Someone gave a false name & address. Any help very very welcome!!

[MummaBug]

Thanks everyone.
Letters are written, trip to the post office in the morning.
Unfortunately apart from my sister we have no proof he wasn't traveling that day, which is very upsetting. But on reading the letter and all the other stuff that came with the court summons, the person who has falsely given his details has given incorrect details. I'm hoping, probably naively, that this may help him a little. Whoever it was has given the wrong spelling of his first and surname, and also the wrong date of birth. But the correct address. Obviously.
With the summons there is other paperwork, acknowledgement and notice of plea etc, I have no idea what we are meant to do with it all? Should I get these letter sent first?

 

[najaB]

But on reading the letter and all the other stuff that came with the court summons, the person who has falsely given his details has given incorrect details. I'm hoping, probably naively, that this may help him a little. Whoever it was has given the wrong spelling of his first and surname, and also the wrong date of birth. But the correct address. Obviously.

It does help his case a little bit - after all, if you were 'trying it on' you wouldn't give a misspelt name and the correct address. Without prying too much, does he have an uncommon name that has been spelled phonetically on the paperwork? If so, it lends credence to the idea that it is someone who he knows who's dropped him in the proverbial.

 

[MummaBug]

Yes both his names are very unusual, so the person would have had to have spelt them out for the person issuing the fine or whatever they do.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Oh blimey just thought of something. I've helped him write these letters, do I need to let them know I've helped him? He can speak English, but I've had to help him a lot so we word it right. I think my brain is going to explode!

 

[Rich McLean]

Just thought of something, one for the RPIs,

Would a description of the person who gave the false details been taken down by the RPI and filed?

If the above has happened, and the description the RPI took down is available on the day in Court, the description shouldn't match up with the person in the dock (unless they look alike).

But that will probably mean appearing in court, unless this can be proved outside of court

Could someone more knowledgeable confirm of deny the above?

 

[furlong]

You should assume they have some other evidence, yes - a photograph or good description, a signature, and most importantly the memory of the person who actually dealt with the offender. (If they remain suspicious, they might even check no fingerprints on this letter match ones on the paperwork completed at the scene.)

 

[MummaBug]

Yes I've seen the report, unfortunately the description is similar to him, which I was expecting as him and his friends (not very nice friends obviously) are all very similar. That sounds a load of rubbish, but they do. Unfortunately.
I'm worrying about me helping with the letter. Do I need to state that I have helped him write the letters? As I said he can speak English fairly well, but I've had to help him write this letter.

 

[Rich McLean]

You should assume they have some other evidence, yes - a photograph or good description, a signature, and most importantly the memory of the person who actually dealt with the offender. (If they remain suspicious, they might even check no fingerprints on this letter match ones on the paperwork completed at the scene.)

If that is the case, bank cards, driving licence, other official documents with the signatures on it, together with descriptions, with a good defence "should" have the OPs sisters partner proved innocent and case thrown out.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Yes I've seen the report, unfortunately the description is similar to him, which I was expecting as him and his friends (not very nice friends obviously) are all very similar. That sounds a load of rubbish, but they do. Unfortunately.
I'm worrying about me helping with the letter. Do I need to state that I have helped him write the letters? As I said he can speak English fairly well, but I've had to help him write this letter.

What about documents with signatures on, such as a passport. Is there a chance his friends(s) could have forged his signature as well.

Personally, learning that, it maybe an idea to seek professional legal advice.

 

[MummaBug]

I just want to cry!
This is a nightmare.

 

[furlong]

As long as he's telling the truth, he should have nothing to worry about. Expect them to have robust procedures to deal with this sort of situation - if nothing else, they'll catch the offender next time he tries the same thing.

 

[MummaBug]

Thanks. So we should go ahead with the letters to the train company and the court? Any advice on whether I should state that I have helped him write the letter? I don't want to cause more trouble if I'm meant to say I've helped him write it!

 

[cuccir]

Not at all, there's no problem with getting help to write a letter!

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I'm worrying about me helping with the letter. Do I need to state that I have helped him write the letters? As I said he can speak English fairly well, but I've had to help him write this letter.

If you 'helped him' then that's of no consequence - helping each other is an essential part of any functional society, isn't it?
But, if you had decided some 'story to tell' which you wrote and then you got him to put his name to it, then that would be a deceit, wouldn't it?
That would be wrong. Helping isn't.

If the evidence of appearance does match your son, then you do have a little more work to do, but as you have already noted, young people often present themselves in similar (sometimes almost identical) appearances. That's just making things harder for a Court which has to be convinced that the evidence is true 'beyond all reasonable doubt' - it doesn't make it harder for you and your son. It's the prosecution that has to achieve that high standard of evidence when a prosecution is contested.

But I do want to plant one doubt in your mind. [I hesitate to say this, because it will undermine your resolve to assist and support him or lower your confidence in taking advice on here, and it will fuel the contempt of those on here who claim that I 'call people liars when seeking help on here', but this observation is based only on past experience, not at all on anything that you have written on here, and as such I hope you can accept the doubt I put to you and reach your own decision - one that only you can reach].
When assisting people in your position, I nearly always discover that there is another factor which wasn't immediate apparent, but which changes everything.
Sometimes, a child has simply been trying to please their parents, and in doing so will prefer to lie than to anger or distress them;
sometimes, parents will want to see only the best in their children to such an extent that they cannot see wrongs, even when they do arise;
sometimes, the parents and children get on so well within a narrow field of discussion but not when they stray beyond that field, that so much effort is put into creating a pretence of everying being fine, that unfortunate truths remain hidden;
at sometime, most young people must experiment with truth and lies, with partial truths and developing relationships by saying what is wanted, that it can appear that the truth is something that applies to what people expect to hear.
I have so often found an unfortunate truth late in developing a response - I leave it to you to determine whether this observation might have any bearing on your situation or not. I raise the doubt now only to assist you, not to undermine your wish to do everything you can to help.

 

[LuSiVe]

My young sisters partner has recieved a court summons for a penalty fine.

Dave it's not their son, but sister's partner (I don't know if this changed through the thread). I don't know if that changes your view of anything you said above?

 

[najaB]

I don't know if that changes your view of anything you said above?

I'm not DaveNewcastle, but I can confirm that it doesn't change the pertinence of any of his advice. It would be equally relevant if the passenger was someone the OP had just met that day.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Dave it's not their son, but sister's partner (I don't know if this changed through the thread). I don't know if that changes your view of anything you said above?

Sorry about the mistake, but no, it doesn't change the information I'm giving. It's is emphatically NOT a "view" that I'm putting forward here, and I have absolutely no "view" of MammaBug's family at all!
I am reporting what I have learned from other people who have assisted a close family member in comparable situations. I'm sorry if that wasn't clear.

I'm not DaveNewcastle, but I can confirm that it doesn't change the pertinence of any of his advice. It would be equally relevant if the passenger was someone the OP had just met that day.

Exactly.

 

[MummaBug]

Thank you to everyone for the advice given regarding this.

After writing, rewriting and rewriting the letter again we sent them all recorded, signed for, everything bar a tracking device attached!

I am absolutely delighted to tell you all that the matter has been officially dropped!

I am in total shock but so so so happy!! So on behalf of myself, my sister and her partner we want to say a huge thank you to you all xx

 

[najaB]

Glad to hear it!

 

[ainsworth74]

I'm really pleased to hear it and thanks for coming back and telling us. So often we don't get to find out what's happened!

 

[Merseysider]

Excellent news

Well done for your measured approach.

 

[Puffing Devil]

Thank you to everyone for the advice given regarding this.

After writing, rewriting and rewriting the letter again we sent them all recorded, signed for, everything bar a tracking device attached!

I am absolutely delighted to tell you all that the matter has been officially dropped!

I am in total shock but so so so happy!! So on behalf of myself, my sister and her partner we want to say a huge thank you to you all xx

This is good news! However, for your own peace of mind, and to avoid future issues, you should check with the court that this matter has indeed been dropped. Communication in the court system can be a disaster at times and getting the right message through can be a challenge, as you have discovered.