ScotRail Facebook - stranded teenager

[Ferret]

Steam Power, I completely agree.

 

[SimonS]

So if the guard has been exonerated, at the TOC did not intend to imply fault, why did they say "Please accept our sincere apologies for what happened to your daughter on Monday night. "

Surely you do not apologise so profusely if your employee is innocent. If I was blameless in such circumstances I would be seeking an explanation from my employers.

 

[richw]

I've always been trained whilst working in customer services to show empathy and say something like "sorry you feel this way" or something similar. Apologise for the way the customer feels, not for yours or your company's actions. This in no way admits guilt, but makes the customer feel you care about what they are saying

 

[amcluesent]

Customer service reps will be expected to have 4 or 5 online 'chats' running simultaneously, monitor Facebook and take calls at peak time when the call Q is backing up. They'll just cut&paste template responses which seem the closest match without thinking about it.

N.B After the 'big man' incident, I reckon Scotrail staff thought a mere slip of a girl was an easier mark.

 

[scotraildriver]

The guard has been proved to have done nothing wrong, but as a result of this and several other incidents there is an all employees, all union meeting this week with solicitors/lawyers present to advise us all on what is/isn't legal/acceptable etc with regards to social media and what action we can take against someone who posts pictures etc. So hopefully we will all be clearer after this. Twitter in particular is causing untold grief for employees, mainly pictures taken by people ignorant of what they are actually doing.

 

[A-driver]

The guard has been proved to have done nothing wrong, but as a result of this and several other incidents there is an all employees, all union meeting this week with solicitors/lawyers present to advise us all on what is/isn't legal/acceptable etc with regards to social media and what action we can take against someone who posts pictures etc. So hopefully we will all be clearer after this. Twitter in particular is causing untold grief for employees, mainly pictures taken by people ignorant of what they are actually doing.

That meeting sounds very interesting-wish I was able to go. If you do go along it would be very interesting to hear what comes up, even if by PM on here.

I don't think social media is a bad thing for TOCs but don't like the way it is often used when it comes to staff complaints etc with the social media teams often siding with the passenger with no knowledge of the persons job or without investigation. I know some have said that its just standard customer service but often those tweets and Facebook posts can make an innocent employee look bad.

 

[bluenoxid]

The problem is that Brits apologise for everything as a way to build empathy and a relationship. In addition, Social Media is more likely to be posted closer to the event, when the emotional reactions are likely to be raw. It also means that mischief has to be taken at face value.

The problem with Twitter is that the limited number of characters means that we cannot put the "but" in place that happens everywhere else

For Example

@railforumsmember sorry to hear about that incident involving marmite.

When in a letter and on the phone it would

I am sorry to hear about that incident involving the marmite. This will be looked into. We must remind you that it may only be used in certain ways and the way that you appear to have used it has contributed to the incident.

 

[scotraildriver]

That meeting sounds very interesting-wish I was able to go. If you do go along it would be very interesting to hear what comes up, even if by PM on here.

I don't think social media is a bad thing for TOCs but don't like the way it is often used when it comes to staff complaints etc with the social media teams often siding with the passenger with no knowledge of the persons job or without investigation. I know some have said that its just standard customer service but often those tweets and Facebook posts can make an innocent employee look bad.

I will let you know if anything happens. I found (to my cost) that the public often don't realise the consequences of their tweets etc. I let a toddler have a sit in the drivers seat (always makes their day) at a terminus one day and another passenger tweeted that there was a child in the driving cab! Tea and biscuits with the boss for me!. No harm done after I explained but an annoying waste of everyones time.

 

[455driver]

I let a toddler have a sit in the drivers seat (always makes their day) at a terminus one day and another passenger tweeted that there was a child in the driving cab! Tea and biscuits with the boss for me!. No harm done after I explained but an annoying waste of everyones time.

I can remember one Sunday back in 1999 my 2 lads (5 and 6 at the time) and I were allowed to cab a HST at Plymouth, we had been in there a minute or 2 with the kids taking it in turn to sit in the drivers seat, and the driver announced "I am off to make a cup of tea, they can rev the engine just dont let them touch that one", pointing at the brake, and off he went!

Can you imagine that happening today.

The kids thought it was brilliant.

 

[island]

Electron cards are still being dished out left, right and centre.

No they're not.

Electron is a major VISA product, just no longer in the UK.

I am given to understand that Visa is trying to replace it with the V-PAY scheme because Visa Electron is causing brand confusion, or some other marketing woo.

 

[Darandio]

No they're not.

Yes they are, at least by Halifax on the EasyCash accounts. All new accounts and card replacements are Electron. This amounts to a hell of a lot of new Electron cards being released.

 

[island]

Halifax doesn't sell EasyCash accounts through its branches. You have to apply online or by post. Very few people will bother; those who qualify will open a normal current account and those who don't will go to another bank with less faff. I think the "right, left and centre" bit is over-egging it.

 

[Darandio]

I disagree. In this day and age, the internet is by far the easiest way to open an account.

Maybe the "left, right and centre" part was over egging it, but there will be no shortage of people taking this account and receiving Electron cards, I see 20-30 a week myself.

 

[richw]

Electron cards all start with the prefixes 4026, 417500, 4405, 4508, 4844, 4913, 4917. In work around 20% of our debit card transactions are by Electron cards, and around 10% by Maestro debit cards (these dont work our automated payment system so these always need to speak to us on the phone as they require a start date to process, which automated systems never seem programmed to request a start date.

 

[island]

Maestro is being phased out in the UK and replaced by MasterCard debit, but it's going to be a long while yet.

 

[richw]

Maestro is being phased out in the UK and replaced by MasterCard debit, but it's going to be a long while yet.

The problem with this are that certain regulated industries (loan companies to start, as a lot of customers like to repay by debit card each month) don't/ can't accept credit cards, and the MasterCard debits are registered with credit card prefixes by the issuers so the above industries cant accept MasterCard debits at present.

 

[swj99]

The Malicious Communications Act may well be breached by persons sending malicious complaints in to train companies about staff.

Is there any evidence or suggestion that the complaint contained information which was false and known or believed to be false by the complainant ?

The most simple that is instead of a 'decline' message when a offline transaction is refused a 'refer' message is displayed. A quick phonecall to a referral hotline takes less than 45 secs and a decline or authorisation number is given.

I'm not sure why they don't do this. The same method was used back in the early 90s in shops for charge cards and credit cards on transactions which were over the 'floor limit' of £100. A quick call to the card issuer ensured that sufficient credit or funds were available for the transaction, and that the card wasn't on the stolen list. If all was ok, the call resulted in the issue of an authorisation code which was then written on the transaction slip and guaranteed that the retailer got paid.

..........there is an all employees, all union meeting this week with solicitors/lawyers present to advise us all on what is/isn't legal/acceptable etc with regards to social media and what action we can take against someone who posts pictures etc.

I have to admit it does surprise me sometimes how far people stick their necks out on sites such as twitter / facebook etc, especially considering that in many cases they are laying themselves wide open to defamation claims, prosecutions under the Protection from Harassment Act 1997, The Malicious Communications Act 1988, The Criminal Justice and Police Act 2001, etc etc.

However people who confine themselves to the facts as they know them are are perfectly entitled to make complaints to appropriate authorities in situations when they believe they have a valid complaint.

We've seen examples in cases where people have retweeted things, only to be sued themselves, despite believing that they were entitled to do so if they were 'just repeating what someone else told them'. The rest were waiting for a mate, apparently.

 

[island]

The problem with this are that certain regulated industries (loan companies to start, as a lot of customers like to repay by debit card each month) don't/ can't accept credit cards, and the MasterCard debits are registered with credit card prefixes by the issuers so the above industries cant accept MasterCard debits at present.

They can if they're set up properly. One can obtain a list of MasterCard Debit BINs through one's acquirer.

 

[richw]

They can if they're set up properly. One can obtain a list of MasterCard Debit BINs through one's acquirer.

At present the Mastercard Debit BINs are the same as the Mastercard Credit BINs

 

[TUC]

Easier said than done, as you'd know if you'd read earlier posts!

On the flip side of my criticism of Scotrail here is that one of the more prevalent fare dodges is to present an Electron card that the holder knows can't be accepted. That's not to exonerate the possibly guilty party here, but it does add a little perspective. Oh, and do they accept Electron on the buses? I doubt it, but I bet they accept cash....

That perhaps says more about even further behind the times the bus industry is.

 

[IanXC]

At present the Mastercard Debit BINs are the same as the Mastercard Credit BINs

A BIN is a 6 digit number - each BIN will only be used for 1 specific card type, so that from the BIN a description of the card type and issuer can be given. The 5x xx xx range have probably historically all been listed as Mastercard Credit, however any BIN in that range can quite easily be allocated to debit cards, and it is for the merchant service provider to update the lists used by their terminals and merchants.

 

[island]

At present the Mastercard Debit BINs are the same as the Mastercard Credit BINs

That can't be true, as British Airways and several other merchants I use are set up to distinguish MasterCard credit from debit cards.

 

[Ferret]

Is there any evidence or suggestion that the complaint contained information which was false and known or believed to be false by the complainant ?

You're quoting out of context - my post was in specific response to a question from 455driver, which appears immediately above mine.

 

[Scotrail84]

Yes they are, at least by Halifax on the EasyCash accounts. All new accounts and card replacements are Electron. This amounts to a hell of a lot of new Electron cards being released.

Halifax cardcash cards seem to be the new electrons, they still don't work in the Thyrons though.

 

[island]

Halifax cardcash cards seem to be the new electrons, they still don't work in the Thyrons though.

Cardcash accounts are generally given to kids and those with poor credit so the cards will be set not to authorize offline transactions.

 

[northwichcat]

Cardcash accounts are generally given to kids and those with poor credit so the cards will be set not to authorize offline transactions.

Don't they say "Electronic use only" or similar on the back of the card.

 

[richw]

Don't they say "Electronic use only" or similar on the back of the card.

Yes they do, I had one of the Halifax accounts for when I was making monthly flights with Easyjet, as there was at that time no card fee for Electrons! I can confirm they say electronic use only on the card as I am using that account for everything this week as I have lost my main bank debit card and awaiting on a new card to come for that.

 

[Scotrail84]

Cardcash accounts are generally given to kids and those with poor credit so the cards will be set not to authorize offline transactions.

Yes and the majority know they do not work onboard however they do work in ticket offices and tvm's