website, they mention it several times.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I can't imagine a situation where a new fleet made more sense than any other option - it wouldn't just be a follow-on order, but a unique 2 or 3-car, 3rd rail design of just 4-6 units which would no doubt come at a very high cost.

If something like that was to be ordered, it'd be right up Stadler's street to do a modular FLIRT based design. It seems they can do short runs in pretty much any body profile using modular panels, so a vertically squashed version of the Merseyrail design might do. After all their core market is short runs for the Swiss narrow gauge lines (give or take the near complete re-equipment of SBB).

But I just can't see it happening. The only chance of new anything, I'd say, would be a tram project of some kind.

 

[Chris125]

It's two bores.

That's only true at each end, despite appearances.

It's mostly a double track arched-roof tunnel, however there's a short flat-roofed covered way under the roundabout - that esplanade end helpfully combines three different tunnel types with a sharp reverse curve....

Someone very foolishly filmed a video walking through it, it's on youtube as 'large tunnel under streets in the isle of wight' I believe.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

That's only true at each end, despite appearances.

It's mostly a double track arched-roof tunnel, however there's a short flat-roofed covered way under the roundabout - that esplanade end helpfully combines three different tunnel types with a sharp reverse curve....

Someone very foolishly filmed a video walking through it, it's on youtube as 'large tunnel under streets in the isle of wight' I believe.

If the twin bore bits were converted into one tunnel (like the rest of it) and the track through it singled, going through the middle, would they still be limited to using ex tube stock?

 

[Goldfish62]

No. They are valid for as long as you hold a gold card. Well that's under South West Trains. I imagine gold card holders wouldn't be to happy if they decide not to accept them having given the impress the would.

Not quite. The conditions state that they can be withdrawn at any time.

I imagine that if they are withdrawn there will be a few months grace, as with East Coast Rewards.

 

[adamello]

It's normally there in the very small print on the back of stuff like timetable leaflets.

Surely it would say 'Stagecoach South West Trains' not South Westerm

Been back at home in Surrey this weekend so I have traveled around the network in the Guildford area a fair amount, but no sign of any removal by SWT of their branding on the 450, 444 & 455's. I know it's a soft launch due to Waterloo but would have thought SWT would have started removing the logos and internal branding.
All the best to SWR on their launch!

I wouldn't have thought Stagecoach would want their branding removed, I would imagine their position would be
"if First want to rebrand their trains, they can do it once they take ownership"

 

[kw12]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-40933704

Train derails outside London Waterloo station

Passengers have been advised to avoid London Waterloo station all day after a train derailed outside the station.
The train partly left the tracks as it was pulling away from a platform at low speed at 05:40 BST, Network Rail said.
Three people were checked over by London Ambulance Service but nobody was taken to hospital.
Ten platforms are already shut as part of engineering works to enlarge the station's capacity.

 

[bb21]

There is a dedicated thread for the derailment here.

 

[Feathers44]

I wouldn't have thought Stagecoach would want their branding removed, I would imagine their position would be
"if First want to rebrand their trains, they can do it once they take ownership"

As with everything, I would think that depends on what conditions of handover exist in the SWT franchise agreement. If trains are to be debranded before handover, then debranded they need to be.

 

[swt_passenger]

Surely it would say 'Stagecoach South West Trains' not South Westerm

The current company's registered name is however "Stagecoach South Western Trains Limited", which is what they always (small) print:

https://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/about-us/

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

The current company's registered name is however "Stagecoach South Western Trains Limited", which is what they always (small) print:

https://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/about-us/

I've seen that too.

 

[adamello]

The current company's registered name is however "Stagecoach South Western Trains Limited", which is what they always (small) print:

https://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/about-us/

Ah gotcha, that makes things confusing to the uneducated

 

[swt_passenger]

Ah gotcha, that makes things confusing to the uneducated

It gets more confusing though, because in the track access application I linked to a few days back the new lot refer to themselves as First/MTR South West Trains Ltd, which is also abbreviated to FMSWT.

Track Access Contract (Passenger Services)
Between Network Rail Infrastructure Limited and
First/MTR South West Trains Ltd (trading as South Western Railway).

So I mightn't need to review my user name after all...