Ordsall Chord

[QueensCurve]

I'm sure it will. It's only a few hundred yards of new track. The pictures all show it with wires.

Network Rail have perhaps taken a view it is easier to build an electrified line from scratch on a green/brown field site (cf Norton Bridge) than to electrify a live railway.

 

[snowball]

Network Rail have perhaps taken a view it is easier to build an electrified line from scratch on a green/brown field site (cf Norton Bridge) than to electrify a live railway.

No doubt the tie-ins to the wires on the existing railways will be by far the hardest part.

 

[faltskog36abba]

Its definitely getting wired and this along with the route from Ashburys to Philips Park will at least form a useful loop initially for moving empty electric stock around especially when the works start at Oxford Road and Piccadilly.

You only need to look at the route a 350 must currently take with no access via Oxford Rd to get to Victoria you have to go via Crewe and Newton Le Willows :roll:

A few years ago there was talk of south Trans Pennine running over the Ashburys Philips park line into Victoria and around the chord or onto Preston.

Does anyone know anything about this or has it been dropped?.

 

[edwin_m]

A few years ago there was talk of south Trans Pennine running over the Ashburys Philips park line into Victoria and around the chord or onto Preston.

Does anyone know anything about this or has it been dropped?.

It's not in any current plans as far as I know. The South TP train runs to the airport and I can't see it taking the slower route via Marple then doing a complete circuit of Manchester to come almost within sight of its earlier route at Ashburys about 20min later.

As well as the depot journeys from Victoria, Ashburys-Philips Park would allow TP to divert from Stalybridge via Guide Bridge if the Ashton route isn't available, but still use Victoria. Electrification isn't now needed for this as the trains in question will be diesels or bi-modes for the foreseeable future. However if Northern's EMUs stable at Guide Bridge as has been suggested (any news on this?) it will be extremely useful to get them into and out of service at Victoria.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

There was also some talk of Glossop-Victoria electric services, extending west to somewhere useful.

 

[PrinceBishop]

Will the Chord be equipped with OHLE from the outset? I don't believe that there would be a day-to-day need for electrification for some years yet but provision now would add flexibility to the local railway and mean that there would be no need to return and install it later.

I believe the Class 802 is to be introduced on TransPennine from 2019. There's a good chance (though I could be wrong) that this will be in service on Liverpool - Edinburgh and Manchester Airport - Newcastle (via Chord) routes. Therefore, it may only be 2-3 years before there is a day to day use for the wires. By the time the Chord opens it could be as little as 1-2 years, which certainly makes it worthwhile equipping it with OHLE. As others have said, I'm sure it'll come in useful in the meantime.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I'm sure they will use the Chord to work empty electric trains across Manchester.
They could even extend trains from the south round to Victoria (though there's no plan for that at the moment).

 

[SodTheDrummer]

I'm sure they will use the Chord to work empty electric trains across Manchester.
They could even extend trains from the south round to Victoria (though there's no plan for that at the moment).

True enough, the Chord will give more options if nothing else and will no doubt provide solutions to short term issues that wouldn't be there if it wasn't built..so it's a good/great thing...

So let's have more photos of it please!!

I'm looking at you ATV and Freel!!

 

[Geeves]

Theres a couple of new pictures appeared on Twitter using the #Ordsallchord search. I had expected them to have semi fitted out the south junction but its just plain line, you would have thought it would of been easier to crane the lot in while there were no wires and no plain line to remove.

Oh well!

 

[deltic08]

Surely OLE cheapest to install whilst teams and equipment onsite?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I had expected them to have semi fitted out the south junction but its just plain line, you would have thought it would of been easier to crane the lot in while there were no wires and no plain line to remove.

So, another blockade beckons.
One was mooted for Easter on the Middlewood viaduct for the northern end of the chord.
Presumably it was too much to build the junction over a newly-erected section of viaduct.

 

[Chrisyd]

I thought the Easter blockade was so they could realign the tracks through the disused platforms at Salford Central?
If so I assume other works on the Middlewood viaduct would not make the situation any better/worse!

 

[kevconnor]

A few years ago there was talk of south Trans Pennine running over the Ashburys Philips park line into Victoria and around the chord or onto Preston.

Does anyone know anything about this or has it been dropped?.

I remember hearing about this previously but I thought someone said the signalling on the Phillips Park Curve would need upgrading to allow passenger services.

 

[Class 170101]

TPE used it in passenger service every Sunday one booked per week I think. So must be up to Passenger standard.

 

[kevconnor]

I have just checked for movements over the curve for the week from Tuesday and I couldn't see any passenger services.

I did this by looking for all services either coming from or going to Victoria that passed by Ashburys.

 

[faltskog36abba]

I have just checked for movements over the curve for the week from Tuesday and I couldn't see any passenger services.

I did this by looking for all services either coming from or going to Victoria that passed by Ashburys.

Trans Penninne used to run the Liverpool Newcastle Service this way on a Sunday as mentioned but I have been checking up on Realtime trains for the last few months and it hasn't ran.

 

[furnessvale]

Trans Penninne used to run the Liverpool Newcastle Service this way on a Sunday as mentioned but I have been checking up on Realtime trains for the last few months and it hasn't ran.

Unless the required standards have changed, or the onsite equipment has been changed, if passenger trains have run on the line in the past, presumably passenger trains can run again in the future without trouble.

 

[QueensCurve]

I have just checked for movements over the curve for the week from Tuesday and I couldn't see any passenger services.

I did this by looking for all services either coming from or going to Victoria that passed by Ashburys.

I don't know about the route from Ashburys to Philips Park No1, but one dark night a few years ago I think I was diverted via Denton Junction and Ashton Moss North Junction in a Virgin Vibratager.

 

[lejog]

Unless the required standards have changed, or the onsite equipment has been changed, if passenger trains have run on the line in the past, presumably passenger trains can run again in the future without trouble.

From December 2017 a weekly service is specified in the TPE Train Service Requirements.

One service shall be provided each week between the following locations in at least one direction:

• Manchester Victoria and Stalybridge via Phillips Park Junction and Guide Bridge

.

 

[QueensCurve]

Network rail have tweeted a couple of pictures of the Ordsall works today.

Is this destined to be a double lead junction?

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Is this destined to be a double lead junction?

If you mean a double junction with a diamond crossing in it, then yes.

 

[QueensCurve]

If you mean a double junction with a diamond crossing in it, then yes.

I didn't, but thank you for the information.

 

[The Planner]

Fixed diamond and the track RAM said yes?!?

 

[snowball]

From December 2017 a weekly service is specified in the TPE Train Service Requirements.

Why would they specify weekly for a future service? It's not much use to passengers. Route learning for drivers? Isn't that the TOC's business?

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

Why would they specify weekly for a future service? It's not much use to passengers. Route learning for drivers? Isn't that the TOC's business?

That actually looks like a genuine "Parliamentary" service!

 

[Joseph_Locke]

Fixed diamond and the track RAM said yes?!?

The wide interval is only there to support a fixed diamond, in preference to the even more hated switch variety.

 

[furnessvale]

The wide interval is only there to support a fixed diamond, in preference to the even more hated switch variety.

(Genuine question, having been away from the perway for some years)

1 in 8 fixed diamonds were banned because of the desire of the 1-Co bogie to go the wrong way. Elevated checks couldn't be fitted because of the flangeless driver on 9Fs.

Given that both of those have now gone, is the 1 in 8 allowed again? If not, has there ever been a review as to whether they could be readmitted to the fold?

 

[edwin_m]

(Genuine question, having been away from the perway for some years)

1 in 8 fixed diamonds were banned because of the desire of the 1-Co bogie to go the wrong way. Elevated checks couldn't be fitted because of the flangeless driver on 9Fs.

Given that both of those have now gone, is the 1 in 8 allowed again? If not, has there ever been a review as to whether they could be readmitted to the fold?

I understand 9Fs wouldn't be allowed onto the network because of incompatibility with modern switches and crossings. However there is a preserved class 40 which has run on the main line (and may still be certified) so 1Co-Co1s are still a possibility.

 

[lejog]

That actually looks like a genuine "Parliamentary" service!

I agree. Perhaps TPE's use of the line since the introduction of the Liverpool-Victoria-Newcastle service has led to its legal status now requiring a formal Parliamentary service?

 

[kevconnor]

That actually looks like a genuine "Parliamentary" service!

TPE are doing a very good job of hiding that service I have look at all kind of permutations of possibilities on RTT and cannot find any passenger service which matches that description.