Government Spending Review

[LNW-GW Joint]

This from the Telegraph web site: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/101...-families-hampers-Osbornes-spending-deal.html

(from George Osborne's planned speech to the Commons on 26 June)
Today I am setting out a long term infrastructure plan to power Britain back into the economic premier league.
We’re saving money on welfare and waste to invest in the roads and railways, schooling and science our economy needs to succeed in the future

So what does this mean for rail?
Some new infrastructure project approved?
Time for Gospel Oak to Barking electrification at last?
It might just coincide with the Thameslink rolling stock contract award.

 

[route:oxford]

So what does this mean for rail?

Would that just be Rail in England?

Or will there be additional funding for Scotland?

If so...

Please a fly-over and realignment for Carstairs...

Open and electrify Alloa-Dunfermline for passenger traffic.

Would also be good if UK Gov were to suggest funding a connection between Borders Rail and Carlisle.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Or will there be additional funding for Scotland?

I should think the formula will generate rail spend in Scotland, but it won't be George Osborne who will announce it.
And I should think any cross-border spend would need joint agreement.
What seems to happen is that the UK announcement allocates an amount of funding for Scotland, Wales, NI etc, but only the England spend is announced in the Commons.
This leaves Edinburgh, Cardiff and Belfast to do their own thing in the devolved areas they control.
Wales is a bit different in that transport spend is almost entirely with Westminster rather than Cardiff.

 

[TheWalrus]

I would like to see Cross Country and Newbury-Cogload electrification with infrastructure improvements on Swindon-Cheltenham, North Cotswolds and Reading to Exeter and Plymouth. I think faster line speeds and electrification to Plymouth would have reasonable benefits.

 

[tbtc]

Its very positive that rail is now one of the top four things listed for the Government to invest in - that wouldn't have been the case five/ ten years ago.

And I agree with any political party that prioritises infrastructure investment - I think that people are slowly realising that this is the way forward.

Plenty of things on my wishlist - but the logical bits to do would be extensions of things committed to in CP5 (e.g. Selby to Hull electrification), not some grandiose new schemes. Plenty to be getting on with in the meantime!

 

[overthewater]

Open and electrify Alloa-Dunfermline for passenger traffic.

Would also be good if UK Gov were to suggest funding a connection between Borders Rail and Carlisle.

What a waste of money that would be, since the actually numbers using the service? I cant see the justification for small amount wishing to travel from fife to Stirling

You would be a lot faster taking the bus for Glasgow

What there should be doing is maybe trying to get more of those Kirkcaldy - linlithgow - Glasgow trains

 

[Goatboy]

I'd rather pay less money to use the existing network than more money to use an improved one.

 

[yorksrob]

I'd rather pay less money to use the existing network than more money to use an improved one.

That only works to a point. As you generate more passengers you need to accommodate them, otherwise people are put off using it and you‘re left with the same number of passengers as before only generating less revenue and leading to a spiral of decline.

 

[87015]

Time for Gospel Oak to Barking electrification at last?

4 car test runs taking place next week (or the one after, can't quite remember what is for what) so the timing would be convenient...

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I would like to see Cross Country and Newbury-Cogload electrification with infrastructure improvements on Swindon-Cheltenham, North Cotswolds and Reading to Exeter and Plymouth. I think faster line speeds and electrification to Plymouth would have reasonable benefits.

I can see some modest extensions to the current wiring plans (eg Newbury-Bedwyn), but not anything big.
There's not a lot of point in authorising projects that can't be delivered in CP5.
GOBLIN might well fit (ticks several boxes), and maybe extensions in Lancs/Yorks.
The freight people keep calling for more wires (eg Felixstowe, Liverpool port).
Are there any light rail projects ready to go?

 

[Mikey C]

I'd be very surprised if GOBLIN electrification didn't start before the next mayoral election in 2016...

 

[northwichcat]

If DfT wants to avoid new orders of DMUs in CP5 then electrification of the Snow Hill lines is really needed, as well as Calder Vale, Liverpool-Manchester via Warrington and Bolton to Wigan, as well as some of the schemes already mentioned in this thread. If not then new DMUs will be needed as even ignoring DDA/Equalities Act some of the Pacers may not last that long.
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This from the Telegraph web site:

So what does this mean for rail?

Just seen the schedule for the Houses of Commons on Wednesday. The spending review follows Prime Ministers Questions. Following the spending review they move on to the HS2 bill. Could that be the main focus of rail in the spending review?

 

[D1009]

I think what is meant by the announcement is that there will be no cutback on what has already been announced, which let's face it is pretty substantial.

 

[DarloRich]

Surely no cuts and a re hash of what has already been announced with the possibility of some sensible small extensions of existing schemes will be the order of the day. I wouldn't be expecting any new mega projects.

Some of the proposals on this thread................................. :roll::roll:

 

[tbtc]

If DfT wants to avoid new orders of DMUs in CP5 then electrification of the Snow Hill lines is really needed, as well as Calder Vale, Liverpool-Manchester via Warrington and Bolton to Wigan

There are a few "quick win" schemes that could be tagged onto CP5 commitments - the ones you've chosen are good examples (I think Warrington Central would have the best case, hopefully there's a little cherry on the cake in this Government announcement like this)

Some of the proposals on this thread................................. :roll::roll:

Admit it, you're waiting for Ladbrokes to open in the morning so that you can lump £1,000 on electrification and four-tracking of the Brigg line

 

[WatcherZero]

I would expect some mention of the amount their giving to the Dft Local Authority Major Capital schemes funding for the next period 2015/16-2019/20 with a indicative initial list of projects a month or so later after the LTB's have submitted their priority lists in late July. Theyve told councils to plan for the same money the last Government gave plus or minus 30% which is per capita based. As an indication thats about £35m for Merseyside and £65m for Greater Manchester over the period before any changes to the formula.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Money definately on the GOB ....

 

[Bald Rick]

Money definately on the GOB ....

T&H please. You should know better.

 

[edwin_m]

T&H please. You should know better.

Fair dos, he's only putting his money where his GOB is.

 

[WatcherZero]

If DfT wants to avoid new orders of DMUs in CP5 then electrification of the Snow Hill lines is really needed, as well as Calder Vale, Liverpool-Manchester via Warrington and Bolton to Wigan, as well as some of the schemes already mentioned in this thread. If not then new DMUs will be needed as even ignoring DDA/Equalities Act some of the Pacers may not last that long.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Just seen the schedule for the Houses of Commons on Wednesday. The spending review follows Prime Ministers Questions. Following the spending review they move on to the HS2 bill. Could that be the main focus of rail in the spending review?

Interesting you should say that, the Daily Mail is claiming an exclusive look at the final design of the HS2 train in an article that looks to be highlighting a possible Conservative revolt on Wednesday, though it appears to be just another concept render. Havent seen a source for this new render though, possibly materials for a new consultation?

It is a bit different to the designs HS2 Ltd has been using so far and still doesnt appear to be a duplex design.

edit: BBC article states that Danny Alexander will announce transport details on Thursday, the day after the Osborne announcement.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

T&H please. You should know better.

Sorry Guv - "The Tottenham and Hampstead Joint Railway" ....

 

[snowball]

It is a bit different to the designs HS2 Ltd has been using so far and still doesnt appear to be a duplex design.

Is duplex a posh word for double-deck or does it mean something else?

 

[northwichcat]

Some of the proposals on this thread................................. :roll::roll:

I'm not suggesting my suggestions would go ahead but if DfT really want to avoid new DMU orders in CP5 then they need to be a lot more ambitious with the electrification program.

There are a few "quick win" schemes that could be tagged onto CP5 commitments - the ones you've chosen are good examples (I think Warrington Central would have the best case, hopefully there's a little cherry on the cake in this Government announcement like this)

I probably should have said Hazel Grove to Sheffield alongside CLC with the Northern Hub proposal being for a half-hourly Liverpool-Sheffield semi-fast and using existing and proposed wires that would then allow an hourly Liverpool-Nottingham electric service and an hourly Liverpool-Doncaster electric service.

 

[Mikey C]

Is duplex a posh word for double-deck or does it mean something else?

Yes, my estate has duplex flats!

 

[YorkshireBear]

HS2 could hit some trouble, its had a lot of bad press recently.

Personally i agree with tbtc and DarloRich... Small schemes added to those already announced. Makes big news but to us they are just small items. If anything big and new is announced i will be surprised.

 

[WatcherZero]

Times today suggests the highlight of transport spending will be £1.4bn for widening of the A14 and building two new roads around Cambridge possibly with toll charges on a 14 mile stretch of repaved road to act as a freight corridor for road freight from Felixstowe to the Midlands.

 

[Old Hill Bank]

Times today suggests the highlight of transport spending will be £1.4bn for widening of the A14 and building two new roads around Cambridge possibly with toll charges on a 14 mile stretch of repaved road to act as a freight corridor for road freight from Felixstowe to the Midlands.

If next to no one will pay to use the M6 toll why on earth do they think another toll road is the way to go!!!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If DfT wants to avoid new orders of DMUs in CP5 then electrification of the Snow Hill lines is really needed, as well as Calder Vale, Liverpool-Manchester via Warrington and Bolton to Wigan, as well as some of the schemes already mentioned in this thread. If not then new DMUs will be needed as even ignoring DDA/Equalities Act some of the Pacers may not last that long.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Just seen the schedule for the Houses of Commons on Wednesday. The spending review follows Prime Ministers Questions. Following the spending review they move on to the HS2 bill. Could that be the main focus of rail in the spending review?

I dont think that Snow hill lines will get wired anytime soon unless the Worcester triangle gets re-modelled and re-signalled at the same time and neither are are in CP5, Worcester is possibly in CP6 and I think wires for the Snow Hill lines are CP7 pipe dream. The story on government announcements is that the erstwhile Sec of State for transport will make a statement on Thursday, I'm not holding my breath for much we dont know already!!

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Times today suggests the highlight of transport spending will be £1.4bn for widening of the A14 and building two new roads around Cambridge possibly with toll charges on a 14 mile stretch of repaved road to act as a freight corridor for road freight from Felixstowe to the Midlands.

The Guardian mentions the A14, the Mersey Gateway (new road bridge east of Runcorn) and HS2 Phase 1 as the transport infrastructure projects 2014-20 to be approved on Thursday.
Somehow I don't think NR's CP5 plans will be changed.

 

[WatcherZero]

The rumour is that they may announce projects to be completed as late as 2022 to make the headline investment amount look bigger.

 

[northwichcat]

I dont think that Snow hill lines will get wired anytime soon unless the Worcester triangle gets re-modelled and re-signalled at the same time and neither are are in CP5, Worcester is possibly in CP6 and I think wires for the Snow Hill lines are CP7 pipe dream. The story on government announcements is that the erstwhile Sec of State for transport will make a statement on Thursday, I'm not holding my breath for much we dont know already!!

Like I said in my later post I was saying what I think they should do if they want to avoid new DMU orders in CP5 not what they will do.

Giving a new area relatively new class 172s on lines that aren't currently high priority for electrification would be an excellent way of getting the general public backing plans for electrification as otherwise users of lines not down for electrification will think they'll just get cast-offs until new diesel trains are ordered.
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Somehow I don't think NR's CP5 plans will be changed.

As there is an election between now and the end of 2019 I don't think we can say for certain that CP5 plans won't get reviewed and revised after the next election.

Also some of the CP5 plans are a bit vague at present. For instance, will North TPE get new or cascaded EMUs and what about the soon to be newly electrified local routes around Huddersfield and Leeds?