Ashington, Blyth Tyne - Network Rail commissioned for study

[swt_passenger]

smelter is long gone !

Do you mean out of use? By sheer coincidence I drove past on the way to Druridge bay a couple of days ago, the site still looks like it always did, even if shut?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

https://www.teesvalleyunlimited.gov.uk/media/39872/metro_progress_report.pdf

Many thanks for this link.

 

[Stats]

Do you mean out of use? By sheer coincidence I drove past on the way to Druridge bay a couple of days ago, the site still looks like it always did, even if shut?

The smelter closed last year and demolition will commence this summer.

 

[swt_passenger]

The smelter closed last year and demolition will commence this summer.

That's exactly what I thought. I was puzzled by the earlier report of it being 'long gone', that's all...

 

[JohnCarlson]

These two stories might indicate potential traffic in the area.

Massive opencast mine planned near Druridge Bay
17 Jul 2013 08:42

Proposals have been unveiled by Banks Mining for a massive new opencast coal mine near Druridge Bay in Northumberland


http://www.thejournal.co.uk/news/north-east-news/huge-druridge-bay-opencast-mine-5117230

Lynemouth Power plant in Northumberland faces closure unless it converts to operating exclusively on wood pellets. Peter McCusker reports

http://www.thejournal.co.uk/business/business-news/battle-between-jobs-helping-enviroment-5117467

John

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Massive opencast mine planned near Druridge Bay
17 Jul 2013 08:42

Proposals have been unveiled by Banks Mining for a massive new opencast coal mine near Druridge Bay in Northumberland


http://www.thejournal.co.uk/news/north-east-news/huge-druridge-bay-opencast-mine-5117230

The matter of the beach at Druridge Bay will be something that will surely bring much feedback to these proposals from a number of interested parties.

Whilst the nearness of Widdrington, with its long historical records of affecting the life of that area, will certainly bring this proposal under the intense gaze of major conservation bodies, should an increase in any associated HGV traffic be stated in the proposals.

Widdrington still has a rail connection onto the ECML, which could be one item to consider.

 

[JohnCarlson]

Many thanks for this link.

While supporting the Tees Valley Metro I wonder if developing the direct connection between Teesside and York and then to Leeds would be a better growth driver than the connection to Darlingtron.

John

 

[TBY-Paul]

While supporting the Tees Valley Metro I wonder if developing the direct connection between Teesside and York and then to Leeds would be a better growth driver than the connection to Darlingtron.

John

I'm with you, regards supporting the Tees Valley Metro. But think there is a need to maybe extend the line to Guisborough (most of the trackbed is still there). Guisborough is a much bigger place that it was in 1964, and again Guisborough appears to growing towards Nunthorpe, so a station at somewhere like Pinchinthorpe will eventually be in the middle of an extended Guisborough. I realise Nunthorpe Parkway is meant to cater for the likes of Guisborough and Stokesley passengers, but the way the area around Nunthorpe, Guisborough, Great Ayton & Stokesley are developing , I can see Nunthorpe parkway being swamped in years to come.

Also, as a further enhancement, seeing as Thornaby and Middlesbrough are due to be interchange stations between the two lines (Darlington-Saltburn, Hartlepool-Nunthorpe), it would be good to see someone like Grand Central serve Thornaby and Middlesbrough once or twice a day, giving Middlesbrough a direct link to London once again.
Personally, I was somewhat disappointed last year when Grand Central announced the extra service from Kings Cross that only went as far as Hartlepool. I think it would have been a good opportunity to test the water so to speak, and instead of going from Eaglescliffe to Hartlepool, it could of gone from Eaglescliffe to Thornaby and Middlesbrough. Sunderland and Hartlepool would still have had four Kings Cross trains a day, But Middlesbrough would have gained one.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

While supporting the Tees Valley Metro I wonder if developing the direct connection between Teesside and York and then to Leeds would be a better growth driver than the connection to Darlingtron.

John

Using the address on the document in the link from stats, I telephoned them and was informed that a further progress report would soon be available on their website for downloading.

 

[swt_passenger]

Re Druridge Bay...

I'm in the area at the moment, and reaction in the local press to the newly proposed opencast site appears pretty much restrained. I think the days of kneejerk refusal to have anything to do with surface mining from 'pressure groups' is no longer happening. Was a very different reaction when this site (Highthorn) was first proposed in about 2007.

For example here's a recent report about approval for Ferneyside, also near Widdrington:

http://www.thejournal.co.uk/news/no...eds-opencast-mine-widdrington-station-4393524

I doubt they'd go right up to the coast with Highthorn. Give it another 10 years and there won't be anywhere left in the Widdrington area to dig anyway, I guess they'll have to start flattening places like Ashington to find more sites...

 

[JohnCarlson]

I'm with you, regards supporting the Tees Valley Metro. But think there is a need to maybe extend the line to Guisborough (most of the trackbed is still there). Guisborough is a much bigger place that it was in 1964, and again Guisborough appears to growing towards Nunthorpe, so a station at somewhere like Pinchinthorpe will eventually be in the middle of an extended Guisborough. I realise Nunthorpe Parkway is meant to cater for the likes of Guisborough and Stokesley passengers, but the way the area around Nunthorpe, Guisborough, Great Ayton & Stokesley are developing , I can see Nunthorpe parkway being swamped in years to come.

Also, as a further enhancement, seeing as Thornaby and Middlesbrough are due to be interchange stations between the two lines (Darlington-Saltburn, Hartlepool-Nunthorpe), it would be good to see someone like Grand Central serve Thornaby and Middlesbrough once or twice a day, giving Middlesbrough a direct link to London once again.
Personally, I was somewhat disappointed last year when Grand Central announced the extra service from Kings Cross that only went as far as Hartlepool. I think it would have been a good opportunity to test the water so to speak, and instead of going from Eaglescliffe to Hartlepool, it could of gone from Eaglescliffe to Thornaby and Middlesbrough. Sunderland and Hartlepool would still have had four Kings Cross trains a day, But Middlesbrough would have gained one.

I also think Guisborogh need its own station not just access to a parkway station up th road. There is a trackbed of a railway which I think used to run on to Brotton that runs close to the center of Guisborough that could be used to build a new Guisborough Station which could combine the virtues of being central while having space for a parkway. With the building of James Cook Hospital station the line needs more trains anyway.

If you look at the map, building a new rail connection crossing the Tees between Port Clarence and the Eastern side of Middlesborough station would allow GC to serve Middlesborough AND Sunderland and dramatically cut times between Hartlepool and Middlesborogh.

 

[Bevan Price]

The cost of an extension to Newbiggin would be too high for the cost benefit ratio so would never happen unfortunately.

Regarding the operation of the line, at one point there was an analysis of tram-train operation - by ordering trams at the same time as the Tees Valley Metro tram-trains through economies of scale however, in the light of the economic situation, I suspect this will now never happen.

With a population of under 6000, Newbiggin is probably too small to sustain an economic rail passenger service. Ashington (27000) and Blyth (35000) come into a category of towns that should never have lost their passenger services, but Marples-Beeching short term vision meant that their services were killed rather than developed.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I also think Guisborough need its own station not just access to a parkway station up th road.

For 110 years, from 1854 to 1964, Guisborough was the terminal station on what orginally was the Middlebrough and Guisborough Railway. A road now cuts through what was the station area.

 

[bluenoxid]

I also think Guisborogh need its own station not just access to a parkway station up th road. There is a trackbed of a railway which I think used to run on to Brotton that runs close to the center of Guisborough that could be used to build a new Guisborough Station which could combine the virtues of being central while having space for a parkway. With the building of James Cook Hospital station the line needs more trains anyway.

If you look at the map, building a new rail connection crossing the Tees between Port Clarence and the Eastern side of Middlesborough station would allow GC to serve Middlesborough AND Sunderland and dramatically cut times between Hartlepool and Middlesborogh.

They can't afford a proper bridge in Wearside ...

I love the idea of diverting that service to Middlesbrough.

It would be good to see service enhanced on the corridors to Nunthorpe, Darlo and Sunderland. There is a really good opportunity to develop services here.

I think economic reality has muted a number of blockers to proposals such as open mining.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I love the idea of diverting that service to Middlesbrough.

Table 26 in the October 1950 Bradshaw timetable shows services:-
Guisborough
Huton Gate
Pinchinthorpe
Nunthorpe
Ormesby
Middlesborough

Mind you I was only 5 years and 6 months old at that time..

 

[TBY-Paul]

I also think Guisborogh need its own station not just access to a parkway station up th road. There is a trackbed of a railway which I think used to run on to Brotton that runs close to the center of Guisborough that could be used to build a new Guisborough Station which could combine the virtues of being central while having space for a parkway. With the building of James Cook Hospital station the line needs more trains anyway.

Most of the trackbed is in place apart from a half mile area around the old Hutton Gate station which has been built over, so I don't think the line could ever be built in or near the old station location. That's why I suggested Pinchinthorpe as a possible location.

There is still about three quarters of a mile of trackbed to the east of Pinchinthorpe (currently part of Guisborough forest walkway), which has open fields on the north side (a steep hillside lies to the south), that area would make for a great terminus location. But it would need to be built sooner rather than later, before houses are built in that area. Because Guisborough has hills to south, and a landfill site to the north it more likely that that any future expansion is going to be west, which would put Pinchinthorpe (east) in the idea location.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If you look at the map, building a new rail connection crossing the Tees between Port Clarence and the Eastern side of Middlesborough station would allow GC to serve Middlesborough AND Sunderland and dramatically cut times between Hartlepool and Middlesborogh.

That's something that would need a tunnel, which is doable, The easiest being the way the new Tyne Tunnel was built, pre-constructed sections built in a dry dock, floated in position and sank on the river bottom, but the problem then becomes how do you link the tunnel from Port Clarence to the Durham coast line.

The most obvious route would be to go directly north and link in just East of Greatham, but most of that land is reclaimed land and wetlands, especially around Greatham Creek.
The alternative would be to pick up the old Port Clarence line heading west, and put a shorter link heading north from Haverton Hill to Cowpen Bewley, picking up the Durham coast line just north of where the A1185 crosses the line.

Either route would have massive benefits but wouldn't be cheap. But something needs to be done to include Middlesbrough into Grand Central's portfolio.

 

[JohnCarlson]

Rather than stopping at Pinchinthorpe I would keep on going but up the old line to Brotton and stopping on the bridge over the road wich is pretty much due south of the old staion site.

Thois wouold be mich more central and still give space for car parking.

John

 

[TBY-Paul]

I also think Guisborogh need its own station not just access to a parkway station up th road. There is a trackbed of a railway which I think used to run on to Brotton that runs close to the center of Guisborough that could be used to build a new Guisborough Station which could combine the virtues of being central while having space for a parkway. With the building of James Cook Hospital station the line needs more trains anyway.

If you look at the map, building a new rail connection crossing the Tees between Port Clarence and the Eastern side of Middlesborough station would allow GC to serve Middlesborough AND Sunderland and dramatically cut times between Hartlepool and Middlesborogh.

Rather than stopping at Pinchinthorpe I would keep on going but up the old line to Brotton and stopping on the bridge over the road wich is pretty much due south of the old staion site.

Thois wouold be mich more central and still give space for car parking.

John

Whilst I agree that continuing the line through to Brotton, and linking it up to the Boulby Potash line would be idea, there's no getting past the fact that three quarters of a mile of trackbed between Hutton lane and Pinchinthorpe looks like it has been built on, so unless your saying demolish the houses, I can't see how the full length can be re-instated.

Having never walked the old trackbed route in the Hutton Village area, I'm sure how many houses are on the trackbed, but looking at Google maps, its the only area where the old trackbed is not clearly visable. If there are only 1 or 2, then yes it might be possible to demolish them, but if there are more, it becomes more of a problem.

 

[JohnCarlson]

Whilst I agree that continuing the line through to Brotton, and linking it up to the Boulby Potash line would be idea, there's no getting past the fact that three quarters of a mile of trackbed between Hutton lane and Pinchinthorpe looks like it has been built on, so unless your saying demolish the houses, I can't see how the full length can be re-instated.

Having never walked the old trackbed route in the Hutton Village area, I'm sure how many houses are on the trackbed, but looking at Google maps, its the only area where the old trackbed is not clearly visable. If there are only 1 or 2, then yes it might be possible to demolish them, but if there are more, it becomes more of a problem.

I only meant use that trackbead as far as Guisborough, not all the way to Brotton>

I would guess al the trackbeds we could use have ceased to be designated as railways so the if houses are in the way it might be as well to divert the line. I think the same happened with the Tyne and Wear Metro extension around the Pallion area.

 

[JohnCarlson]

I only meant use that trackbead as far as Guisborough, not all the way to Brotton>

I would guess al the trackbeds we could use have ceased to be designated as railways so the if houses are in the way it might be as well to divert the line. I think the same happened with the Tyne and Wear Metro extension around the Pallion area.

This is the area I meant.

John

 

[TBY-Paul]

This is the area I meant.

John

I did think that was where you meant. It just south of the original Station(which was just north of the Cricket pitch in the picture), and is the idea location. The problem is how to get the line there in a cost effective way.

If you look a little west, just off the view you have captured.(Sorry I don't know how to capture an image off Google maps).

The old trackbed, heading west, runs parallel to the south side of Hutton lane, as far as The Avenue. Once you get as far as The Avenue you run into an area of new housing (Hutton Village road and Sandwood park area) some of which has been built on the old trackbed. It might be possible to divert the line south of this area. The new alignment would only need to be 50 yards or so south, depending on how many obstacles are in the way.

But as a quick, easy and relatively cheap solution, a parkway station between Pinchinthorpe and Hutton Gate might be the way to go, for now. There would be nothing to stop it becoming a through station at some time in the future depending on demand, and how much money is available for any extensions to the system.

 

[JohnCarlson]

I did think that was where you meant. It just south of the original Station(which was just north of the Cricket pitch in the picture), and is the idea location. The problem is how to get the line there in a cost effective way.

If you look a little west, just off the view you have captured.(Sorry I don't know how to capture an image off Google maps).

I just did a Print screen into photoshop if that helps.

But as a quick, easy and relatively cheap solution, a parkway station between Pinchinthorpe and Hutton Gate might be the way to go, for now. There would be nothing to stop it becoming a through station at some time in the future depending on demand, and how much money is available for any extensions to the system.

Well indeed something is better than nothing. However I sometimes find it strange that when we talk of improving local heavy rail services we assume an absolute bargain basement approach but when it comes to metros and tramways seem much happier with the idea of demolishing things and striking out with new lines.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Has there ever been any consideration to reopening the line through to the former terminal station of Newbiggin-by-the-Sea. In a Bradshaw 1950 timetable (Table 74) that I saw some time ago, there was quite a regular service from Newcastle (Manors).

Paul I think a complication of running out to Newbiggin is that if we are having one train an hour and the journey time between Ashington and Newcatle is 40-45 min then we need two units to run that service but extending to Newbiggin might push the requirement to three.

Also please bear in mind that the Blyth and Tyne is effectively two loops joined together by a longish section of single track which has one or more tight curves on it and that there are proposals for at least one, but probably three, stations on the single track section.

Loops might indeed get built but Newcastle to Ashington services might need a bit of recovery time at each end.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

What is locally thought of the Arriva Northumbria X21 service from Newbiggin to Newcastle ?

 

[transmanche]

What is locally thought of the Arriva Northumbria X21 service from Newbiggin to Newcastle ?

It's busy. Combined with the X20 & X22, there are seven buses an hour between Ashington and Newcastle - which is the primary corridor for the three routes.

Evening and Sunday services - which for a long time were hourly - now run every 30 mins.

With a journey time of 45 mins (off peak) to 60 mins (peak) - or 40/50 mins on the X20 - it will be tough for any rail connection via Northumberland Park that involves having to change to Metro to get into the city.

Locally, many people would prefer a connection that was an extension to the Metro, rather than one which involved a change to heavy rail.

 

[JohnCarlson]

It's busy. Combined with the X20 & X22, there are seven buses an hour between Ashington and Newcastle - which is the primary corridor for the three routes.

Evening and Sunday services - which for a long time were hourly - now run every 30 mins.

With a journey time of 45 mins (off peak) to 60 mins (peak) - or 40/50 mins on the X20 - it will be tough for any rail connection via Northumberland Park that involves having to change to Metro to get into the city.

Locally, many people would prefer a connection that was an extension to the Metro, rather than one which involved a change to heavy rail.

Although if you want the Metro into the city center you would probably just change at Central Station. The advantage of this service would begin to show if it ran on to the Metrocentre or to Washington via a new Leamside line.

 

[edwin_m]

It's busy. Combined with the X20 & X22, there are seven buses an hour between Ashington and Newcastle - which is the primary corridor for the three routes.

Evening and Sunday services - which for a long time were hourly - now run every 30 mins.

With a journey time of 45 mins (off peak) to 60 mins (peak) - or 40/50 mins on the X20 - it will be tough for any rail connection via Northumberland Park that involves having to change to Metro to get into the city.

Locally, many people would prefer a connection that was an extension to the Metro, rather than one which involved a change to heavy rail.

If you're suggesting a shuttle from Northumberland Park to Ashington, then that's never been on the cards as far as I'm aware, and it certainly isn't what they want to take forward now.

A junction between the two systems at Northumberland Park might allow a Metro branch to Ashington using the same track-sharing principles as the Sunderland line. However this would be a lot more expensive due to electrification etc, probably not do-able within the existing Metrocar fleet, and would also be slower into Newcastle because of the longer route and extra stops. This option isn't currently on the table either.

 

[richardrichard]

I really do hope that the ABT line is reopened to passenger services (using heavy rail) as I for one would use the service on a daily basis. Currently, if I want to get into town (Haymarket being the only destination available) it takes around 50 minutes for me to get there using the X10/11 service from Newsham in Blyth.

I can, however, drive to Cramlington rail station and be in Newcastle Central Station within 17 minutes of boarding the train, or Manners station - to the east of the city - within 13 minutes. I for one, don't want to be dependent on using a car, but currently I feel I have no choice.

The ABT line is a fully-functioning freight-line and while it will cost £millions to build stations etc., I believe it will pay for itself in time and help to reduce congestion on our roads.

Not only will the line help to link Northumberland with Tyneside, it will also give Southeast Northumberland the vital link to other National Rail services that it needs.

Fingers-crossed it get the go-ahead.

 

[JohnCarlson]

I really do hope that the ABT line is reopened to passenger services (using heavy rail) as I for one would use the service on a daily basis. Currently, if I want to get into town (Haymarket being the only destination available) it takes around 50 minutes for me to get there using the X10/11 service from Newsham in Blyth.

I can, however, drive to Cramlington rail station and be in Newcastle Central Station within 17 minutes of boarding the train, or Manners station - to the east of the city - within 13 minutes. I for one, don't want to be dependent on using a car, but currently I feel I have no choice.

The ABT line is a fully-functioning freight-line and while it will cost £millions to build stations etc., I believe it will pay for itself in time and help to reduce congestion on our roads.

Not only will the line help to link Northumberland with Tyneside, it will also give Southeast Northumberland the vital link to other National Rail services that it needs.

Fingers-crossed it get the go-ahead.

Just a thought but how about a Tram Train from St James's Via monument and Manors then connecting onto the ECML and then Blyth and Tyne with the next stop being Northumberland Park. The new Connection between the Metro and ECML would take some money but it would mean the service was fast into Newcastle city Centre.


John

 

[Boysteve]

Just a thought but how about a Tram Train from St James's Via monument and Manors then connecting onto the ECML and then Blyth and Tyne with the next stop being Northumberland Park. The new Connection between the Metro and ECML would take some money but it would mean the service was fast into Newcastle city Centre.


John

Err, so are you suggesting a link to the East of Manors where the Metro runs alongside the ECML before climbing onto the Byker viaduct? I know there is some junction work there to allow T&W metros to run from Gosforth Depot-Jesmond Jcn-Manors-East of Manors where the driver changes ends to head back through Manore to St.James.

 

[JohnCarlson]

Err, so are you suggesting a link to the East of Manors where the Metro runs alongside the ECML before climbing onto the Byker viaduct? I know there is some junction work there to allow T&W metros to run from Gosforth Depot-Jesmond Jcn-Manors-East of Manors where the driver changes ends to head back through Manore to St.James.

Lets just say I am wondering how feasible it would be. It would have the advantage of giving direct access to the city center with a reasonable journey time. It would take some money of course.

John