Which route would you use to go to Venice?

[philjo]

I'm planning a trip to Venice.
10 years ago 4 of us went & we used the sleeper from Paris.
I'm going on my own this time & want to look at the scenery so will use daytime trains through Switzerland (as we were asleep during the scenic parts of that journey!
We came back on the Milan-Paris TGV last time so will go through Switerland this time but not yet decided which route to use.
my 3 options are:
1. TGV to Zurich. stay overnight then to Milan & Venice (with possible 4 hr stop to look at Milan cathedral etc)
2. as above stay in Zurich but next day use the 08:40 to Innsbruck & 13:17 from there to Venice - I think this route goes through 2 scecnic passes ?
3. Use Paris-Munich sleeper (which I think is better than the Paris-Vencie one for comfort) then the 11:27 to Venice.

Which would be the better journey in terms of trains used/scenery? Many thanks

 

[30907]

Depends on how much time you have! I'm assuming you are travelling on public fares and booking well in advance for this, and don't mind changing trains.

(1) Via Munich-Venice; it's worth taking the 0832 via the Karwendel route to Innsbruck rather than the main line, even though you have a 2-hour break in Innsbruck - it's a beautiful run. Book this with DB as a Europe Special Italy.

(2) Via Munich-(Tauern Pass)-Villach-(Lake Bled)-Jesenice-Nova Gorica/Gorizia on the Transalpine route through Slovenia. Very scenic and "different". Some info on Seat 61. Europe Special Slovenia plus local train fares.

For both, check out using the Koeln-Muenchen sleeper instead of the Paris one in terms of cost, using your Europe Special ticket.

(3) via Zurich - the obvious route is the Gotthard (though there are also through Basel-Loetschberg Base Tunnel-Simplon-Milan trains), but even more spectacular is to take the Albula and Bernina narrow-gauge route to Tirano, then Trenord local to Milano.
Again details on Seat 61 - cheapest ticket on the Tirano route is a German ES-Switzerland from somewhere like Freiburg im Breisgau, starting short in Basel (it's legal!)

I used 1 and 2 last spring and have booked both the (3) options for this year. PM if you want all the detail.

For scenery - the Bernina must be the best, but all are good.

 

[Greenback]

This is a totally fantasy journey, but I would take the Dutch Flyer overnight, then a day train from Hoek van Holland to Munich. I'd stay a few nights there.

Then, I'd go to Chur in Switzerland for another overnight before taking the Bernina Express to Tirano and on to Milan, conencting there to a Venice train.

As it would take me about a week to get there, I'd have to fly back!

 

[philjo]

Depends on how much time you have! I'm assuming you are travelling on public fares and booking well in advance for this, and don't mind changing trains.

(1) Via Munich-Venice; it's worth taking the 0832 via the Karwendel route to Innsbruck rather than the main line, even though you have a 2-hour break in Innsbruck - it's a beautiful run. Book this with DB as a Europe Special Italy.

(2) Via Munich-(Tauern Pass)-Villach-(Lake Bled)-Jesenice-Nova Gorica/Gorizia on the Transalpine route through Slovenia. Very scenic and "different". Some info on Seat 61. Europe Special Slovenia plus local train fares.

For both, check out using the Koeln-Muenchen sleeper instead of the Paris one in terms of cost, using your Europe Special ticket.

(3) via Zurich - the obvious route is the Gotthard (though there are also through Basel-Loetschberg Base Tunnel-Simplon-Milan trains), but even more spectacular is to take the Albula and Bernina narrow-gauge route to Tirano, then Trenord local to Milano.
Again details on Seat 61 - cheapest ticket on the Tirano route is a German ES-Switzerland from somewhere like Freiburg im Breisgau, starting short in Basel (it's legal!)

I used 1 and 2 last spring and have booked both the (3) options for this year. PM if you want all the detail.

For scenery - the Bernina must be the best, but all are good.

Thanks for your reply.
I am planning to stay in Slovenia (walking near Bohinj) after Venice so will be returning from Jessenice via Salzberg (using the local train & changing at Jessenice).

I'll look at the timings for the Karwendal or Bernina options. at the moment I think it will be the Gotthard route as the new tunnel will probably be open by the time I do that area again so will take the opportunity to experience the current route.

 

[Altnabreac]

Thanks for your reply.
I am planning to stay in Slovenia (walking near Bohinj) after Venice so will be returning from Jessenice via Salzberg (using the local train & changing at Jessenice).

I'll look at the timings for the Karwendal or Bernina options. at the moment I think it will be the Gotthard route as the new tunnel will probably be open by the time I do that area again so will take the opportunity to experience the current route.

I'd recommend the Gotthard route but here's a wee variation on it for you that is worth considering. Instead of overnighting in Zurich consider travelling on to Luzern which I find to be a very nice place to stay.

Then in the morning take the steamer down the Vierwaldstattersee to Fluelen (if you prefer to stay in Zurich just get a train to Luzern in the morning).
http://www.lakelucerne.ch/fileadmin...pläne_2014/Sommer_14/2014_Fahrplan_Sommer.pdf

You could leave at 11.12 and be in Fluelen at 13.55.

Then catch the Interregio to Bellinzona departing 14.15 change for Milan and you can be in Milan at 17.50 and Venice at 20.48.

With an 08.12 boat departure from Luzern you can be in Venice by 17.40.

This is the same route followed by the William Tell Express which charges you a chunk of extra cash in exchange for some food and a first class panroama coach but I think the highlights are the scenery so no need to pay the premium on this particular trip.

Even better get off the boat at Treib for an hour or 2 and get the funicular up to Seelisberg and have lunch looking down on the lake before continuing down to Fluelen and catching your train. Leaving Luzern at 09.12 you could do the Venice arrival at 20.48 this way.
http://www.seelisberg.com/index.php/tsb.html

 

[30907]

Thanks for your reply.
I am planning to stay in Slovenia (walking near Bohinj) after Venice so will be returning from Jessenice via Salzberg (using the local train & changing at Jessenice).

Did Venice-Gorizia-Bled Jezero a year ago - the (electric) bus across Gorizia is easy - buy at the ticket machine not on the bus. (The alternative cross-border bus, if you happen to catch that, is reportedly pay the driver)

 

[philjo]

Thanks for that tip. I take it there is a ticket office at Nova Gorica to get the ticket for the local train to Jessenice? - it looks like these tickets can't be bought online.

Altnabreac - the Luzern detour looks interesting. I'll check out the timings. Is it a same or cross platform change at Bellinzona? I take it that the pier at Fluelen is next to the station (as I will have a suitcase & large rucksack with me)

 

[Altnabreac]

At Fluelen the railway station is literally across a single road from the pier so no problem at all. Some connections at Bellinzona are cross platform though it looks like the 14.15 from Fluelen is currently a platform 2 to 6 transfer so you'd have to change islands but Bellinzona is a fairly small station and its easy enough to get down via the subway.

Just make sure you get a train into Milano Centrale as the SBB journey planner sometimes suggests options involving walking across Milan which isn't a good idea with luggage.

Swiss Railway Museum in Luzern well worth a visit as well if you have any free time there.

 

[30907]

Thanks for that tip. I take it there is a ticket office at Nova Gorica to get the ticket for the local train to Jessenice? - it looks like these tickets can't be bought online.

Yes. Big station building with bar and ticket office but not many passengers!
And the fare to Bled Jezero last year was EUR6.22 IIRC.

 

[philjo]

Thanks for your replies.
out of interest is there a 1 day (or 2 day) travel pass available in Switzerland - I could only see one that had to be used in conjunction with a half fare card which I don't have.
I'm thinking of spening 2 nights in Luzern/Zurich or Interlaken & using the middle day to do some lines in Switzerland, going onto Milan & venice the day after. looking what is the cheapest option at the moment. - I could do a 5 in 10 interrail I suppose but the TGV from Paris to Switzerland & the trains to Milan/venice require supplements/reservations which may make it as cheap not to.

 

[Altnabreac]

Your best bet may be a Swiss Card or Swiss Transfer Ticket depending on how much mileage you want to do on your middle day.

Technically these are both valid for 1 journey from the border (or airport) to your destination and then on to the border again another day (of your choice, within a month).

In practice you can use them pretty much as much as you want on the two days as long as you aren't heading up dead end valleys. For instance I have done Zermatt - Zurich Airport via Chur (a very indirect route indeed!) on a Transfer Ticket without any issues.

The Swiss Card is the same as the Transfer Ticket but also gives you 50% off journeys while you are there. This is the best option if you just want to make 1 or 2 journeys on the middle days.

If you are looking to do lots of mileage on the other days then a 4 day Swiss Pass is probably your best option although its worth checking out local rail passes like the Tell Pass for Luzern and the Bernese Oberland Pass for Interlaken depending on your plans. Local passes sometimes have better discounts on funiculars / cable cars and if you're planning to go to Jungfraujoch for example a specific Jungfrau pass may be best combined with a Transfer Ticket.

Really depends on your itinerary as to what's the best option!