Ticket barriers at Stockport

[northwichcat]

Virgin Trains today moved to reassure users of Stockport station underpass that they would still be able to make their way between the town centre and Edgeley following the introduction of Gate Lines at the station next month.

This will be made possible through the introduction of Guest Passes which will ensure it is business as usual for those who have valid reasons to use the underpass.

The scheme will see Gate Lines introduced at a number of stations along the West Coast Main Line, with the aim of improving the customer experience of those using the trains and address the significant problem of ticketless travel.

A hundred new jobs will be created to support the introduction of the Gate Lines, with seven new Welcome Hosts due to start at Stockport in the coming weeks. In addition to overseeing the Gate Lines they will be there to meet and greet customers, acting as ambassadors for Stockport and where necessary using their discretion to grant access either to the platform or underpass via the Guest Pass for those not intending to travel.

“We understand people are concerned. We have said from the outset that even though the introduction of Gate Lines is one of our franchise commitments we were open to suggestions and it was never our intention to disrupt. That is why we are delighted that with the council’s help we will be introducing the Guest Pass to allow people to continue to get to where they need to be,” explained Gary Iddon, Virgin Trains.

“Our new Welcome Hosts can’t wait to get started and will be there to hand out the Guest Passes. This could be to families wanting to wave off relatives, residents heading into the town centre or football fans making their way to the match.”

Virgin Trains is also committed to working with the local council to improve the signage and awareness of the alternative routes.
"I'm pleased that Virgin Trains recognise the importance of the station underpass to local people and the fact that more people are likely to be using this link in the future, as the station area is being redeveloped as part of the Stockport Exchange scheme,” added Councillor Iain Roberts, Deputy Leader of Stockport Council.

"The introduction of a simple pass system means that people can still walk through the underpass, whilst helping ensure that people can't easily access trains without tickets. The council will work with Virgin Trains to monitor its success and we will review the need for improvements to alternative walking routes on either side of the station."

The Gate Lines will go live on Tuesday 18 August with Welcome Hosts on hand in the two weeks leading up to that day to help answer any questions.

http://www.stockport.gov.uk/newsroo...tandard&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Why don't Virgin just go back to DfT and say "We've looked at ticket barriers at Stockport and it's not practical, so what about our own team of revenue protection inspectors?"

 

[DarloRich]

That will be the subway closed off to none ticket holders in short order then................

 

[telstarbox]

Presumably there's a high level of fare evasion into Manchester as at least half of the trains from Stockport arrive at Piccadilly on the platforms without barriers?

 

[thenorthern]

Presumably there's a high level of fare evasion into Manchester as at least half of the trains from Stockport arrive at Piccadilly on the platforms without barriers?

Very high, particularly on Arriva Trains Wales, Virgin Trains and CrossCountry as previously there were no ticket checks at Manchester Piccadilly for these companies.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Very high, particularly on Arriva Trains Wales, Virgin Trains and CrossCountry as previously there were no ticket checks at Manchester Piccadilly for these companies.

Yes, it's widely regarded as a free service and has been for years.

It looks to me like some minor changes could be made to local roads to reduce the impact of this, then they could close it off. It's not a public right of way, is it?

 

[northwichcat]

Very high, particularly on Arriva Trains Wales, Virgin Trains and CrossCountry as previously there were no ticket checks at Manchester Piccadilly for these companies.

Virgin do now have staff in red jackets checking tickets on the platforms at Piccadilly.

They do a much more through check than the STM people. When I was catching the 17:58 Stockport-Chester the other week and was using a Virgin service from Manchester to connect the Virgin RPI questioned where I was alighting their service when I showed a "Manchester CTLZ to Knutsford Routetockport" ticket.
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That will be the subway closed off to none ticket holders in short order then................

Apart from local residents and people accompanying ticket holders.

 

[dk1]

Is the subway an official right of way then?

 

[northwichcat]

Is the subway an official right of way then?

Google Maps shows it as one, although some people argue it isn't.

 

[Kite159]

Google Maps shows it as one, although some people argue it isn't.

I would imagine Virgin will do something similar to Guildford's "Bridge pass" to allow non-travellers to use the subway to get to the other side.

Or if it is a public right of way, fencing it off so non-travellers can still use the subway but are separated from passengers, similar to the old Reading footbridge.

 

[Ash Bridge]

I would imagine Virgin will do something similar to Guildford's "Bridge pass" to allow non-travellers to use the subway to get to the other side.

Or if it is a public right of way, fencing it off so non-travellers can still use the subway but are separated from passengers, similar to the old Reading footbridge.

It wouldn't be easy to fence off due to the location of the lifts to platforms 1/2 & 3/4.

 

[dk1]

If it isn't an official right of way I wouldn't allow it. Will be open to abuse. People soon find alternatives.

 

[Ash Bridge]

If it isn't an official right of way I wouldn't allow it. Will be open to abuse. People soon find alternatives.

I agree, it's not as if there aren't other ways to access the town centre from the Edgeley side, I could think of two easy alternative pedestrian routes.

 

[David57]

I was at Stockport last year, and was surprised how many staff were checking tickets.

 

[55z]

I would be surprised if it is a public right of way it maybe that someone can claim as one with unrestricted access for at least 21 years. Ticket barriers are going in at Manchester Piccadilly as well.

 

[thenorthern]

I think at Sheffield the footbridge isn't a public right of way although there were plans for it to be made one when East Midlands Trains proposed installing barriers.

 

[johnnychips]

I thought if a route had been used for twenty years it could be claimed to be a right of way. I used to use it in the 70s when going to Stockport County from Mersey Square bus station a lot, and it was the easiest route.

When I was there last week there were perhaps foundations for barriers at the Stockport end, but I didn't see the Edgeley side.

 

[Haydn1971]

The subway is reasonably wide if I recall correctly, possibly wide enough to have a barrier less "bypass" with barriers turned such that they face towards the ends of the main tunnel. No need to barrier the whole area.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Where will be the best place to approach in order to determine the current OFFICIALLY-ACCEPTED right of way status in the said location?

 

[Haydn1971]

Your local council Paul - I'd start by establishing if the subway is an adopted footpath of the council - unlikely I'd say, so then I'd speak with the "rights of way" people in the same council.

 

[ag51ruk]

The subway is reasonably wide if I recall correctly, possibly wide enough to have a barrier less "bypass" with barriers turned such that they face towards the ends of the main tunnel. No need to barrier the whole area.

The lifts are on the other side of the subway to the stairs, so they would be in the "public" area

 

[edwin_m]

This gateing also means that anyone arriving on the Edgeley side won't have access to the ticket office unless they already have a ticket (in which case they wouldn't need access to the ticket office...). I presume they will put a couple of machines at the western end of the subway, and/or have someone on the gates with a portable machine.

 

[narrabeam]

The problem I have is that a number of my local stations do not have a TVM (Ticket Vending Machine). These days you have to buy in advance- so I go to stockport to collect from their TVMs. Edgeley side is my nearest point and you have 20 mins free parking. So I can drive in - use the subway to to the TVM and be away in little more than 5 minutes. Under the new system, I will be required to drive around onto the busy congested A6, then find space and pay to park. This process costs more, causes more congestion & will take 30 minutes instead of 5. Sure the Virgin Meet & Greeters will allow me in to use the underpass - but will they be there at 9pm ? This could be resolved if Virgin installed a TVM on the Edgeley side of the ticket barriers. However, they seem to have a job keeping the existing TVMs working. Alternatively Northern & TPE should install TVMs at ALL stations - but I know I am asking just too much.
Fare evasion ? well if so many ticket offices weren't shut, and so many stations not having TVMs - what do they expect?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I would be surprised if a TVM were not installed on the non-ticket-office side of the station.

 

[Altfish]

Is the subway an official right of way then?

Good question; it didn't used to be.
In the last days of steam, around 1966-68 I was a regular visitor to 9B Stockport Edgeley shed. we used to get off at Stockport and were unable to leave on the Edgeley side of the station, instead you had to head to the A6 and up Greek Street to get to Edgeley. My Ian Allen Locoshed Directory from this era sent you that way.

Not sure when it opened up. Is it open all night, when no trains are running?

 

[Ash Bridge]

Good question; it didn't used to be.
In the last days of steam, around 1966-68 I was a regular visitor to 9B Stockport Edgeley shed. we used to get off at Stockport and were unable to leave on the Edgeley side of the station, instead you had to head to the A6 and up Greek Street to get to Edgeley. My Ian Allen Locoshed Directory from this era sent you that way.

Not sure when it opened up. Is it open all night, when no trains are running?

I think they would lock the doors to the newer concourse area, and shutters at the Edgeley side. In those days (or a bit later as far as I'm concerned)did they not used to have a manned ticket booth somewhere between the subway entrance and the steps to platforms 1&2?

 

[johnnychips]

I think they would lock the doors to the newer concourse area, and shutters at the Edgeley side. In those days (or a bit later as far as I'm concerned)did they not used to have a manned ticket booth somewhere between the subway entrance and the steps to platforms 1&2?

If it was regularly locked at night then that may preclude it from becoming a public footpath by regular use over twenty years.

Neighbours used to come back from the shops to their houses via our back and front gate with my dad's permission as it cut out a lengthy detour, but he always blocked it off once a year, and said that this would prevent it becoming a public footpath.

In a similar vein, you used to be charged 1p to walk down the path through the nature reserve in Lathkill Dale in Derbyshire just on Easter Monday for the same reason, though they don't seem to do this now.

 

[317 forever]

Rather than having 2 sets of gates either side of the underpass, it would have seemed more sensible to have one set of gates at the foot of the stairs to platforms 1 & 2 and another set of gates at the foot of the stairs to platforms 3 & 4. This would have preserved the right of way through the underpass and saved the need for additional ticket-purchase facilities at the other end of the underpass.

 

[DarloRich]

Where will be the best place to approach in order to determine the current OFFICIALLY-ACCEPTED right of way status in the said location?

the local authorities highway department will be able to advise. I have visited several local authorities to investigate the status of adopted/unadapted rights of way and have always been able to arrange a viewing of the "master plan" without trouble.

I assume they will now charge for such advice but i have always had it free of charge.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Rather than having 2 sets of gates either side of the underpass, it would have seemed more sensible to have one set of gates at the foot of the stairs to platforms 1 & 2 and another set of gates at the foot of the stairs to platforms 3 & 4. This would have preserved the right of way through the underpass and saved the need for additional ticket-purchase facilities at the other end of the underpass.

The problem doing it this way would be the 2 passenger lifts serving platforms 1&2 and 3&4 on the other side of the subway, these would then also need some sort of gate or barrier each.

 

[Starmill]

The station is locked up after the last train departs, literally. I was onboard said train once and was thrown out to wait for the Replacement bus to Levenshulme at the bus stop, at midnight, completely by myself. Fun times in Stockport!