Salisbury to Basingstoke on a Fareham to Basingstoke season

[rwuk]

Hi,

I've got an annual season ticket from Basingstoke to Fareham, which I've previously used to travel that journey, via Salisbury, on more than one occasion. This was on the advice of a member of staff at Fareham who told me that its a valid way to make the journey (though I'm well aware that this falls under "the man on the platform says" if they were incorrect).

I've just made the return part of a Salisbury->Basingstoke journey, for which the guard accepted my season ticket on the outbound journey but the guard on the return journey refused and required me to buy a ticket.

In short - was the Guard on my return journey correct, or should I contact South West Trains and request a refund?

Thanks for your time.

 

[bnm]

Basingstoke to Fareham via Salisbury is a permitted route according to the Routeing Guide.

http://www.trainscanbecheaper.info/...SAL&v2=&v3=&v4=&v5=&ShowRoute=N&AnalyseMaps=Y

Booking engines will also sell tickets for such a journey.

So yes, do contact SWT and request that refund.

 

[maniacmartin]

This is another case where the map in the routeing guide doesn't match the layout of tracks on the ground! (Map MW around Salisbury, Basingstoke and Eastleigh)

I believe it is mapped on map MW, and if NRE and also thinks so then yes I would be requesting a refund

 

[swt_passenger]

I wonder how soon they'll add a negative easement?

They already took action to prevent Salisbury to Waterloo via Southampton, which I guess uses the same map or maps?

 

[Muzer]

Though it seemed counter-intuitive at first, I can see Basingstoke to Fareham via Salisbury working - though I don't suppose it's ever any faster?

Salisbury to London via Southampton, on the other hand, just seems a ridiculously long route to me.

 

[Matt Taylor]

It's nice to know these things, but seeing as I work the Fareham to Basingstoke line on a regular basis it would be great if we could have an easy way of verifying things like this swiftly. We can call the retail desk but you'll be lucky to get reception south of Basingstoke.

 

[MichaelAMW]

Though it seemed counter-intuitive at first, I can see Basingstoke to Fareham via Salisbury working - though I don't suppose it's ever any faster?

Salisbury to London via Southampton, on the other hand, just seems a ridiculously long route to me.

I would say I disagree. Salisbury - London via Southampton is less of a diversion, particularly percentage wise, than Basingstoke - Fareham via Salisbury. Moreover, in the days (BR) of only a two-hourly service from Salisbury to London it was considered "reasonable" to change at either Basingstoke or Southampton to make a connection in between those times. It was of some help that, certainly in some years, the connections at Southampton were into and out of the the fast Weymouth service, i.e 0 or 1 stops to/from Waterloo.

 

[Eagle]

There are still tickets Salisbury–London routed "Via Southampton" though. Priced slightly higher than the Any Permitted ones, expectedly.

 

[Solent&Wessex]

It's nice to know these things, but seeing as I work the Fareham to Basingstoke line on a regular basis it would be great if we could have an easy way of verifying things like this swiftly. We can call the retail desk but you'll be lucky to get reception south of Basingstoke.

The easiest way is to use the NRES mobile site, search something like Fareham to Basingstoke via Salisbury and see what fare it gives you. If the fare is the same as the Fareham to Basingstoke ticket then it is valid. If it is more then it likely isn't.

 

[Matt Taylor]

If I have no signal for a phone call to the retail desk I have absolutely zero chance of getting mobile data.

 

[QJ]

I wonder if some changes to the permitted routes in the Southampton and Fareham area have been made recently.

I make a once a week return journey to Netley from Basingstoke / Winchester in the summer months. Up to this year I seemed to be permitted to make the journey via Fareham or via Southampton making use of an easement between St. Denys and Southampton Central. I used to get a pocket timetable print out of train times from National Rail Enquiries that showed both routes.

I find I am now restricted to the route via Southampton only. This limits me to one train an hour rather than the two trains per hour previously. The route via Southampton means I am going to be late arriving and departing Netley every time I make the journey. The route via Fareham was better timed to fit in with the reason for my journey particularly for returning home.

There now seems to be a price differential that I don't recall being there before. The price of rail travel from Winchester to Netley via Fareham is now double the fare via Southampton Central. The on line request through National Rail Enquiries for train times still brings up both routes on a next service enquiry but only the Southampton routing on the printed timetables.

 

[maniacmartin]

Regarding Netley to Basingstoke journeys, Fareham now fails the fares check when to be appropriate Routeing Point for this journey.

Strangely, the booking engines reject via Fareham too, evne though they supposedly use NFM64 to calculate Appropriate Routeing Points.

 

[SickyNicky]

I wonder if some changes to the permitted routes in the Southampton and Fareham area have been made recently.

The current map MW in the unpublished electronic version of the routeing guide still allows travel via Salisbury.

The latest map MW can be seen here.

 

[rwuk]

I've received a response from SWT and to paraphrase:

• 
  I'm going to receive a full refund

• 
  The routing guide and journey planner will be "corrected" as this shouldn't be valid

Until such time as they do I'll be keeping the letter in my bag to present if my journey is queried in the future.

Thanks to everyone for taking the time to respond to my question.

 

[yorkie]

The routing guide and journey planner will be "corrected" as this shouldn't be valid

Any ticket that allows travel via a route that is more expensive will be "corrected" by withdrawing it if they can possibly get away with it. In a very small number of cases, they can't do anything about it. But in many cases, they can. And there's no effective ombudsman to stop them!

Hence why many of the best anomalies never get mentioned anywhere that pricing managers (or people who look out for anomalies on their behalf) can see them!

When it does go, be sure to pop in an FOI request to Passenger Focus to see if they objected (and if not, why not?), and an FOI request to the DfT to see if they approved the change (if they don't, it's not a legal change).

 

[maniacmartin]

First of all, be vigilent. Instead of altering the map or permitted maps, this will may be "corrected" with a negative easement, which you can miss if you are not checking it in detail.

Secondly, I don't know how much time is remaining on your season ticket, but I would argue that the routes that were permitted when you bought the ticket remain permitted for the duration of the ticket's dated validity, as that is the routes that were referenced when the contract was formed. SWT may take a different view.

 

[LateThanNever]

Secondly, I don't know how much time is remaining on your season ticket, but I would argue that the routes that were permitted when you bought the ticket remain permitted for the duration of the ticket's dated validity, as that is the routes that were referenced when the contract was formed. SWT may take a different view.

Legally the contract when you bought the ticket is valid for the duration of the contract so it cannot be altered without your agreement mid term - or at any time!

 

[swt_passenger]

Fareham to Basingstoke via Salisbury has now been amended out of the RG - the only route now permitted seems to be via Eastleigh, using new Map XR. This is a very simple map based on routes via Eastleigh, and it appears not to even allow travel via Southampton Central.

Previously, the route was allowed on maps MW, WW, and WW+CW. This seems to have been a hammer to crack a nut...