Diesel new builds/recreations

[Cowley]

I was wondering what peoples thoughts were on the various plans to recreate extinct diesel types?

We have the Baby Deltic project which I personally am looking forward to seeing, having never seen one in action.
The Ivatt diesel group trying recreate one of the LMS twins, who seem to be moving forward.
Also the class 22 scheme which seems to me to be a very difficult thing to achieve.

Are there any other schemes apart from these?
Apologies if this has been covered before.

 

[Clarence Yard]

"Gone a bit quiet" on the Baby Deltic?!

Have look at their Facebook page - they've been doing a lot of work recently with, amongst other things, the new side panels going on.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

I look forward to seeing them if they ever come to life, but there is always going to be far more money in steam restoration, be it new built or rebuilt.

The general public will flock to see Flying Scotsman, Mallard and Tornado, but probably wouldn't even notice if a Baby Deltic went past.

 

[Cowley]

"Gone a bit quiet" on the Baby Deltic?!

Have look at their Facebook page - they've been doing a lot of work recently with, amongst other things, the new side panels going on.

Right, you see I don't do Facebook, I shall now alter what I originally said there and have a word with myself. Sorry

Duly altered after sending myself to my room. Apologies Baby Deltic types.

 

[Clarence Yard]

Right, you see I don't do Facebook, I shall now alter what I originally said there and have a word with myself. Sorry

No worries, I've only recently got on it myself as a way of keeping up with far flung relations and then I got into the railway pages!

 

[A0]

I was wondering what peoples thoughts were on the various plans to recreate extinct diesel types?

We have the Baby Deltic project which I personally am looking forward to seeing, having never seen one in action.
The Ivatt diesel group trying recreate one of the LMS twins, who seem to be moving forward.
Also the class 22 scheme which seems to me to be a very difficult thing to achieve.

Are there any other schemes apart from these?
Apologies if this has been covered before.

I'm slightly intrigued by the LMS Twin one - in that they're using a Class 58 as a 'donor' vehicle - which seems like a bizarre choice.

The Baby Deltic guys are using a Class 37, which does seem to make more sense......

 

[AnonymousUser1]

I'm slightly intrigued by the LMS Twin one - in that they're using a Class 58 as a 'donor' vehicle - which seems like a bizarre choice.
..

similarity of chassis design and dimensions IIRC

 

[ffm]

Yes dimensions and that 10000 was a body on a chassis, not monocoque like the later diesels. Much cheaper than having to have frames constructed and comes with parts to sell and others to reuse. There will be nothing of the bodyshell, which will be a totally new build.

 

[birchesgreen]

I saw the 58 donor a few weeks ago, be sad to see a Bone go but also good to see the finished result.

I'm looking forward to all of them especially the Class 22 which i've always loved even though i've never seen one for real!

 

[Cowley]

I can definitely see the point of using a 58 as a basis for the new LMS twin, although I imagine that fabricating a new body will be pretty expensive.
The class 22 intrigues me. I have spoken to the group at diesel galas a couple of times and they're pretty motivated, I can't remember now if they were going to adapt an existing chassis or start afresh. Either way it's going to be very expensive. Hydraulic traction equipment isn't cheap either just ask the DEPG or DTG.

Going to go on Mrs Cowleys Facebook later and have a look at the Baby Deltic progress

 

[RichmondCommu]

Given that there are plenty of class 08s dumped at Burton I think that a class 13 should be recreated!

 

[Cowley]

Given that there are plenty of class 08s dumped at Burton I think that a class 13 should be recreated!

Absolutely! I'll donate a fiver towards the project that we've all just nominated you to take on. Also you could create a class 30 and a class 48 easily while you're at it.
Oh and 47901 (just phone the LMS diesel group, there should be a few parts going begging).
I would like to be an honorary chairman of your new replica diesel group (ie I don't want to spend any of my own money, I just want to unveil the nameplates that have my name on them).

When I first came on here I asked if anyone had ever considered buying a 47 and converting it to a 48 (apparently they had) and at least two people thought I meant I was going to do it. One person even wished me luck with my venture . Quite sweet really.

RichmondCommus replica diesel company. It's got a nice ring to it.

 

[RichmondCommu]

Absolutely! I'll donate a fiver towards the project that we've all just nominated you to take on. Also you could create a class 30 and a class 48 easily while you're at it.
Oh and 47901 (just phone the LMS diesel group, there should be a few parts going begging).
I would like to be an honorary chairman of your new replica diesel group (ie I don't want to spend any of my own money, I just want to unveil the nameplates that have my name on them).

When I first came on here I asked if anyone had ever considered buying a 47 and converting it to a 48 (apparently they had) and at least two people thought I meant I was going to do it. One person even wished me luck with my venture . Quite sweet really.

RichmondCommus replica diesel company. It's got a nice ring to it.

As it goes as a side line project I'm currently on the look out for the original drawings of the Class 13 and if I can find them I would be tempted to try and recreate one in OO scale. It wouldn't really fit in with my North London based model railway but I would love the challenge!

 

[Cowley]

As it goes as a side line project I'm currently on the look out for the original drawings of the Class 13 and if I can find them I would be tempted to try and recreate one in OO scale. It wouldn't really fit in with my North London based model railway but I would love the challenge!

Hopefully getting an 0 gauge 08 for Christmas, but don't think I'll be getting two. We didn't have too many class 13s around Exeter either thinking about it.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

As it goes as a side line project I'm currently on the look out for the original drawings of the Class 13 and if I can find them I would be tempted to try and recreate one in OO scale. It wouldn't really fit in with my North London based model railway but I would love the challenge!

You'll find the full instructions to do that here:

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/in...ter-and-the-slave-creating-a-br-class-13-pt1/

While visiting the Mickleover Model Railway Show in 2010 I was discussing with a fellow visitor my plans to build a class 13, and how wonderful it would be, having two motors and all, but the chap quickly countered: ‘why use two motors?’ he said ‘wouldn’t it be easier to take one of the motors out’? I must admit, the chap had a good point. I decided that life would be easier if one of the motors was removed, but thought it would be nice to keep the model picking up across both wheel sets.

The two best models to undertake this conversion with are the Hornby and Bachmann 08s. It is apparently easier to modify the Hornby 08 (as it is easier to remove the cab area). Plus the Hornby version is regarded as a superior model. Unfortunately, superiority comes at a price out of my budget range, so I stuck with the Bachmann models.

 

[47403]

how hard would it be to create either of these?

 

[Peter Mugridge]

If you had the funds, you could build a working replica of anything you wanted.

The difficult bit is getting enough funds in the first place.

 

[Cowley]

I'd love to see either of them 403 but especially Kestrel. I've always wondered what it sounded like. 4000 horses would get you up Dainton pretty quickly!

 

[Ash Bridge]

I'd love to see either of them 403 but especially Kestrel. I've always wondered what it sounded like. 4000 horses would get you up Dainton pretty quickly!

What a machine! Don't you thinkHS4000s design is timeless? To my eyes it really doesn't look like something from 1968, just look at any car from that period and it really does look ancient in comparison.

 

[Cowley]

What a machine! Don't you thinkHS4000s design is timeless? To my eyes it really doesn't look like something from 1968, just look at any car from that period and it really does look ancient in comparison.

Definitely. I haven't looked at the Fictitious Liveries site but one in modern GWR would look pretty nice. Mmm

 

[w0033944]

I was going to suggest doing a Clayton or Metrovic "Wonderloaf", but was amazed to find that someone spent their time and energy on preserving one of each!

 

[A0]

how hard would it be to create either of these?

I suspect Lion would be the easier of the two given its similarity to a Class 47 - dimensions, power unit etc.

HS4000 would be wonderful, but I suspect goes under the 'lost forever' category.

A slightly more interesting challenge - again a 47 could be the basis, would be this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_53

 

[Phil.]

I suspect Lion would be the easier of the two given its similarity to a Class 47 - dimensions, power unit etc.

HS4000 would be wonderful, but I suspect goes under the 'lost forever' category.

A slightly more interesting challenge - again a 47 could be the basis, would be this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_53

Ah, the 53. The best type 4 that was never proceeded with.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Ah, the 53. The best type 4 that was never proceeded with.

From an enthusiast/laymans point of view I always thought the same, 2 power units so built in get you home capability should one fail and no weight penalty for this as I think it weighed in very similar to a single engined 47 but with the benefit of a few more horsepower.

 

[Phil.]

From an enthusiast/laymans point of view I always thought the same, 2 power units so built in get you home capability should one fail and no weight penalty for this as I think it weighed in very similar to a single engined 47 but with the benefit of a few more horsepower.

47 = 117 tons. 2,750hp, derated to 2,650 hp, derated to 2,610hp finally reliable at 2,580hp. 95 mph (except for the re-geared 47/7 @100mph).

53 = 115 tons. 2,880 hp. 100 mph.

What's not to like? Well, if you're the B.R.B.'s CM&EE the two Maybach high speed V-12s that powered it. It would have been so much better than the 47 with it's troublesome Sulzer 12 LDA series engine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZZe2VPWbJs

 

[broadgage]

An accurate recreation of some extinct diesel classes is probably a lot more challenging than a steamer.
Building a new and reasonably authentic steamer is hugely costly but very doable as Tornado has shown.

Recreating a diesel locomotive requires the availability of a working authentic power unit, or a reasonably close substitute.
Building a replica power unit is effectively impossible, so if one (and preferably a spare) is not available then a recreation is not viable.

One could of course build a replica frame and body, and fit within this a modern diesel power unit, but that in my view would so different from the original as to not be worth it.

 

[MK Tom]

A Class 13 is such a blindingly obvious idea I don't know why nobody's tried to do it yet. Lop the cab off of an 08, wire it up to another one and call the result 13004.

What I would love to see is a class 41, the big co-co warships. But that would be insanely difficult and costly.

 

[jbqfc]

they is a plan to build a replica of kestrel

http://railtube.info/2016/09/project-kestrel-share-scheme/

 

[Cowley]

they is a plan to build a replica of kestrel

http://railtube.info/2016/09/project-kestrel-share-scheme/

Blimey. Is this a brand new scheme? I don't think I'll be investing straight away...
It says they'll use a new stage 3b emissions power plant but what actually would be the point of this?

 

[Phil.]

they is a plan to build a replica of kestrel

http://railtube.info/2016/09/project-kestrel-share-scheme/

...powered by a?
Certainly not a Sulzer V-16 as per the original so what's the point?