Carlisle Overnighter Ban

[jacknottm]

Well said my friend, its just finding the person to send your comments to so it can be investigated !

 

[driver9000]

does Carlisle station close to the public for a few hours after the last train has departed?

 

[jacknottm]

It didnt but does now.

 

[Max]

Can we keep the swearing to a minimum guys? However, I very much hope that this rumoured ban doesn't stay in place. The Carlisle Overnighter seems to be something of an institution amongst railway enthusiasts, and I'm sure it would be bitterly missed if it were made impossible. Frankly, I find it pathetic that all public access to the station at night has been blocked because of ONE person. Clearly the station manager was just looking for a scapegoat :roll:

 

[Nick279]

"Clearly the station manager was just looking for a scapegoat"
yes wellsaid it would certainly appear so, I find this sort of thing unaccetable, these people make a good living from us, its unfortunate all rail enthusiasts couldnt get together under one heading, we would have a very powerful financial voice, how many non-essential jouneys do we make each year, how much do we spend on special tours, enthusiasts specials etc, on a personal basis i`ve spend thousands of pounds over the years, these people need to realise just how dangerous it is to bite the hand that feeds them. I know many of my furends who have seen the changes since privatisation havse simply started spending more more on the privatised network than BR, sadly no one measures these things, but I`m sure it would be a big suprised to the network to find out just how much money these petty, inappropriate, small minded, jobs worth attitudes towards rail enthusiasts are actually costing the network, OUR NETWORK, they dont have the right, its time to re-nationalise and sack the fat cats who are draining the very blood from the network, OK rant over, I`ll get my coat..

 

[Turbostar]

Along the lines of BBC News... 'RailUK tried to get a statement from the Station Manager, but she declined to be interviewed. Enquiries are ongoing.'

 

[Nick279]

keep up, the good work Mart, maybe we couild send the website links, all the sites, to the people higher up, this station manager appear to be ignoring customers, that is again Network Rail policy and the francise contract legislation

 

[Z12XE]

how many non-essential jouneys do we make each year, how much do we spend on special tours, enthusiasts specials etc,

Although dont quote it like that, especially in the current craze of Carbon Footprint, Eco Friendly, Climate Change, Recycled Bog Roll society we are in now

 

[adamp]

Just like everything these days, one person HAS to spoil it for the rest.

 

[P156KWJ]

who would like to knock a letter up to the station manager then?

regards

Andy

I'd be fine with doing that, as my mum's an English teacher I have had quite a bit of help over the years, I am very good at writing to persuade or argue.

 

[andylloyd]

I'd be fine with doing that, as my mum's an English teacher I have had quite a bit of help over the years, I am very good at writing to persuade or argue.

I nominate 156401 then to write on our behalf to the station manager

Cheers

Andy

 

[P156KWJ]

I nominate 156401 then to write on our behalf to the station manager

Cheers

Andy

if someone can give me a few details, i.e.

- if you want them to lift the ban for the RUK meet organised, or a complete lift of it.
- A good reason for the lifting of the ban (obviously I know it's a good cause, but if they are going to take it seriously we need to put a fight forward).
- Who should I say it's from? Just myself, the trip organiser, or simply 'RailUK'?

 

[Gizmogle]

I most certainly do not nominate a 14yr old to write a formal letter.

 

[Nick279]

Although dont quote it like that, especially in the current craze of Carbon Footprint, Eco Friendly, Climate Change, Recycled Bog Roll society we are in now

I wouldnt worry about that, economics wins over the environment every time, everyone gives the enviroment lip service but very few actually do anything about it, they just want to be seen to be doing something about it. No make no mistake the railways are concernd with money and nothing else.

 

[P156KWJ]

I most certainly do not nominate a 14yr old to write a formal letter.

why not? Why is a 14 year old not capeable?? I've written plenty. Think about it, I've had to write them for work experience, my work permit for the GCRN, various other reasons and of course practice from school. Or is this another thing you have against me?

 

[D306]

Along the lines of BBC News... 'RailUK tried to get a statement from the Station Manager, but she declined to be interviewed. Enquiries are ongoing.'

And is that article on BBC News?

 

[Turbostar]

And is that article on BBC News?

Please read the messages posted on here properly! :roll: I was merely making a comment, along the same lines (no pun intended!) as like what happens on BBC when they try to interview someone, & they decline. Hence, if yoou read the messages prior, I was merely making a comment on the station manager refusing to budge & accept any reason to uplift the ban.

 

[Guinness]

Rather than write just one letter, why not write more? The more voices heard - the better!

 

[O L Leigh]

it seems strange that someone who works for the railways hates the very people who pay her wages, are you sure this is right??, if rail enthuisiasts are being victimised and harressed by this person then it needs to be taken to the next level, she may be the station manager, but we need to explain that we havent actually given her the station, she is a public servant working on our behalf and if this woman is prejudice against those with an interest in the business of rail travel, then I dont really feel she is fit and proper to act in a position as a custodian of our railway network.

Sorry to put a dampener on this but, while recognising the strength of feeling, this isn't an entirely accurate picture.

The railway is, as it always has been (yes, even under BR), private property to which there is no inalienable right of public access. Unless you are there on official business or hold a valid ticket to travel, you are effectively tresspassing and have no right to be there. On this basis, the situation is similar to pubs. They are private property and, provided you're buying drinks and behaving yourself, the manager won't throw you out.

The position of the rail enthusiast is a slightly odd one, because they don't always have business there (not all come on the train) but are often permitted to remain because they aren't doing any harm. It's rather like the pub manager allowing you to stay in his pub just so you can ogle the barmaid.

While it would be a shame if Carlisle overnighter's were lost, the station manager is acting entirely within her rights. Every other station is locked down tight to prevent vandalism, crime and vagrancy, so Carlisle was always a bit of an oddity in this respect. As such, I really don't think that giving this lady to the "heavy treatment" is going to cut much ice, because you really haven't had any rights infringed. The overnighter is a local concession at the discretion of the staff (which is why it's such a shame that a thoughtless individual has spoiled it by his/her brainless actions).

Instead of stamping your feet in indignation, would it not be a better idea to try and reassure the station manager that you're all well behaved, don't litter, require minimal supervision, will act in accordance with instructions given to you by staff (including signing in and out, if that makes her happy), won't impede the safe operation of the railway and leave the station clean and tidy in the morning? Go big on the tradition of the Carlisle Overnighter and the prestige of the location. Admittedly she could still say "no" on the basis that she doesn't have to let anyone in, no matter how well behaved they may be, but you might have a better chance by attempting to work with her in addressing whatever concerns she might have rather than slamming her.

Best of luck!!

O L Leigh

 

[Nick279]

Its private property by our say so of course, particulaly in the BR era when it was a public transport system, it has to be as did all the public companies, otherwise they wouldnt be able to operate, that is the way it has to be designed, although at present we have allowed private enterprise to control it, which is fine as long as they still continue to serve the public and an appropriate manner. the station manager is responsible for the people who are on the station proper, as indeed those who are on railway property are also responsible when on that property. If however this person has a genuine predidism against those who take an interest in the rail business and creates alienation with customer types, then I would question that persons ability to work within the public section. of course it is better to resolve these situations in the manner you describe, but without wishing to cause offence, we are dealing with a women here. sorry guys couldnt resist.

 

[adambro]

O L Leigh's comments are very sensible. If anyone is going to start writing letters then they should take the time to really understand the points raised. I'm dreading that we're going to have loads of school kids who can't string a sentence together properly who also don't understand the situation writing letters and causing more harm than good.

 

[Nick279]

yes it can do more harm than good, and I too support O L Leigh`s comments, I dont think the smoking barrel approach would work, diplomacy might however.

 

[JoshW1992]

Real shame about this ban. I havn't myself done an overnighter yet, but I was intending to take a trip up from Kent during the Summer to do one. Let's hope this letter idea works guys, and the ban gets lifted! :cry:

 

[Nym]

just be nice, and wait for a new station manager Offer her some food or somthing if she's there for the night shift, and managers always like orginisation, so have it possibly that it needs to be arranged in a proper group and possibly sudjest a booking system and opening it on certain nights by appointment to said group...?

 

[JoshW1992]

Good idea.. maybe they will allow certain nights in which enthusiasts can visit?

 

[Nym]

I htink maybe a booking system would be better, so that only groups can arrange to go for a night, gives a bit of social responsibility to said group...

 

[TheSlash]

I most certainly do not nominate a 14yr old to write a formal letter.

He did mention his Mum is an English teacher.

 

[Craig]

I believe that Snapper has raised the point with the Virgin press office, so it might be worth waiting to see what becomes of that before sending any letters.

 

[Nick279]

I`m sure a 14 year old is more than capable of writing a constructive and appropriate letter, but why not write a joint letter and edit it on these threads, better still a national petition, these appear to be popular these days, and we could post it on all rail websites for support and then present our case to those at the next level, pointing out the added security the station would recieve while enthusiasts where present and the financial support the enthusiasts bring into the railways and the Carlisle sistuation in general and the extra revenue nationally known Carlisle all night vigil trips bring in to the network

 

[hairyhandedfool]

Some 14 year olds are brilliant writers, its just that people generalise that they are hooded gangsters that terrorise the streets and can't even spell toffee.

The first step should always be a letter, a petition straight off would only get their backs up. Put in lots of nice things about previous experiences and the staff and that you think a resolution can be sought which would be mutually agreeable. Atleast then you are trying to be nice about it, a petition should really be the last resort.