Creation of class 230 DEMUs from ex-LU D78s by Vivarail

[absolutelymilk]

No requirement for a loo to be provided. Look at the Class 345s for Crossrail - no toilets provided.

Exactly, but its a shame that it would not be used just because there isn't also a disabled loo. Not that I have a better solution, but still seems silly.

 

[Elecman]

Although it has now become something of a modern tramway it is still significantly different from the others. And would not exist if it did not already exist.

How do you know that? The towns motto is Progress, indeed there are now extensions planned as well as financed

 

[QueensCurve]

Those of us with Class 142 Pacers (another "innovative" product) still running in our areas may see another unusual "branch line saver" unit as a bridge too far...

At least The class 230 has bogies.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

How do you know that? The towns motto is Progress, indeed there are now extensions planned as well as financed

One such extension being to Blackpool North railway station.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

At least The class 230 has bogies.

With that, I cannot disagree.

 

[Mordac]

May I be so bold as to refer you to posting # 4511 by Elecman and then posting # 4513 by HSTEd with regards to that matter.

My bad, I should have read on. Sackcloth and ashes are in order!

 

[fredk]

Exactly, but its a shame that it would not be used just because there isn't also a disabled loo. Not that I have a better solution, but still seems silly.

So instead of only disabled wheelchair users (1.9% of UK population) being unable to use the toilets, nobody will be able to. If operators want to still keep old BR stock that is for whatever reason unable to be upgraded in service after 2020 they at least need some grandfather rights because this is a poor solution.

 

[HSTEd]

How do you know that? The towns motto is Progress, indeed there are now extensions planned as well as financed

Yes, an extension is financed that might succeed in turning it into a useful transport system.
Not holding my breath though - its ridership figures still do not make very happy reading.

 

[QueensCurve]

2019 isn't that far away. I dare say that Booths are already making space for all the Pacers that'll be heading their way.

Does the supermarket that took over Windermere station sell pacers?

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

Does the supermarket that took over Windermere station sell pacers?

No but their shopping trolleys are built to a similar standard of comfort (and crash worthiness!)

 

[D365]

Despite people making similar comments, Angel Trains will make the decision on the Class 142 type, which are numerically greater than the Classes 143 and 144 of Porterbrook.

If the decision regarding the future of their Pacer units is out of the hands of the Wales & Borders franchise, the next franchisee will have to provide an answer to how their Class 142 and Class 143 units are replaced until the long-term future of the Valley Lines is resolved, whether that be electrification or light rail conversion.

 

[najaB]

Does the supermarket that took over Windermere station sell pacers?

*Hangs head in shame* I, of course, meant CF Booth, rather than the supermarket chain.

 

[D1009]

With that, I cannot disagree.

Therefore, is it your view that brand new stock is the only option for routes which are costly to run where the current stock has to be replaced? If not, what is your alternative proposal?

 

[absolutelymilk]

So instead of only disabled wheelchair users (1.9% of UK population) being unable to use the toilets, nobody will be able to. If operators want to still keep old BR stock that is for whatever reason unable to be upgraded in service after 2020 they at least need some grandfather rights because this is a poor solution.

The current system is already grandfather rights, which are supposed to finish in 2020.

 

[mickulty]

So instead of only disabled wheelchair users (1.9% of UK population) being unable to use the toilets, nobody will be able to. If operators want to still keep old BR stock that is for whatever reason unable to be upgraded in service after 2020 they at least need some grandfather rights because this is a poor solution.

The main benefit being that then there's 50x the pressure to provide adequate facilities at stations and keep them off long routes.

 

[47802]

So instead of only disabled wheelchair users (1.9% of UK population) being unable to use the toilets, nobody will be able to. If operators want to still keep old BR stock that is for whatever reason unable to be upgraded in service after 2020 they at least need some grandfather rights because this is a poor solution.

So now this thread seems to have degenerated into a discussion about Toilets, at which point I will point out only the 3 car version of the 230 has a Toilet.

As for Sprinter units, 150's are already being modified and 156/158 etc. already have larger disabled style Toilets so fitting a new fully compliant toilet shouldn't be a massive issue, which just leaves the 153's where you can either bin them as 2 franchises have already chosen to do, loose the toilet, get a compliant toilet and loose seating, or turn them back into 2 car units simples.

 

[158756]

Is this due to disability regulations requiring a disabled toilet for stock if they have toilets installed? If so that would be quite a shame, almost the opposite of what disability regulations are trying to achieve.

It's a result of rail industry short-sightedness and the poor state many sprinters are in. They've had years to prepare for this, but everyone's waited until now to think about refurbishing anything. Indeed many sprinters haven't been refurbished to any standard by the current or recently finished franchises.

 

[Bantamzen]

Without wanting to further drag this topic into the toilet (pun intended), it seems the general consensus is that provision of DDA compliant facilities has an absolute deadline of 31/12/19.

All I will say is after 3 decades in public service, nothing is ever 100% written in stone. There is always some wriggle room, and I suspect that the coming of the next decade will see this applied in this context. Therefore do not be surprised if the DfT allows some operation of unconverted 15xs, and possibly even some Pacers to still be roaming parts of the network on 02/02/2020.......

 

[Clip]

Well thats a bit of a shame for vivarail and I hope it was somethign simple that just went wrong down there and they can carry on with their project.

 

[Sean Emmett]

Radio 5 discussing accessible toilets on trains right now.

 

[BestWestern]

Radio 5 discussing accessible toilets on trains right now.

Fascinating banter I'm sure!

 

[D365]

Fascinating banter I'm sure!

It really is!

 

[Mr Fizz]

The 230 still in Coventry Yard as at 8:30 this morning. Any idea when it will go and where?

 

[nuneatonmark]

I hear that it will stay there until the end of the week and go back to Long Marston after that, no confirmed date yet,

 

[Townsend Hook]

I hear that it will stay there until the end of the week and go back to Long Marston after that, no confirmed date yet,

Is it likely to be able to make it to Long Marston under its own power?

 

[najaB]

Is it likely to be able to make it to Long Marston under its own power?

I don't know but would like to think that they are capable of moving under their own steam at a reasonable pace with one engine out of operation.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Is it likely to be able to make it to Long Marston under its own power?

Does any other type of locomotive or unit have compatible couplings to use with a Class 230 unit?

 

[HLE]

Does any other type of locomotive or unit have compatible couplings to use with a Class 230 unit?

Emergency coupler although you wouldn't use it for a booked move normally

 

[duffield]

Several lines are effectively already completely segregated or could (fairly) easily be made so, for example the St Ives Branch and the Exmouth Branch (you could single the section between Central and Emouth junction and run a tram on the other track).
...

St. Ives, maybe. Exmouth, I don't think so. Cutting the Exmouth branch back to Exeter Central (EXC) would be disastrous - I'm at Exeter St. Davids (EXD) fairly often and *masses* of people get on/off the Exmouth trains there. Having to get on a Waterloo train or a EXD/EXC shuttle at EXD and then change onto a tram (probably after going through the ticket barriers to a segregated tram stop) at Exeter Central would ruin this service for many of its users.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Emergency coupler although you wouldn't use it for a booked move normally

Nothing on the big railway - though an LT battery locomotive would couple - and as they have main line couplers , you could attach a diesel to that.

Nearest one is probably West Ruislip though :roll: