Paper Ticket unable to be scanned.

[dlj83]

Recently whilst travelling on a service there was a ticket inspection so I presentedmy annual paper ticket. The ticket inspector scanned her Oyster reader on the front then the back and (slightly raising her voice) said "Your ticket is not valid it gives me no signal" then another inspector came over saw it and said "no you don't need to scan this one"

I thought I'd share this as I found it funny.

 

[bb21]

She was probably in auto-pilot although this is did give me a chuckle.

Where abouts did it happen by the way?

 

[dlj83]

Am not going to make the company or service public as I have wrote a letter of complaint. Had they not of raised their voice as if I was at fault then I'd find I'd understand it.

 

[jon0844]

You got me wondering... My Oyster card is on a Barclaycard (the One Pulse jobbie) so perhaps one day I should just wait for an RPI to come checking tickets and hand over my credit card to see the reaction.

1) They'll notice it's also Oyster and scan it. The end.
2) They'll think I don't have a ticket and want to pay by card, then get all excited about the possibility of a nice easy MG11 and Byelaw 18 (or worse) before I disappoint them and tell them it's my train ticket!

 

[Flamingo]

Whilst the story is amusing, as you describe it here I fail to see why you felt a complaint to the TOC was necessary...

 

[maniacmartin]

Whilst the story is amusing, as you describe it here I fail to see why you felt a complaint to the TOC was necessary...

I agree. Unless the inspector was unusually rude, it does seem like flimsy grounds for a complaint

 

[Wath Yard]

If the complaint results in the TOC concerned amending their training procedures so that employees can tell the difference between a paper ticket and an Oyster card then surely that can only be a good thing.

 

[Flamingo]

Does every minor slip-up in life warrant a written complaint to the employer and is worth considering as a "retraining issue"?

 

[island]

I wouldn't classify an inability to distinguish a paper ticket from an Oyster card minor, but maybe that's just me.

 

[Flamingo]

As BB21 says, she was probably on autopilot.

 

[greatkingrat]

It sounds to me like she was probably a new member of staff being trained by the other RPI.

 

[aleph_0]

Does every minor slip-up in life warrant a written complaint to the employer and is worth considering as a "retraining issue"?

In general, no.

But if the employee's actions result in the customer being wrongly identified as a fare evader in front of other members of the public, then I would say it does warrant a written complaint. If the passenger didn't have a valid ticket, the railways have strong powers to act, even if the reason for not having a valid ticket is a 'minor slip-up' on the passengers part. But with these powers should come responsibility. And one of those should be not to make false accusations.

I would hope that this wouldn't be considered a 'retraining issue' for any particular employee but such complaints might influence how staff are trained to handle such situations.

Or even better, the situation should be made more equitable. So if I accidentally buy the wrong ticket, then the train companies should be able to charge penalty fares, or prosecute. But if the railways wrongly make me purchase a new ticket, the ticket should be refunded with at least a 100% mark-up.

 

[jon0844]

I would have expected that something as basic as identifying a paper ticket and a smartcard would have been done in training before going out into the 'real world'.

But, I certainly wouldn't write in and complain as I can't see how the passenger would come over as a possible fare evader. Everyone else would see what was going on and know the RPI was clearly wrong.

 

[BrianTheLion]

I agree with the OP with regards for complaining.

I'd certainly consider it in this scenario. Train staff are the face of the company, dealing with the public and must at all times be polite, pleasant, helpful, etc...

I think due to the fact that the RPI "slightly raised her voice" draws attention to the ticket holder, thus in turn causing potential embarrassment for this individual.

I dont want to travel on the train, minding my own business, for suddenly half the train to be staring at me wondering whats going on... would you?

 

[Zoidberg]

... I certainly wouldn't write in and complain as I can't see how the passenger would come over as a possible fare evader. Everyone else would see what was going on and know the RPI was clearly wrong.

I would, for the reasons set out in this post:

I agree with the OP with regards for complaining.

I'd certainly consider it in this scenario. Train staff are the face of the company, dealing with the public and must at all times be polite, pleasant, helpful, etc...

I think due to the fact that the RPI "slightly raised her voice" draws attention to the ticket holder, thus in turn causing potential embarrassment for this individual.

I dont want to travel on the train, minding my own business, for suddenly half the train to be staring at me wondering whats going on... would you?

I encountered a similar situation several, nay, many, years ago with a through ticket from my local station to Gatwick.

On having my ticket inspected on the Gatwick Express the wee boy inspecting tickets announced in a loud voice "this has been used before".

He made that statement on the basis of a manuscipt 'cancellation' on the ticket. It had been made by the VT chap - no idea why he did not use a proper stamp like the guy on the service to Wolverhampton had.

I told him, 'Yes, it has been used before. To get Wolverhampton. Then to get to Euston and now it's being used to get to Gatwick. What is the problem?" The response was a mumbled "ok then". Had I not been out of the country for the next few days I'd have complained about the matter - i.e. his handling of the situation - but I let it go.

Some people should simply not be permitted to deal with members of the public.

 

[Flamingo]

Some people are just too full of their own importance, if you ask me...

 

[johnb]

Blimey. A letter saying "TERRIBLE PERSON SACK HER NOW" would be a bad thing. A letter saying "look, this isn't OK, your staff member was perfectly pleasant but did accuse me of dodging when I had a valid annual, can you please explain to your staff what Oyster means rather than slating season ticket holders as dodgy thieves" would be completely legitimate.

 

[tony_mac]

I don't really see the value of a complaint - it was dealt with at the time by the other RPI, who may well have been there specifically to correct mistakes.

If I wrote a letter of complaint every time somebody didn't deal with me quite perfectly then I would never get anything else done... (and I have even been known to make mistakes myself!)

 

[Flamingo]

The vast majority of letters of complaint I have had have said "Terrible person, sack him now", on some occasions followed by letters from other passengers complementing me on how well I handled a difficult situation.

Invariably the person writing in has had either an invalid ticket, or was in 1st class for no good reason. On one occasion BTP were able to nick someone who has assaulted me after I had pointed out their ticket was invalid, as they had then decided to write in and complain.

Whilst acknowledging that not every member of staff in any industry is perfect, quite often the problems people encounter are due to a combination of factors, and the staff member in the customer-facing role has no power to alter the situation, or is applying the rules that the company apply to the situation. Quite often, the problem may be because of something the customer did themselves, or some combination of events totally outside the companies control, influence, or fault.

I'm of the opinion this knee-jerk "Something has happened that has upset the totally smooth flow of my life, I'm going to complain to a higher authority" attitude has more to do with unresolved childhood issues than a real desire to improve the experience for themselves at a later date or other users.

(Or to quote an Australian friend, "You'd whinge if your a*se was on fire and I p*ss*d on you to put it out").

But I'm now going to sit back and wait for all the usual brickbats about how I'm lucky to have a job, and I shouldn't be near decent people with my horrible attitude.

 

[michael769]

As BB21 says, she was probably on autopilot.

Or a new start being trained up!

 

[jon0844]

What else is left until new recruits get to go out and mix with the great unwashed?!

 

[Wath Yard]

Invariably the person writing in has had either an invalid ticket, or was in 1st class for no good reason. On one occasion BTP were able to nick someone who has assaulted me after I had pointed out their ticket was invalid, as they had then decided to write in and complain.

Whilst acknowledging that not every member of staff in any industry is perfect, quite often the problems people encounter are due to a combination of factors, and the staff member in the customer-facing role has no power to alter the situation, or is applying the rules that the company apply to the situation. Quite often, the problem may be because of something the customer did themselves, or some combination of events totally outside the companies control, influence, or fault.

Not a single one of these points appear to be applicable to the issue being discussed.

 

[aleph_0]

But I'm now going to sit back and wait for all the usual brickbats about how I'm lucky to have a job, and I shouldn't be near decent people with my horrible attitude.

I think the most extreme opinion on here in this case has been that writing in is a good idea because ToCs might realise that customers really don't like being accused of having an invalid ticket unless it's true. In this particular case, if for example, the person was a trainee, then the procedure should be for the trainee to make a statement that they need help from a colleague when coming across a suspect ticket. If writing in with this motivation causes the ToC to deal with customers better in the future, that must be a good thing? If I were the OP, I wouldn't be wanting any action against a particular member of staff.

I'm not sure what it's got to do with the price of eggs, but I'm quite sure that there are many passengers who write in to complain for bad reasons. I agree they are ****s. I'm sure you're great at your job - in fact, I travel with your company often enough, there's a good chance I've travelled on your train. When I witness a member of staff deal well with a difficult situation, especially if it seems to me the customer involved might try to complain, I write to the ToC praising how the staff dealt with it.

Some of your less courteous customers shouldn't be near decent people with their horrible attitude.

 

[Flamingo]

The point I'm most concerned with is why the OP considers this simple incident which caused him at best minimal inconvenience and was sorted out immediately by the more senior staff member, requires a letter of complaint? I'm trying to understand the mindset behind that way of thinking.

 

[Wath Yard]

Was it sorted out at the time though? A smile, and 'oh, sorry about that' would in my view end the matter. On the other hand, not apologising and just stomping off wouldn't.

Anyone can make mistakes but for someone who checks tickets for a living not being able to recognise one, and to effectively accuse an annual season ticket holder of being a fare dodger, is a little more than a minor mistake.

 

[jon0844]

Indeed, the incident was dealt with there and then by the other member of staff. As such, there's really sod all the TOC can do to change anything, if the guidance they give would be what happened anyway.

I wonder if some people just write in and complain to try and get some compensation for the extreme hardship? Despite the fact that most people around them didn't take much notice, least of all look down on the 'victim' and jump to any conclusions.

"I was made to look like a criminal. Now I'm too ashamed to leave my front door and will never become the CEO of Barclays Bank and enjoy a multi-million pound salary and perks... so I want to be compensated!"

As Flamingo has said in the past, some TOCs just dish out money/vouchers regardless - so it can be quite a lucrative thing to do.

 

[IanXC]

Was it sorted out at the time though? A smile, and 'oh, sorry about that' would in my view end the matter. On the other hand, not apologising and just stomping off wouldn't.

This. If an apology was given, in a similar voice to the earlier comment then that's that.

I'm continually amazed by the things people will complain about, the best ones are when the only way of avoiding the situation is having a crystal ball. We're all human, and we make mistakes from time to time, so long as they're dealt with appropriately then that should be then end of the matter.

 

[aleph_0]

The point I'm most concerned with is why the OP considers this simple incident which caused him at best minimal inconvenience and was sorted out immediately by the more senior staff member, requires a letter of complaint? I'm trying to understand the mindset behind that way of thinking.

Call me melodramatic, but if an RPI said my ticket was invalid, I would immediately be aware of the fact that the ToC could prosecute me under the bylaws because of this. I would (and in the past, have) find (found) this quite stressful, and it would be more than a minimal inconvenience to me. These accusations really shouldn't be made lightly.

 

[jon0844]

Was this paper ticket perhaps in a wallet, so it wasn't actually that obvious when trying to scan it?

I've seen RPIs use their wand on a ticket wallet and then, before the RPI has said anything, the passenger either says 'it's a paper ticket' (or similar) or the RPI actually opens the wallet to investigate further.

There might be a little bit more to the story!

I always held my wallet open for the RPI to see, but some people will hand it over. There's no exact science to how people present their tickets, and it varies on where you might be sitting/standing.

 

[island]

Blimey. A letter saying "TERRIBLE PERSON SACK HER NOW" would be a bad thing. A letter saying "look, this isn't OK, your staff member was perfectly pleasant but did accuse me of dodging when I had a valid annual, can you please explain to your staff what Oyster means rather than slating season ticket holders as dodgy thieves" would be completely legitimate.

Agreed. A bit of proportion is obviously warranted.